Just get into ACT and export a full detailed parse (not just the numbers but the stats and spells/abilities) to a webpage and host it and send me a link. I'll tell you what "you" are doing wrong. =P But really though, try to remember that everyone knows summoners are broken. But it's people like you who drastically over exagerate how much is broken that make it so the devs can't justify a fix to the ones who sign the budget. The fix for Necro and Conjy is very simple and would not take much work. But when people like you and many others drastically overstate and exagerate the issues, the devs who have to go over this stuff and take everything into account are swamped with garbage. And inevitabley that garbage stacks up in heaps on top of the actual problem so on paper they can never justify fixing it to the people who control the money. And that's how you get things changed. You absolutley must convince the executives (who have no interest in this game or its players whatsoever) that there is money to be made by fixing something and costing them money. Because everything costs money and it all has to be accounted for. Little food for thought there for ya... Oh and there's a difference between a fake parse and a merged parse with the garbage removed =P
Xil wrote: wow JUST WOW .. i can't begin to explain how lost you are. ok guy.. it's your time to shine super star! tell the necro community about this easy fix! go ahead and tell us how all we need is more dps! you fake parse posting ignoramus LMAO ... you don't read prior post of every necro asking for more dps? it has ben going on for about a year? AND NOTHING has ben done! so you go ahead and think you invented the wheel .. while you marinate in your delusion with your fabricated parses and 1 minute recast lifeburn ( easy button! it's how you like it!) remember that no matter how much smoke you blow up someone's rectum sooner or later they are going to figure out your full of it. PS. there is nothing in the whole necro world you could possible show me. what you're just now figuring out, im trying to forget
Davngr1 wrote: Maybe you could show me something of value? Necro and Conjy are missing Utility OR DPS. But the way to both is a lot less complicated than you and many others make it out to be. I've read hundreds of posts about how Necro and Conjy can't DPS and are worthless but we all know it's not entirely true. Necro specifically can and does sit in the top 3 on the raid parse regularly if supported by the raid(and well I won't lie here you gotta focus 3 classes at the necro regulary to make them shine). Instead of bringing Utility we require specific Utility to be worthwhile but I'm sure you already know that. Now consider the Utility we need to be successful and how much of a dramatic increase it makes in our DPS. We've all seen the posts on Flames showing the Necro sitting top of the parse on teir4+ Named. How do they do it if we are so completely broken? And how could we possibley make that consistant? The very simple solution is to lower the cooldowns on Undead Horde and Lifeburn, and change Undead Horde to a full horde without corpses(this was so stupid btw). But really that wouldn't quite be enough. Sure we'd be top 3 on the parse, but we'd still only bring DPS and top 3 isn't good enough for absolutley no utility. Soooo what you do is not only hack the cooldown timers down (by half I think would be about right) but you also give Necro and Conjy an AA (say bottom STR line cause this one's a complete joke) that gives a self cast version of POTM but summoner type. Maybe a LifeTap Proc for Necro and a Flametongue Proc for Conjy for both CA's and Spells (make it hit pets as well). Same duration same cooldown same damage proc as POTM. And add "When equipped AA blah is group wide" to the Mythical (raid wide would be rediculous). And poof Summoner DPS Fixed (top 3 at the very least probably #1 by a sizable amount buffed properly), DPS Utility added, Raid spot no longer wasted on a class that has only DPS to bring to the raid. Seems pretty simple to me. This would also add a bit more burst to the group DPS as well. Not too much but enough to bring Summoner back into a usefull DPS position even on trash without needing a troub in the group. But they really shouldn't be a burst DPS class they were never designed to be. We'd still need constant attention from the healer but when we get it we'd be far above cap we are currently at. Side Note: Conjy do have a bit of Raid Utility (not talking about COH either) and a bit more sustained DPS already so the increase should not be quite as dramatic as the Necro with this method so an adjustment to conjy cooldowns would probably not be warranted. But given that simple AA Conjy would also see a dramatic increase in properly played DPS potential. When you find a problem and bring it to a developer like SOE (that's so tight the tail pipe sounds like a dog whistle) you absolutley must present it as a solution and a CHEAP one. When you present it as a problem and offer no solution the developers have to gather up all your conserns and try to design a solution based on your exageration. And basically they see people asking over and over again to completely redesign the summoner archetype, and that my friend will never ever ever ever ever fricken happen. It would cost a fortune. Seriously just the cost of new spell animations would be outrageous. Think about the hours it would take, think about all the new scripting, tooltips, icons, animations, AA scripting. Would you spend that kind of money on one class out of 24 total in an MMO that is only just moderately successful? If it was your money in the giant piggy bank would you throw it away with no chance for a return on your investment? Maybe think of it this way... Would you spend $5000 dollars on one seat in a bus because one person out of 24 complained about it being uncomfortable just to make sure that 1 person keeps paying a dollar to ride each day? No I don't think you would. I think you'd offer them one of the other 24 seats and tell them that their favorite seat will be fixed when time will allow.
1)necro suck. 2) necro need a troub or illu to perform as well as sorcerer. 3) necro suck 4) chanty bring more to the group than a conj or a sorcerer. 5) necro suck 6) sorcerer bring real dps but not the chanty buffage. 7) necro suck 8) scout bring debuf transfert hate or buff. 9) necro suck 10) necro bring nothing and need other class to perform somewhat ok. end result necro are useless in group and raid. the class suck and is not desirable. on the beta board there wasnt even any necro left to complain about how much they are getting shafted like every other class.
Triste-Lune wrote: Line up Necro, Warlock, Conjy, Wizard, (all equally geared) Fury(no lucidity handed out) and Troubador in the mage group(no illusionist buffs for any of them). Tell them to push out as much DPS as possible on the next mob. See who walks away on the top of the parse with "real" DPS.
Here is my suggestion: Uninstall ACT and enjoy the game. or continue to beg the SOE developers for GOD mode so you can one shot kill everything in VP.
JmacF wrote: Until you play a necro and at least attempt to group or raid end game it's probably better to save these comments. Sure quite a few people with complaints are overly focused on ACT and parsing but.... the problem is really there. It's extremely difficult to get into a group or raid with a necro. And the reason is because end game content gets increasingly more scripted as you progress and the more scripted it gets the more specific you have to be with class choices on the raid to be successful. It's pretty well to the point where a raid of 24, 1 of each class, cannot complete content no matter how well every one of those players might know it. And this is a balance issue that needs to be fixed. A raid with 1 of each class in it should not fail in end game content if they are properly geared and versed for that content. But they do. And that really limits the ability of some classes to "enjoy" that content. Namely Necro, Conj, Ranger, and Bruiser. Although i believe bruiser finally got a worth while raid buff with the expansion and at least Ranger have consistant DPS when played correctly. Necro needs to be balanced or a large portion of the content will remain unavailible to the vast majority of people who choose to play them.
i do have a necromancer as my main and in a guild that has no focus on ACT. We go out and kill what we can when we can. If we can't clear VP then no problem we will loot another piece of armor and try again next week. i'd admit i'd love to see the dumbfire pets as true dot pets. And i'd love to see vampiric orb have a use. Other then that i see no reason to change the necro.
JmacF wrote: I don't really have a problem raiding either but most do. And given the oppertunity an Enchanter is a much better choice for the spot. The problem isn't so much that it's worthless to have a Necro in a group or raid it's that every other choice is much better. I mean even when you have a Mage slot open it's better to put an assasin in that spot than a Necro and something is just wrong with that.
Xil wrote: look man..your late to the party everyone all ready left. all the top summoenrs had a thread running up to 30+ pages asking for summoner dps to be up to par with prior dps peers and the thread was locked and erased. simple solutions where given and might i add better solutions then you useless easy button fixes(cos you suck). seriously.. i ROTF aT your lame duck make life burn castable every minute and undead horde too! give me two buttons i can press and win all parses with out doing anything!(exept stressing out my healers!) seriously dude.. you're a lost cause, the changes are on the way and im looking forward to them, matter of fact the only one still whining about the progression of the game that sadly left summoners looking for a new spot, is you. feel free to make another stupid post about non-sense and when i get the chance ill make fun of it
Lets keep the insults out of this thread please, it will do absoultely no good in getting what you want. Everyone has a different opinion and they are entitled to it. Keep to the forum rules ..... Dappy debating!
Xil wrote: Can I ask why you in your right mind would ever bother to consider asking this question? I mean of course common sense will tell you that the wiz/warlock will walk away WAY higher dps then the Nec/Conj. I'm not going to comment on the Fury/Troub as they are not mage class's. Basically to ever think and/or expect that a Nec/Conj SHOULD out parse a Wiz/Warlock is plain ludicris.. Wiz/Warlock are DESIGNED to be pure damage where as Nec/Conj have more utility capabilities then them. I'm sorry but to class everything down to parse issues is stupid imho. There are more things to this game then strictly saying "oh I suck I have no damage". You want damage go make a straight dps and don't play a summoner.
Davngr1 wrote: Who said anything about a minute. Half of 5 minutes is 2 minutes and 30 seconds and half of 15 minutes is 7 minutes and 30 seconds. Helped you with the math there. And no this is completely on par with all other classes. Necro is the only class in the game that does not have a temprorary boost to their own DPS. They need it and it needs to be consistantly usefull. And I'm not sure you know the difference between "simple" and "sounds simple" when it comes to game design. What I offered here is a perfectly simple and logical solution to the current Balance issues that does not require a major change to the archetype. What 99.9% of the rest of the population are asking for is a major change in the archetype and until people get it through their heads that it will never happen, necro, and summoners in general, will never get the balancing they need. Summoner needs actual Utility that increase their DPS as well as their pet's DPS, and through progression increase the DPS of those around them to be balanced with the other classes for raiding and grouping. AAAAANDDDD this suggestion would not overpower the necro in any way for soloing because the hate amount built for both the pet and the necro would be screwed towards the necro. And would require AA points that would probably be more effective elsewhere. So think past your random insults and try to turn your auto-troll off for a bit. Maybe just maybe this new comer to your world has a perspective on this picture you've been overlooking for a long time.
It's clear that there are a couple of people in this thread who can't play nice with each other. So the thread goes bye bye now and no more cookies! Sorry folks!
