Will you be buying the new Aerakyn race?

Discussion in 'General Gameplay Discussion' started by Loch, Aug 26, 2014.

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  1. Enric_of_Neriak Member

    I doubt it. If I remember correctly that promotion was done during a win-back program for past players. Because such programs usually gave cool rewards to people that had quit SOE decided to throw a thank you for staying all this time to vets at the same time.

    *standard disclaimer: I've been playing a long time and I may be remembering two separate events as one-in-the-same.
  2. Finora Well-Known Member


    Velious collector's edition included a gryphon mount you had to quest for, a prestige house (Everfrost summer home), tower of frozen shadow house item, and a set of appearance armor.

    Freeblood were part of the Winter Rewards promotion that also gave us a house painting of the original EQ Scars of Velious box art, the vanity pet wolf pup (white one that matches the mount that we got later), the coldain butler, the winter wolf mount and one other reward I can't remember which thing it was though, something that didn't stick out as much as the others so probably some potion or another that's still in my bank.

    The Winter Rewards promotion was for anyone who kept an active account between specified days over the winter. Basically if you subbed for December 2010 you got 2 rewards. If you subbed during January 2011 you got 2 more. If you subbed in February 2011 & bought Velious you got the mount and the freeblood race unlocked for your account.
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  3. Enric_of_Neriak Member

    That's right. Now that you say winter rewards I remember the promotion. It's also why I think I bought a Freeblood but can't remember paying for it.
  4. Dulcenia Well-Known Member

    SOE has experimented with various models of F2P. When I first rolled on Freeport back in May 2011 you not only had to pay to unlock certain classes and races, you had to pay to unlock bag slots.

    Now they have opened all of that up to the free players. I'm just glad I only unlocked a bag slot back then, even though I really wanted a necromancer. I wanted to check out the game more before deciding to buy one, so I waited.

    I see nothing wrong with offering optional races. It's not like that race will have an AoE death button (at least I HOPE it won't). It's purely fluff and cosmetics.
    Feldon likes this.
  5. Ahupu Well-Known Member

    Meh I have almost 2500 or so SC saved up and will have closer to 4k by expansion time so I foresee buying the Aerakyn. One point though if people wait for the xpac cost to go down, they will be waiting a long time. Though they apply our 10% discount to the purchase (at least according to the order screen) and the July promotion offered another discount, SoE NEVER lowers the price. Only the preorder cost is lower than the regular price....and well that is the point of another thread.
  6. xOcOx Member

    Couldn't agree more with what was said above. I came to EQ2 from PS2. I'm looking at this from the opposite side of what Aspekx is seeing from DP. PS2 is one of the best f2p with marketplace game models I've ever seen(or at least was like 8 months ago when I came here to try EQ2). The nickel & dime'ing that the player base puts up with here is crazy imo.

    Before anyone jumps down my throat saying I just want "moar free stuffs", I have ToV & a current all access membership. My EQ2 membership has been active since before they changed it to all access & it was just a EQ2 membership. EQ2 would never have gone f2p at all if they were not making more money this way than they were when it required a sub. It never would have made it past the single free server I understand they started testing f2p with.

    Imo the free player restrictions are still to strict & EQ2 is quite frankly pay2win & a huge money grab. There is a difference in just trying to make a profit & trying to squeeze every purchase possible from players & EQ2 is definitely moving toward the 2nd, if it isn't there already.
    aspekx likes this.
  7. Loch Well-Known Member

    I'm an all access member and am also disappointed at the extra cost for the new race. But as for the restrictions on free to play, they are so relaxed at this point, that I'm not sure what else there is left to give away. What exactly is strict? Free to play used to be limited to a handful of races and classes, couldn't use most of the dropped gear in the game, and many more restrictions that made the game nearly unplayable.

    You mentioned that you came to EQ2 recently, but there was a point not too long ago where paying members had next to no extra benefit for their money each month and many players flocked to free-to-play because of it.

    I'm also unsure what constitutes pay to win, because all I see in the marketplace is fluff and a few worthless potions. Paying to speed up spell research is ridiculously expensive and can be done without paying a dime. What items are you seeing?
  8. xOcOx Member

    I will go ahead & clarify my position since I did just throw it out with no explanation.

    The chat restrictions for free players are extreme imo. The "multiplayer" part of MMO barely exists for free players when they can hardly communicate with anyone who isn't standing right in front of them.

    Adept level spells are 75% of a master level spell. Assuming the same gear a paid player(unlocks or membership) is 25% more powerful than a free player.

    Double currency rewards mean paid players have access to anything requiring said currency 50% faster than a free player.

    Members can redeem 900 plat a month from loyalty tokens & sell items on the broker + get a flat 15% increase in coin loot from mobs. All combined this means a paying player can afford way more in game than a free player could hope for, assuming free players could even buy from the broker in the first place which they can't. Plus all that free money jacks up all the prices in game making many things even further out of reach for free players.

    I see people complain that membership isn't hardly worth anything & it just boggles me how they can think that way. A paying player is more powerful, has more money to spend & only has to do alternate currency grinding for half the time, those are huge benefits.

    Edit: My math skills are failing me atm. If an adept level spell is 75% of the value of a master does that make the master 25% more powerful or is that actually 33% more powerful? Either way that is a big power gap between free & paid.
  9. Loch Well-Known Member

    Well the chat thing is annoying, yes, though I believe they only ever restricted that to keep plat farmers out of chat. (At one point that was a big problem, but not anymore really.) I don't think it is needed anymore.

    The double currency reward and the members only plat bags were only added in the very recent past. Same with the extra 15% increase in coin loot. They were added to give value to membership because of the complaints that there was little left to benefit members.

    These last things aren't restrictions on free to play, they are benefits for paying members.
    aspekx likes this.
  10. Finora Well-Known Member

    Honestly, I agree with you about the chat restrictions and being able to buy from the broker. Those are things I've mentioned time and again despite it having little bearing on my personal play since all my accounts are all-access or the no longer purchasable silver.

    Doubling tokens? It's nice but it's just a minor perk for paying $120 -$180 year depending on how you sub. Sure it's nice, but it really isn't a make or break thing. Non-subscribers just have to put forth a bit more effort.

    Getting plat from the loyalty merchant? Why bother. Plat rains down just playing the game (though my view may be skewed being an old-timer who remembers when getting your first gold piece was a milestone). I know some people do, but I have yet to see a point in it.

    The bonus coin drops, that's a relatively recent addition to member benefits. We haven't even had that for a year yet. Yes, it eventually adds up, but so did the thousands of real dollars I've paid over the years to play. It's just virtual currency that is already easy to get no matter what your sub level is. Free money jacking up prices? I don't really think it's doing that much. Considering it's a fairly new mechanic and the fact that prices have been extremely high for somethings since they existed, I don't think it's had much effect. The ability to buy krono's and sell them making it 'legal' to buy plat with real money however probably did to some extent. I doubt that effected things more than the ability people had for a while to go farm old raid encounters for plat. The really expensive items tend to be really rare items, such as the Ethereals. Every time ethereal anything has been put in for a limited time the prices have been insane. Heck, the first year of the Chronoportals the droppable items from that were priced pretty dang high. And those and ethereals were happening before membership had a bonus to coin.

    Spells, prior to level 85 I doubt there are a lot of players other than ones who are taking it slow who bother to get masters that don't just fall into their laps. Experts maybe if they have rares laying around. It's not as if a free player couldn't gain access to them though. The spell unlockers are fairly cheap on the market. The only problem I personally see with it is the restrictions for buying from the broker. That makes it harder to get spells, though if you make friends you can always get them to buy them for you or if you make friends with a crafter (or become one yourself) you can get experts fairly easily. With unlockers you can get the 30 something spells one might actually want to upgrade for about 900 SC, which is $9 or less depending on how & when you buy your SC.

    One can absolutely raid as a free player without issue. You just have to find your masters in order to unlock them rather than being able to insta buy them (which costs a lot more) or research them. Everything else has no bearing on the ability of a player.

    What it all comes down to is why should someone who playing for free get exactly the same as the person who is paying $10-$15 a month to play? There has to be some compelling reason for people to pay an extra $10-15 a month. The 500 SC we were initially getting really wasn't going to be enough after nearly all the restrictions for F2P had been lifted.
    If they would have some mechanism for unlocking chat and unlock the broker for buying without broker credits (even if it was behind a fee) I think that would be enough to make playing free a good experience while still maintaining the value of a subscription.

    In anycase, didn't you say you came from PS2? Correct me if I am wrong but the last time I looked they had xp, resource & cert point bonuses for being a member as well as the marketplace discount (where a lot of stuff for the game is sold) and the 500SC a month. In a game like PS2, those are pretty equivalent to the gold bonuses in Eq2.
  11. Arieste Well-Known Member

    i've had a full access sub to EQ2 for 10 years. In the past 3 of those years, i haven't paid a penny of RL money other than for the yearly expacs. I have had constant access to every single aspect of the game - all features, classes, races, content and items the moment they became available, with the only exceptions being fluff stuff available in the SC shop or SC shop consummables.

    That's a pretty damn good deal.

    EQ2 is a sub-based game. So yes, technically that makes it "pay to win", just like any other game where you have to pay a sub to get the full game.

    Taht being said, EQ2 is a game where a player can EASILY earn their sub (or membership w/e) in-game and reap its full benefits. In other words, you NEVER have to pay except for expansions. But yes, again, "technically", if you don't buy the expac, you won't get the top level, or the most powerful new stuff, so you will not "win".

    Call it what you like. Either way, it's one of the best deals on the market.
  12. xOcOx Member

    Basically yes they are the PS2 equivalent. None of those are direct power upgrades like the difference between adept & master spells, just time deductions like double currency versus standard rate. Note though that I said imo membership is a good deal.

    I'm afraid my comment derailed the thread a bit & I apologize. The point was players are already buying expansions when they release & paying subs & buying SC fluff like prestige homes & the like. At what point are enough different charges enough?
  13. Arieste Well-Known Member

    At whatever point the player chooses.

    I buy expacs. I earn my sub in game. My sub gives me the SC to buy 6000sc/yr worth of fluff. Total $ purchases per year - just expac. And people who want extra fluff can pay for it, while rest of us get what we need.
    Finora likes this.
  14. xOcOx Member


    Maybe I'm just to old and set in my old school "pay your sub & buy the expac = full access" ways. :(
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  15. Finora Well-Known Member

    Been paying subs to play for 15 years myself. Long enough I remember $9.95 a month and $25-29.99 expansions. :) I also remember when All-access cost $30 a month though and I remember the Everquest Legend premium server as well ($40 a month for extra benefits on top of what a normal sub on a normal server would get).

    I don't personally have a problem with them adding fluff (which is what a new race is really) for extra SC. It's fluff. I don't NEED a new race to be an effective player. It's just like appearance gear. The three new races they added post -Froglok were indeed part of expansions. But they all were also part of expansions that added content for lower levels, not just high level content. The races themselves played a part in the lore of the expansion. If Aerakyn were added as part of the expansion, you can bet your buttons that there would be people complaining about how they had to buy a high level expansion for $40-$80 to play the new race (as some did when channelers were added as part of the TOV expansion) and others would be complaining about how Aerakyn should have been given with TOV because they had nothing to do with the lore of the new expansion, etc etc etc.

    One still can get all one NEEDS to play by paying your sub and buying your expansions. A new race might be cool, but is absolutely not needed. Heck, I got Freebloods for free and didn't bother race changing anyone to them. I made one, but if I'd never gotten them for free, I wouldn't have missed it. I would have just made that class a different race and moved on. If this were one of those games where you have a very limited number of races, I could see getting upset about it. However, since we already have 20 races to choose from (19 if you didn't earn/buy Freeblood), I don't see this as much of an issue.

    I'm frankly surprised they added a new race at all, though if they bring some Norrathian version of Raki or Vulmane with tails please... I might have to bite *hint hint to the devs ;) *
  16. ShaggyBodom Well-Known Member

    I think that is pretty much how I am still set. Been playing MMOs since '99 and I prefer the old ways with no marketplace. Just pay sub, get everything. Buy expansion, get everything. Simple as that. Sadly those days are nearing an end with any new MMO coming out.
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  17. Arieste Well-Known Member

    I've been playing since the "sub-only" days myself, but really, I think if you look at it the right way....in EQ2 if you pay your sub.. and you buy expac, you DO get just about everything. By giving you 6000 SC per year.. they're basically giving you a bunny mount and a special house and the extra race (if you want those).

    It's only the people that don't pay the sub (or earn the sub) or that want an excessive amount of stuff (who needs more than 1 house anyway?) that need to pay.

    If i think back to 15 years ago and paying a sub for AO, yes, i got a house. But it was only one house. And only one kind of house. There were not 50 additional types of more interesting and more elaborate houses. You had one.

    And i got a mount. And yes, there were a couple of choices, but there were no flying cows and bunnies and dinosaurs and ducks added to the game every couple of months.

    And yes, I got all 4 of the races that were available.

    I don't think any game out there (except maybe EQ1) comes anywhere CLOSE to EQ2 in the amount of stuff that is added to the game every single year. No other game even has major yearly expac, forget all the other free content and SC content. They find ways to pay for it by "milking the whales". Great, better than whales than me :)

    And hey, if they ever make an apperance ranged weapon that's worth a darn, i'll pay SC for it. And if they ever add a proper dragon mount, i'll buy that too.

    It's a brave new world! (but the old one's still in there!)
  18. ShaggyBodom Well-Known Member

    That's the keyword in your first paragraph, "just about everything" :p I don't like having to pay extra for a race that should be included in the expansion like it always has been. That's just my biggest beef right now. I know its a pretty small issue, but when you get excited for something just to be let down, it sucks.

    I know the Marketplace has some good stuff, but I just ain't interested in it. The only thing I purchase from the Marketplace with my free 500 points a month is the AA potion because I am extremely lazy when it comes to leveling up AAs. I don't like the grind, I just want to quest and not be held back by that once I hit 90 if I don't have the 280 required points. Will I pay above and beyond my sub fee for the potion? No.

    EQ1 and 2 definitely has loads of content, I can't argue that at all. This game is one of the best f2p games on the market in this present time.
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  19. aspekx Well-Known Member

    i think Finora's point about 'need' is an interesting one to raise. the reason being that this is a game. technically, none of it is needed. we can all get by with less of lots of things in our lives. but when addressing entertainment, pleasure, luxury i am not sure that we can honestly refer to something as needed or not.

    please do not take this as pedantic or nitpicking. it's a real question about the core of what makes something pleasurable or entertaining. i can go to the movies and never spend a dime on anything but the ticket. (in fact i do for various reasons.) but there are certain elements that are so blended in with the cultural experience americans have of 'going to the movies' that one would not be out of place in saying that removing them in some way mars the experience.

    going to the movies isn't just about what's being projected on the screen. and i would argue that most pleasures that we experience aren't about the mechanical, literal aspects of the experience. instead there is a definite whole that is the experience, the literal parts of it simply serve as a core or skeleton on which we build these pleasures and entertainments.

    technically, you don't need anything except the ability to login, complete quests, group, and level in order to have the fundamental experience of an mmo. but i think we can all agree that's simply not enough. and that it's certainly not what pulled us into the genre to begin with, nor what keeps us hanging around. for instance, most seemed to agree with xOcOx that communication restrictions were a bit much now that the dust has settled.

    the reason for that is communication is foundational to relationship building. but mmo's are changing. it's one of the great ironies of Guild Wars 2 that in allowing everyone to join in on a fight and get credit for it they decreased social interaction instead of increasing it. no one had to talk anymore. no one had to ask if they could get in on that named for the quest or whether there was a group forming to take on the attack at the farm.

    what's happening, with payment models at least, is an attempt to redefine what pleasure and entertainment in mmo's consists of and, in keeping with Finora's point, what is needful. Finora could well be right in all points. at this point i don't think that way, but we shall see.

    to be clear, this is not a conspiracy. i don't believe the Smed sits in a tower on a dark throne coming up with ways to 'get us'. and i doubt anyone thinks this much about games on a social and cultural level. (i'm weird, it's okay.) but i don't think that keeps cultural trends from happening. in fact they happen often because we allow them to do so without much thought. sometimes that's for our betterment, sometimes not, most of the time i would say it's not either, it's just change. maybe that's what this is, at this point though i don't think it's for our overall benefit.
  20. Striinger Member

    What's happening with Landmark is SOE taking a page from other development shops; it's undoubtedly a money grab to pay for development. I can't recall how many times development has been flushed (and how much $$$) to develop EQN. It's a good thing for SOE as a whole that Landmark is paying for EQN development. If it hadn't gone that way, there's a good chance Sony (parent) would have stopped SOE from moving forward with EQN (or at least making them do it with a compromised result or reduced workforce).

    From an EQ2 perspective, it also means less money is being sucked away from EQ2 revenue to pay for EQN development. If anything, I can see EQ2 trying to increase the value for each dollar spent with them...but the Sony masters have obviously drawn a line that Holly will have to master tap dancing around (or maybe a some Lambada?) going forward.
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