Worried about future of EQ2

I also worry about this game. Only in the beginning did they do commercials. My friends keep forgetting there is even a game called eq2! Everyone know what WoW is because they are good with commercials... PLEASE SOE, it is still not too late. Everytime I introduce one of my friends to the game, they are amazed: "oh was there a great game like this? like a superior wow" they say..

RoXxer wrote:

Everquest 2 is a game produced by Sone Online Entertainment and is one of several active MMO's that SoE owns...they will not single out one game just to satisfy an already existing player base. Advertising and marketing this one single product costs a lot of money, so if any marketing is done by SoE, it'll be to promote ALL their products, not just the one. Blizzard has....just one MMO, therefore it is easier for them to advertise that ONE product.
They will advertise/market new product, just like any other company...however think about this: Since EQ2 is a divison of SoE, it has a set yearly budget, where do you think they would pool money from to advertise this single game? Thats right, from the budget alotted for this EQ2 division, which means it would cut into the budget to make a quality product for you to enjoy. Which means less content, less playability, more bugs, designs, and whatever else.
So which would you prefer? A more quality product that will give you years of enjoyment? Or more commercials with second rate actor's promoting a product with a lower budget for content that will give you merely days of enjoyment?

Warcrack is one game, so marketing for it is easy. SOE has been at it for longer I believe, so they have more games, and or titles they have to market for.. which could be a money drain for them. Especially when airtime on tv costs thousands of dollars, and radio isnt any cheaper.

Where I live, you cant go into a Best Buy or Circuit City and not find Evercrack boxes on the shelves, lots of them. And the dispaly items like those large cutouts of that ranger guy and whatnot. I think last time I was in there, there was a bunch of ROK boxes. With the wow stuff, I never see the shelves empty of their items... so its not that no ones buying them, its that they just always have tons of stuff.
Places like gamestop never order alot of the items until later because they are more like a mom&pop store, so they cant afford to buy 100 boxes of ROK just because.

back in the early days of video games, then again after the crash when Nintendo stepped up really good games managed to sell well just by Word of Mouth, and frankly in this day and age If I wanted to get people to buy my Online oriented game like Everquest would I advertise on tv...noooooooooooo... I'd have adds on websites and give online gaming sources previews. Go where your target audience is.

Wildmage wrote:

Exactly. If you were targeting me for your games, and went to the tv. Id never see them, unless they were posted on youtube, where I first saw those capt. kirk playing a shaman commercials for warcrack. I watch tv once a week on fridays - the scifi channel, unless theres something Ive been planning on watching. Like the Tin Man miniseries.

Rashaak wrote:

5 failed release's.All 5 dont even come close to WoW or even what EQ was.EQ is SOE's one bright star.I like EQ II a lot but i wouldnt say 300,000 to 400,000 player's is a lot.They are doing it smarter though.Adding all the expansion's to the new release's should help get some new blood and folk's that walked away.Hopefully they will finaly do away with Station Pass so you could play EQ,EQ II and some of the other ghost town game's.When one or the other start's getting old.Just like the poster i though it very wierd to see nothing on this expansion outside of SOE.

If you dont like something about the game complain.cause there are 100 more folk's that dont like the same thing and say nothing and just leave the game.The player's made EQ what it was.It failed cause SOE stopped listening and went for every short term cent they could get out of the player's.

Pipple wrote:

All current MMOs will steal from EQ1. They always will, because it was the first 3D mmo and set all current standards. No matter what happens from now on, most MMOs will have stolen from Sony more then they have stolen from other games

guru0z wrote:

Exactly. This game isn't even playable on full graphics on your "average" computer yet. They build these games for the future.

It's not the lack of a good computer that makes them stay, but them not wanting to give up what they've earned already. They don't want to lose the manhours they've put in

Rashaak wrote:

Ugh, take Marketing 101 before you start spewing this garbage. Half of advertisement is meant to attract current owners to now accessories or remind them that the brand name is still current in the market. The other half is to attract new buyers. When someone markets a product, the first objective is to get new people to buy, but the secondary objective is to get the current customers to remain loyal and to buy future products. SoE is just losing out on their market dominance by letting WoW take them over. Once Blizzard becomes the new standard SoE will be screwed into second place because they don't feel the need to retain current/recent customers and gain new ones. I'm sure there'll be an eq3, but I think SoE will have failed before eq4, they just dont care about the player base enough or care enough to get new players

this is just my opinion so dont berate me for it, just disagree if you feel I am wrong. But I feel WoW is aimed at a completely different demographic than EQ2 and actually needs to advertise on TV to gain new customers (since i believe the majority of people that play WoW are your average teen). Whereas I believe EQ" is aimed at a more mature audience, ones with brains, that can think for themselves and make decisions about a game based on their experience of it, rather than what they see on TV.

Personally I have played both WoW and EQ2, and right now i prefer to play EQ2, I find it much more immersive than WoW. In WoW i bounced from guild to guild all the time because they would end up disbanding. Also in EQ2 there's so much more to do than kill quests, sometimes i find myself just exploring zones and enjoying the scenery. Even though SOE destroyed my favourite MMO (SWG played from luanch upto CU/NGE), I find the players in EQ2 are more stable aswell, in WoW the turnover was huge, which is why I found myself bouncing fom guild to guild and never making any long term friends to group with. In EQ2 I believe you can find lasting friendships (if such a thing exists in an online world) and I believe its the people you play with that makes a game truely great.

I wouldn't worry about WOW. It is what it is--a phenomenon. No one else is coming anywhere near there numbers, and no one is likely to any time soon. It's like the hit movie that everyone went to see--it doesn't mean other movies are not making money simply because they don't make as much as the big one. EQ1 is still running, so clearly its audience is enough to make a profit with, or SOE would simply close it down. EQ2 may not be growing larger, but its numbers seem to be holding fairly steady. And I agree with the poster who said the WOW audience is different--I played a little WOW, and while a whole lot of people were logged in, the immature remarks that were constantly being made on chat were quite annoying and the opposite of immersive. Most of the folks I had the misfortune of grouping with were the kind of self-centered player who looted and dropped group before you could react and without a word of warning. That is not to say all the WOW players were like that by any means, just that there percentage seemed much higher than EQ2's. And if EQ2 is appealing to a more mature fan base, then of course it is going to have a smaller audience--younger people generally have more disposable income, so more can afford to play.
I don't think EQ2 is going anywhere anytime soon. Worries about the future of its gameplay might be another matter, I guess.

You know, Blizzard used Shatner and Mr T in their adverstising, why? Because they are practically internet memes of themselves. And kids will recognize them and go cool! capt kirk plays warcrack! And mr t too!

The one one-man-meme they failed to capitalize on, or perhaps they couldnt afford to... was: Chuck Norris.


I dont think eq2 needs such help. From my experience, it seems like people in the game are more mature than the random dimwit on warcrack.

Ganeden wrote:

lol
I don't need to take Marketing to have common business sense...
SoE is a business that has multiple products at its disposal versus Blizzards one product, so again...SoE will not advertise (i.e. T.V. commercials) just one product they are selling. It is not a financially sound decision for Sony marketing dept to advertise for just one game such as EQ2. It would need to advertise for all its MMO's plain and simple.
If they went to this type of advertising (T.V. commercials) it would not be cost efficient and cut into the budget of the products they are currently producing (i.e. EQ, EQ2, SWG) for its current player base. It doesn't take a marketing degree to understand that.
If you work for any business that deals in selling a product you have to take a look at what will be more costly for you as a company, because it not only effects the company profits, but its employees and customers as well. If you decrease budgeting for products currently being sold and in production to do an advertising campaign, you need to be prepared to eat the costs, because you may just end up not having quality products for your consumers.
From a business perspective, you have to figure out what will draw more of a profit. Is it getting new players? Or giving existing players more playability and an upgraded product?
Well, your existing players are generally the ones that (in this case) have a station account or montly subscription. Which means giving them continuous updated/improved game play is a priority because your customer is expecting that. A new player to the game, how do you draw them in? Its not by hiring some actor to talk about the game and make funny comments in a T.V. commercial, its by putting a product out that has a unique or possibly eye catching theme and having them buy a product they know will give them FULL access to the game.
EXAMPLE:
WoW
1) A player downloads the free trial or buys the 2.99 2 week free trial of WoW because he saw a commercial on T.V. and looked pretty cool
2) The player likes it, and buys WoW (29.99)
3) He decides he wants to play a Tauren (because thats what the **** had), well...he has to have Burning Crusade for that
4) Buys Burning Crusade (39.99)
5) After his 30 days free, he now has to pay a montly subscription (14.99)

In all...to get started with WoW...you dish out approx $85 dollars

Lets look at EQ2 now
1) A player downloads the free trial of EQ2 that he saw advertised on TTH or some other MMO site, maybe even got a buddy key, or a friend told 'em to try it
2) Player likes it, and buys Everquest 2
3) Everquest 2 is offering its All-In-One package with the new expansion RoK included (39.99)
4) Player gets 30 days free then pays a monthly subscription of (16.99)

In all...to get started playing EQ2...you dish out approx $55 dollars

Now...in a couple months WoW comes out with WotLK expansion (so add 39.99 to that $85)...only there second expansion in the 3 years they've been on the market. That tells me that WoW doesn't update their product nearly as much as EQ2 who is on their 4th expansion in 3 years. So what does all this mean? Blizzard rely's heavily on selling their initial product to draw a player in...those players come in, realize they have to now purchase addt'l product in order to continue playing. Some do it...some don't...
Why do you think a lot of players end up leaving WoW after a few months? Sure WoW has over 6 mil copies sold and boasts about it, because they need to. They have a product that is fun to play, but lacks in overall content and playability...so they have to rely on new players in order to keep themselves IN the market...
SoE puts more focus on existing players and markets through on-line sources by putting ad's up on those sites because that is where the majority of gamers are. Also...they pride themselves in consistently upgrading their current product, and have gone as far as giving free addt'l content with one massive expansion each year. Also...this is the second installment of a popular game known as Everquest which has over 10 expansions to its name, an upgraded graphics engine, and is still very much an active MMO, not to mention the Big Daddy of 3-D MMO's and the MMO that set the standard for the Modern MMO...
So...yah...EQ2 doesn't need to be marketed through television commercials (which is not the only way to advertise or market your product), however the name Everquest markets itself, because of its success, and through its 'fans', and by giving a good quality and consistent upgraded product it will still continue to hold its own against any upstart ...

On a side note...

I still remember when Vanguard was suppose to be the EQ/EQ2 killer...

...look at it now!!!

HA HA HA

Rashaak wrote:

Lack of marketing did not kill Vanguard. Poor management resulting in the launch of a haphazard and broken game killed Vanguard. Well, severely maimed it. It's on life support, but it's not dead...yet.

LordPazuzu wrote:

Thats not the point I was making...
however they did use the same marketing strategy SoE uses on its MMO's (word of mouth, fansites, and gamer magazines/websites)

oh...and....Vanguard is now owned by SoE

Yep, that was the Vanguard strategy from day one and I've never seen a game go from conception to launch surrounded by more blatant misinformation as that game.
SOE's advertising sucks hard. I don't know if it's due to lack of advertising budget, since big pappa Sony wants to put it's full advertising might behind the PS3 or what... But SOE needs to get boxes on the shelves and big freakin' cardboard standing displays in the stores at the very least. I remember when the original EQ first launched I saw this huge freakin' Firiona Vie standing display right outside EB Games in the mall. I don't see that for SOE games anymore.
Maybe if they port EQ2 over to the PS3 then Sony might care enough to advertise it.

I agree with many of the points Rashaak makes about SOE catering to the existing player. Look at EverQuest1, the game is like 9 years old and just recently had a good sized expansion that will last the current players at least a few months if not more! As long as a SOE game has players interested in it SOE seems to be happy to satisfy their desire for new content in order to keep them playing. However, when was the last time you saw a EQ1 advertisement? Yes, I think there are some adds scattered around the internet but I believe it is safe to assume that EQ1's cash flow does not come from new players.

WoW definitly gets new players, but it also keeps players. It is difficult to say weather EQ2 has more turnover then WoW. EQ2 definitly gets more ongoing content and additions then WoW but it is tough to say that the either companies is focused on one end of the playerbase more then the other. (Noobs vs the established players)

One posotive thing of releasing so many expansions is that each time EQ2 releases an expansion it gets a new boost of players in the arm. Each time one comes out a good amount of buzz happens and they always attract more players. WoW definitly doesn't have this sort of model, but perhaps with word-of-mouth they don't need it.

What is WoW spending all that cash on? I bet they just have a much smaller group of developers then SOE but that each team works just as hard as the other. Just one happens to be much larger so gets content out much faster.

Finally, I will say that both companies want each slice of the pie. They both want to draw in new players, and they both want to keep existing players. That is just obvious.

[edit] Oh, I ranted for so long I almost forgot! I would like to see a EQ2 vs WoW commercial in a vein similar to those Mac vs PC commercials. Wouldn't that be cool? I know it would never happen but I like the idea... perhaps an internet parody would do. ^^

Finora@Everfrost wrote:

Thanks for the info. I felt robbed when I watched the Rise of the Videogame a week or so ago and saw that it was just about the evolution of first person shooters.

I talked an R.L. friend who plays WOW avidly to try EQ2 out because it was so much fun. Some peeps were very unkind to him because of his "newb" status, and he went back to WOW. If you really want more people to play EQ2, be kind to the newbs. When it comes right down to if people are going to play this game or not, it's not shelf space that sells it, it's player experience, and word of mouth.
And lets face it, WOW is just irresistiby easy to make fun of. They beg for it.

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