What's this all about? (bow changes)

Discussion in 'Ranger' started by ARCHIVED-Neiloch, Aug 16, 2010.

  1. ARCHIVED-Xelgad Guest

    As an update, the ranged weapons and two-handed weapon rating increase should be coming to test later today or early next week.
    Flurry and AE Auto-Attack to ranged and offhanded weapons will be coming to test shortly but a little bit later, hopefully next week.
  2. ARCHIVED-jjlo69 Guest

    Xelgad wrote:
    is the 20% dmg pentality gonna get removed as well when the rating increase goes in or is that gonna happen with the ae/flurry change ????

    UNcle
  3. ARCHIVED-Xelgad Guest

    The ranged penalty will be with this change. The Flurry and AE Auto-Attack changes will go later, and then everything should go to live servers at the same time.
  4. ARCHIVED-jjlo69 Guest

    Xelgad wrote:
    thanx for the fast reply

    Uncle
  5. ARCHIVED-Boise Guest

    Xelgad wrote:
    Nice.
    Any chance you can confirm that Test will get the first part of the updates tonight? I have no clue when Test gets updated.
  6. ARCHIVED-Xelgad Guest

    Should be posted in the Test Update notes when it's updated.
  7. ARCHIVED-Writer Cal Guest

    Xelgad wrote:
    Thanks for the update, Xelgad. Looking forward to checking it all out, hopefully sooner rather than later. /nods
  8. ARCHIVED-Corwinus Guest

    Xelgad wrote:
    Thank you for the update Xelgad, I am eager to test those changes and make an accurate comparison with live.
    (Nota for testers: on test sever, after the wipe, Knight of Kithicor managed to get a GH with training dummy amenities)
    Cor
  9. ARCHIVED-nocks Guest

    Thanks Xelgad for finally posting in the ranger forums. The mechanics change is a fix across the board and not specifically a ranger "fix" although I can see how we could stand to benefit the most from it. As for Ranged Flurry and AE auto THANK YOU for making that happen for us it is appreciated. Although IMO we should have had this from the beginning. I've yet to read a post from a dev that explained why we were excluded from getting it in the first place.
    While these changes are all well and good it still begs the question "Does Xelgad STILL think we're a mighty force?". Xelgad you asked for the high end raid parses on Rathgar yet I have not seen you comment on what you gleaned from that data. Of course I'm most interested in what you saw in regard to rangers.
    You have never commented on our utility or "lack thereof". What is your opinion of our current utility? Personally I think this is a large part of our DPS/grouping woes. What do we offer in the way of utility? 24.8% increase in accuracy AND increased Slashing, Piercing, and Crushing of 126.7 for 20 seconds... I'm not even going to mention the useless hawk. As stated numerous times in this forum these things are INVISIBLE to a raid. No one notices a significant increase in their DPS due to this and it certainly does not help us in regard to group placement.
    I've seen a few of you rangers posting comments along the lines of "we'll see how this change works out for us and if it doesn't close the gap for us then maybe we'll see future tweaks to our CA's to make up the difference" I've seen nothing from Xelgad or anyone else that said anything about this fix being the "first step" towards anything. As stated above I have yet to hear any dev say we are lacking in the area of DPS. Are there plans to increase ranger dps beyond what these changes may give us? Is there some magical number (percentage) of increase you're looking to give us? Heck just a simple "Yea or Nay" on whether or not, in your opinion, we need any help beyond what's being given here would be nice to know.
    Xelgad a few words from you on the above mentioned items would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
  10. ARCHIVED-Corwinus Guest

    I started to put some data in a thread call Bow changes in Testing.
    So far On the same epic mob (12,360,000 hp), using the same char, AAs, equipment, buffs, bow (Wyrm Tendon), arrows (field point):
    On Live Crush did 7,143,439 dmg (4700dps), On Test, Crush did 7,857,040 dmg (6236 dps), so increase of dps for crush was like 25%. Now if you take the overall Auto attack including poisons, procs, ... on Live dps was 8124 and on test it was 9810 so the increase of dps on Auto attack only would be 17%. it gets even more diluted I think when we add our CAs which represent at least 2/3 of our overall dps (if not 3/4).
    Hope that helps.
    Cor
  11. ARCHIVED-FearDiadh Guest

    So at the higher end of raiding, assassins are outparsing rangers by ~20%...
    In order to fix this we are going to get a roughly 25% increase to 20% of our dps. That means that we will see a 5% increase to our overall dps, but in order to offset this you are giving assassins flurry and aoe auto on their offhand weapon?
    Who wants to bet that will give assassins more than a 5% increase?
  12. ARCHIVED-Neiloch Guest

    Jack@Lucan DLere wrote:
    Again, this isn't meant to fix ALL our DPS problems. This is NOT a 'end all be all' solution to ranger DPS. No ever said it was, and clearly comes up short to solve our problems, so I am repeatedly confused why people act as if it is the holy grail to fixing ranger DPS.
    You have to look at it purely in terms of auto attack for us and other classes. These changes on test and upcoming additions to flurry and ae auto are meant to better even out auto attack DPS and auto attack mechanics across classes that rely on auto attack.
    So its not surprising this won't fix all all DPS woes, because its not supposed to. Now if after these changes you have classes doing insanely better auto attack DPS than others, then we have a problem.
    Beat up a bunch of heroic dummies today:
    Live Merged
    EXT DPS TYPE AVERAGE MIN HIT MAX HIT TO HIT % CRIT %
    5,889.41 crush 13,728.95 7,364 25,503 100.00 100%
    Test Merged
    EXT DPS TYPE AVERAGE MIN HIT MAX HIT TO HIT % CRIT %
    8,150.47 crush 18,768.80 9,531 33,784 100.00 100%
  13. ARCHIVED-Albatroz Guest

    Ranger CA base dmg needs to be brought in line with their Assassin counterpart aswell
    I got a Ranger alt in all t3 SF raid amor except the bp and quite a bunch of nice jewelery , so im sittin at like 85 CB dont know how much potency atm
    but that doesnt matter anyways , a guildie of mine got a similar geared Assassin alt and his parses are still about 25-30% off when we you take auto attack dps out of the equation , theyre ahead there aswell but by smaller amount

    I for sure not askin here for increasing melee combat Arts but the Ranged CAs need a significant increase in base dmg by at least 20-30% , when I compare Sniper Shot to Assassinate and see it doing double the dmg then theres something terribly wrong with that

    CAST timers need to be looked into , Hidden Shot for example got a 2,11 sec cast time for me for about 50k dmg when it crits i dont even consider the Reuse here but its not exactly great in order to keep the cast time it needs to do triple the amount of dmg it currently does
    Arrow Barrages Recast need to be brought down along with Stream of Arrows and Storm of Arrows
    Coverage just remove already those stupid restrictions to this spell , you cast it next CA gains 32% in damage I dont know why it has to be such a hassle with it , the skill is by a mile weaker than Fatal Follow up
    I do understand that Assassin CAs need to be more potent as they cant do the majority of their DPS by stayin 30m away from the mob but in comparison and considering this fact Ranged CAs are way too weak still
  14. ARCHIVED-Sydares Guest

    Coverage, even on servers with 0 lag is taking 2-5 seconds to register its user as being stealthed. It's a finicky piece of garbage that really needs to be removed.
  15. ARCHIVED-Neiloch Guest

    Yeah the check to see if we did a qualifying attack before it is horrible on Coverage. All i use it for is trying to get high hit sniper shots for kicks.
  16. ARCHIVED-Ballzz Guest

    Coverage is a huge POS. I *hate* that ability. It's such a PITA to use and so laggy it's ridiculous. I even macro'd it to Rear Shot which helped a little but like Neiloch said..it takes so damn long to do that qualifying check that half the time I think it didn't work and I interrupt it with a CA because it's counter productive to sit there waiting for it to work. They should just change that ability to a new Ranged ability that only becomes available after a positional attack or something.
  17. ARCHIVED-Neiloch Guest

    Beat up some Epic dummies:
    Live
    EXT DPS TYPE DAMAGE AVERAGE MIN HIT MAX HIT
    6,181.06 crush 7,590,335 14,853.88 7,364 25,968

    Test
    EXT DPS TYPE DAMAGE AVERAGE MIN HIT MAX HIT
    8,039.74 crush 8,192,490 19,552.48 9,584 34,061

    If you don't feel like doing the math this is a increase of 30.07%
  18. ARCHIVED-Geothe Guest

    Neiloch@Kithicor wrote:
    Which is exactly what should be seen on test at this point with the removal of the 20% damage penalty along with a 10% increase on top of that.
  19. ARCHIVED-Neiloch Guest

    Geothe wrote:
    It certainly is. So 'confirmed' I guess heh. Now we wait ong ae auto and flurry, hopefully next week.
  20. ARCHIVED-Osp Guest

    Jack@Lucan DLere wrote:
    The bow fix is going to bring the AUTO ATTACK portion of that 20% - 30% parse closer, by about 2-4k. What we will be gaining is about 2k-4k AUTO ATTACK ext dps only,depending on the fight and the +mod differances (which really should be simiular @ high end).
    They will see imo a higher than 5% increase to their Auto Attack dps with the off hand getting flurry,procs,ae, etc. But it is supposed to equal out with us getting the same on our bows. And in the end we should be near the same auto attack dps.
    What we are NOT getting is a +20% increase to overall dps, which is what a very large % of players are talking about in chat,tells, forums. This is ONLY effecting the AUTO ATTACK portion of EVERYONES parse. We Rangers should see a slightly higher total dps increase, just because we use bows exclusivly. And by slightly I mean 2k - 4k with the numbers that are being posted on the parse threads.

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