Why the implementation of the "burnt key" is terrible

For me, Everquest 2 is about challenge and progression. I love delving into dungeons with friends, fighting through hordes of monsters, killing tough bosses, and walking out with gear that is better than what I had before. When I see an awesome piece of gear linked in general chat, my first thought is, "Awesome! What do I have to do to earn that?" The best items in the game should be a reward for hard work, teamwork, and time invested.

And so we come to the "burnt key". If you're not up to speed on what the burnt key is or how it works, I'll explain briefly. This key gives you access to a special, solo zone. The rewards for this solo zone are very, very good. Hundreds of thousands of plat, and some of the best items in the game, including a bracer that has an orange adornment slot (with a chance there's an orange adornment already inside) and ungodly stats.

But before you get too excited, here's how you get a burnt key. Are you ready? Blind, stupid luck. Only the devs know exactly how the key is triggered, but I've spoken to several people who have acquired keys or have friends who have. One guy was "flying around slaver's point" ... bam, zone-wide message pops up and he has a burnt key in his bags. Didn't even know what it was for when I sent him a tell about it. He was level one ascension and still working on the KA sig line. Another guy got one while killing ghosts outside Dalnir's Crypt. One guy was clicking crystals out in the garden's of Nye'Caelona for a timed quest when he got his. Yet another was flying over a lava pool on his way to turn in a quest. There are others, but the only thing these folks had in common is they happened to be in Obulus Frontier at the right time.

Why is this bad? Two reasons. First, it takes control away from the player. It doesn't matter how many difficult quests you do, how many tough monsters you kill, how much blood sweat and tears you invest. You cannot earn this key, you can only get lucky.

Second, it tarnishes the eq2 experience. Contrast the rewards from the burnt key with something similar in power and quality, like the new epic weapons. When I see someone with their epic, I know what they went through... the faction grind, the hunt for shinies, the heroic zones and bosses they went through. I know it wasn't handed to them. I know they worked for it. Respect. When I look at my own epic weapon, there's a sense of pride knowing that I overcame a long series of obstacles to get it. None of that exists with the loot from the burnt key. It becomes, "Wow, amazing piece of gear! What a lucky s.o.b."


In summary, best-in-slot rewards that have a direct impact on the game should always be challenging to get. If the burnt key offered up cosmetic rewards, like a new emote, a unique pet, or a cool house item, I'd have no problem with it. Alternatively, if the burnt key was earned by killing difficult boss mobs, or required you to do something like 1000 timed quests, I would have no problem with it because the reward would be in-line with the challenge, and we as players would have control. We could choose to tackle the challenge or not. As it stands now, if we want a burnt key, our only option is to float around in Obulus and pray to the RNG gods, and that's neither fun nor challenging.

Respectfully,
Krumble ~ Maj'Dul

so Duck Portal 2.0

Not even if its true that the key is just luck. The Duck Portal you can get by killing the mob its attached to so while the mob is random getting it can be done by working at it every 12hrs. If the burnt key is just randomly assigned to someone in zone then we are screwed.

I'm waiting a bit on this to see how it actually works with some more sample data but its not looking good for those of us who have crap RNG results.

I'm also trying to hold off judgment until we get a better idea of the trigger, but my first reaction is a heavy sigh. One reason I pick EQ2 over some of the other games out there is that with some effort, research, and time, I'm able to work towards a specific goal. Want that awesome weapon? Aim for it, do the quests, do the instances, kill the bosses.

But pure RNG just makes me tired. And frustrated. And feel punished for doing things in a different zone or instance. I was never lucky enough to get the duck portal, even with hours spent killing things and setting alarms and timers, and I'm not holding my breath for this one, since it seems to be RNG on top of RNG (get the key, then find the NPC to get the quest, then find the portal).

One thing I sincerely hope the devs did is to apply some logic to the granting of the burnt keys. Try to spread them around, perhaps limit them to one per account or one per toon (especially if they are introducing hundreds of thousands of plat back into the economy with each one). Make sure people feel they actually have a chance at getting one.

But yeah. After an awesome start to KA and me loving the expansion and playing a ton more, the idea of more pure RNG "you've just got to be lucky" best-in-slot gear just makes me feel deflated. Crossing fingers it's not as random as it currently seems right now.

I agree that it is bad. I despised the duck portal as well. A person in my old guild had the duck portal drop. This person was not a subscriber and could not even equip the reward. So because it was random, someone that it barely benefited won it over someone who could have actually used it.

I'm not sure if the forearms from the burnt place are prestige.

Anyway, it doesn't really bother me, but if there is something awesome to get, I like having actual pathways to get it, not just random 'be at such and such place and hope someone who has no ability or need to use the things doesn't get it over you.'

Also, things on timers, like the duck portal, greatly favor those with more time on their hands than many of us. I have about 2 hours per day of the week that I can play. And that's if the wife aggro isn't on high alert. So, if the timer for this thing is during that time, am I now going to have to say 'sorry guildies! there is a super tiny chance that a burnt key may fall in my bag if I go run key quests. Can't help you get your epic. Need to get that burnt key!'

Ug. It's kind of cool to have a random amazing special thing. I'm just not a fan of duck portal type stuff. It takes away from the idea of putting in effort to progress, which is pretty much what this game is all about.

Sorry DEVS but I have to agree that the new burnt key zone is a complete joke. If you wanted to make the burnt key zone full of plate im cool with that if you want to put some cool *** appearance gear there im cool with that as well and if you wanted to put some decent gear in there im ok with that but putting BIS gear in a zone that takes 0 effort expect being in the right place at the right time really really sucks. I want the challenge that's why I play this game. I want to fight horrific mobs for loot I want to take time and gear my toon my way repsec my way and adorn my way but I want to earn my loot and having BIS for some random alt that will never get played because he got lucky and was in the right place at the right time on some RNG is in all honesty BS.

I have always praised the job you DEVS do, there are always some tweaks and what nots that need to be done nothing is perfect but this burnt key is just a joke.

As with all my post about something that needs to be changed I will always offer up a solution so hear it is. If you plan to keep the burnt key in the game atleast make another way of getting one through hard work. Maybe have it drop off a weekly mission crate or a reward form a final boss, give the players that want to gear there toon the best they can a way of earning it please.

I do not see reason for all this cry...
Why no one complaining about Charm and Sword from PQ?
Why no one complaining about 1k Pot charm with rising tides from SOLO zone (as ultra rare drop)
Why no one complains that reward for second grade quality of keys (inca) is MYTHICAL BiS gloves/shoulders

Because you have some control over those things. You work on them and have a chance. Getting the key seems to be totally and completely random.. just being in OF (perhaps even just OF1) doing 'anything' at the right magic and unknown time.

RNG reward for a task is something you can keep working at. You know what you have to do to keep trying. RNG is a factor, but the player still has enough control to TRY for the item.

With the information we (don't) have about the burnt keys, people can't even 'give it a try' to get the keys.
The duck portals were better because it was 'kill things in Thal withing a certain window after the last duck portal'. People could 'do things' to trigger the RNG.

Good question. Here's my answer. If I want a charm / sword, I take a few minutes and run PQs when they are up. If I want a 1k charm, I run zones (there are several places to get a 1k pot charm, and it doesn't have to have rising tide on it since you can click RT on a lesser charm and swap in your 1k charm pre-fight) If I want the mythical armor (good stuff, but not necessarily best in slot due to relic tag), I run key quests. Everything you mentioned is reasonably attainable with some effort. The burnt key is different. If I want to get one of those, I have to fly around OF and hope I get lucky. And I'm not crying. I laid out a thoughtful post with reasons why this is bad game design and offered potential solutions. If you think it's fine the way it is, you are entitled to your opinion. We'll just agree to disagree.

because I can go try for those right now in ways that are somewhat entertaining. If I knew for sure that the burnt key was ALWAYS available as a random chance for doing stuff in OF, I would not care as much. At least then I would know that doing my 1 or 2 key quests that I typically do every day would have a chance to get me something totally amazing. If it's something completely random that happens on a timer and only happens once per that timer, then I'm back to being annoyed. Still, though. Only slightly.

This is not completely truth
We know so far you HAVE to be on the key quest so burnt key IS same as a duck portal the only difference during "duck time" you have to mindlessly slaughter at precise time gazillion of mobs in TOT (btw screwing those who on the quest line) with ABSOLUTELY random chance to get portal while here you have to do at least something NOT disrupting to others (keys quest) and something useful that you would do anyway otherwise (should you have spare time)

Nope - you have to do key quest - over over and over again that's all you need

People have already provided examples of people NOT on a key quest who have received burnt key.

It been confirmed that you have to be on the step
a) killing ghosts for abused goblin quests (step 1)
b) knocking down Iskar raiders on dead elf quest (step 3)
c) returning with magma bug (for bugbear lost son quest) (step 3)

DoomDrake, you are misinformed. I have personally talked to two people who received the burnt key while NOT doing a key quest. It can happen while on a key quest, yes, but that's not the trigger.

Even better - I never liked 12 hours time for Duck portal now many have random chance for jack pot

I hope you are right, DoomDrake...do you have a source from Daybreak that has confirmed this? Right now, we only have anecdotal evidence which also includes people who have simply been flying around the zone, or had switched to another toon and came back to one that had the burnt key, or who simply zoned into Obulus and were offered the key. There is also doubt as to when the key is offered. Is it a chance *any time*, or is it once again tied to specific intervals? Time will tell as more information is gathered, but with the hazy information right now, it feels very random.

If you have a verified source, that would go a long way towards filling in missing details.

To extend,
I know 2 ppl who were "just flying" over zone it turns out both persons were knocking off sokar raiders at the time. Timer of event is different story I truly hope that is RANDOM and not stupid 12 hour's clock like it was with Duck portal

Ok, let me try this one more time. On two different occasions I was in OF and saw the zone-wide message that someone had just gotten a key. I immediately sent these people a tell and asked them questions in an attempt to get some insight on the trigger. Unless both these people straight up lied to me, they were NOT doing key quests when they got the key. That was one of the first questions I asked. Yes, some people have gotten burnt keys while doing key quests, but, assuming the people I talked to told me the truth, there is not a direct correlation.

Have you checked if those ppl were at least on "some" quest? from what I read from other sources ppl were at very least doing some quests like PQ/Signature etc.