It isn't really about Lucan actually. Its more about the nature of Mystics and Defilers. Mystics encourage spirits to get along in harmony with each other and the living. They get sprits to be more helpful. They weaken and bind hostile spirits. They try to make spirits more noble. They foster communities of spirits working towards a common goal. Defilers encourage spirits to be more selfish. They encourage them to be more destructive. They enslave weak spirits, both as servants and as bargaining chips to trade with more powerful spirits. They attempt to corrupt spirits so they can more easily manipulate them and eventually gain control over those spirits as well. Nothing would bring more pride to a Defiler than being able to claim they corrupted a True Spirit and made it their servant. So how do you get them to live together? It would end up in a spiritual celandine war. Or an open war. They are as diametrically opposed as paladins and SK. Maybe more actually.
Hmmm, that's very interesting. So the Good / Evil divisions are less entirely about the cultures they live in, and more about rivalries between the classes. So it's kind of like this: Guardian / Zerker: They're just soldiers, they don't have ideological differences, just style differences. Monk / Bruiser: Probably, neither respects the other... Monks look down on the Bruiser's lack of discipline, and the Bruiser sees the Monk as a snobbish pansy. But neither one cares enough to actually fight about it, they just do their own thing. Wizard / Warlock: Both are too busy delving into the secrets of the arcane in their chosen area of study to really care at all what the other is doing. Illusionist / Coercer: Again, they're just different schools of focus. Neither particularly cares what the other one is focusing on, aside from personal moral differences, but those are per-individual and not representative of the art as a whole. Templar / Inquisitor: They're both fanatics, they just go about it in different ways. They might disapprove of each other's methods (too passive / too aggressive), but at the end of the day they probably see each other as mutually-aligned for the same cause. Warden / Fury: They're both Druids and they both focus on doing Druid-y things for Druid-y reasons and the Druid-y greater good of allowing bears the noble freedom to poop wherever they want to, etc. Neither would disparage the other since it's just what each chooses to focus on, and they're both in this together. Assassin / Ranger: They're both trained killers and hunters, and further, they really have no overlap — the shared "Predator" designation is more for gameplay than lore. Each one is just doing their own thing in their own places, so this one is entirely about what their society will tolerate or be interested in having around. Dirge / Troubadour: They're both musicians / artists. Why would they fight? Well, maybe they'd feud over some critical commentaries on the quality of their work (haha), but neither is going to want to attack or push out the other just because one is depressing and mellow, and the other is obnoxiously perky. Whereas ... Paladin / Shadowknight: Are sort-of historically defined by their ideological opposition and tendency to crusade against each other and violate each one's sphere of comfort. Like, each one's existence is partially defined by opposing everything the other one stands for. Conjuror / Necromancer: On the surface it seems like they'd have nothing to fight over, but in EQ's specific history they actually have a long-standing rivalry as each one views the other as an 'inferior' summoner. Necros have long been kept out of magi circles by arrogant conjurors, and conjurors have long been persecuted and ousted from Evil societies by arrogant necromancers. It's just a quirk of EQ's lore that these 2 tends to always be competing with each other & at each other's throats ("MY ELEMENTAL CAN BEAT UP YOUR ZOMBIE") Mystic / Defiler: covered in your post Swashbuckler / Brigand: ... okay this one is just silly IMO. Rogues are just as likely to fight, scuffle, compete with, and backstab each other within their class as without. I still think Sony just need 1 Good / Evil split for every archetype and ran out of options for Scouts. : p *twirls non-existent moustache* Very interesting.
The conjuror/necromancer thing is actually more about how the society feels about necromancy. If Necromancy is not allowed on a societal level then it doesn't exist in the school. If they are allowed they tend to take over the school of magic and encourage anyone with talent to take up necromancy. Probably has a lot to do with the persecution complex that comes with necromancy. You know your hated in all of the "good" cities, so anywhere you can establish a school you need to prove your the best and take over. Once you take over, you force as many students to study your kind of magic as you can so they can't ever force your magic out of the school, or city. Your always looking for another opportunity to prove your kind is the best. Once you go to Ulteria you'll see what happens when that whole good/evil thing breaks down and necromancers become accepted all over. Paineel use to be the "evil" outcasts from Euradin. Now with Euradin taken over by the shadowmen the remaining "good" euradites are sheltering with the former outcasts. Even before Euradin fell, the two factions mended the divide between them. They cooperated in the creation of the Ulterian Network. Possibly due to shadowmen influence in the Euradin council, but it worked out to a more peaceful society based on knowledge and less on morals. They made great advances. They also committed genocide with very little remorse. Something to look forward to when you explore Odus.
Wow, that's also a very interesting insight. That's cool and makes a lot of sense, I like it. It is interesting though, that — maybe due to game-mechanic conceits — only the Conjos get 'pushed out' in practice. So that's why I interpreted it as there being an extra-special animosity between the two. So it also seems Necromancy is either more powerful, or is kind of like "intoxicating" in the sense that once you start doing it, you lose more and more interest in the 'cleaner' forms of magic. Kind of like the arcane equivalent of taking up the really good drugs. : p Or the Star Wars Light Side / Dark Side thing where the DS is so tempting and rewarding once you give in, that it's basically impossible for anyone to use the DS "just a little". Maybe that also contributes to the paranoia in 'clean' circles / 'good' societies about Necromancy — it tends to be a downhill slope (or an enlightening rise to a new level of societal quality, depending on perspective! #darkelves).
Just some food for thought: Death is a natural part of the cycle of life. The elements aren't (at least not directly).
Also traditionally necromancy is seen as a "shortcut". Your taking something that use to be a living moving thing and making it move and act living. Conceptually easier than taking a bunch of straw (clay, stone, iron) and convincing it to act like a human. Also traditionally it has drawbacks. Necromancers trend towards loosing control of their creations, and those creations do strange things. Sometimes they go bezerk. Sometimes they try to act like they are alive. Sometimes they focus on one primal instinct and they begin to display it (hunger, rage, greed, other less appealing emotions). A lot of modern fiction gets away from the drawbacks. They think of necromancy as less of a cheaters method to take short cuts and more of that is how magic should work. Necromancy as the product of hard work and tradition, rather than a traditional wizard that uses a dead body to do what a more practiced wizard could do with other (stronger) materials. But yes, controlling elementals is a bit more difficult than undead. Funny, eh?
Well, it kind of makes sense, since a dead body is just that, and even a ghost is like, weakened and separated from its former existence / still tied to this world, etc. Whereas Elementals are fully-thinking / living beings (if I understand right) that simply come from other planes of existence. They just get roped and bound and dragged to another place where the rules of existence are different than their home. Actually that kind of makes Conjurors seem a little, uh, creeper... like Coercers that just limit their domination to extra-planar beings, and everyone looks the other way because it's just an elemental. Kind of Defiler-ish isn't it? Or do Conjurors make pacts & bargains & stuff to convince the Elemental to come here as a servant?
Elementals are naturally occurring pockets of sentient whatever. Actually undead are the same way. Just about anything can spontaneously animate on Norrath. You see evidence of that in Kunark where a dead guard in Terran's pass starts walking around. Probably due to the influence of the Shissar created Super Spire you happen to be at. However, any tomb with corpses in it will eventually animate. You also see plenty of examples of elementals that aren't summoned. All over Thundering Steps, Jasarath Wastes, Forest Ruins, Eastern Wastes (in the Withering Lands). Lots of places with naturally occurring elementals. There are also elemental planes ruled over by the elemental gods. Most likely the conjurors aren't summoning elementals from another plane, but rather creating the conditions for an elemental to spontaneously be created and controlling it. Or maybe they craft these spirits and nurture them to become more powerful as they level? Its not something that Lore really focuses on because its tied too closely to mechanics and its never been vitally important to the story of Norrath.
Why do Druids have the whole anti-Elemental thing going on though? I thought it was because they're extra-planar and disrupt the natural order of our home plane. Also if you read the Conjuror spells: Earthen Avatar: "Summons an inhabitant of the Plane of Earth to do the conjuror's bidding." Fiery Magician: "Summons a native of the Plane of Fire to do the conjuror's bidding." Aery Hunter: "Summons an inhabitant of the Plane of Air to do the conjuror's bidding." Hydromancer: "Summons an inhabitant of the Plane of Water to aid the Conjuror's group." Roaring Flames: "Summons an inhabitant from the Plane of Fire that will attack an opponent specified by the conjuror." Aqueous Swarm: "Summons a pack of inhabitants from the Plane of Water which attack an opponent specified by the conjuror." etc So I'm wondering how they get them here (ie, extra-planar kidnapping + extortion vs. txting them and being like 'hai w2 kill dragons 8 tonite? ordering chinese will summon").
Just for your perusal this thread has a lot of links to various lore sites you might find informative. I don't think any of them delve very deeply into the classes, but there is a lot of other story there, including the text of some books you might miss in game.
That is correct. Elementals from the other planes create breaches from there to Norrath. Druids try to prevent this from disrupting the natural order. But druids aren't against things like the living crystals in Eastern Wastes. They aren't creating breaches between the dimensions. They just happen to be living rock formations. Also there are growth elementals, and the druids certainly aren't opposed to them. As for summoners...I don't think its discussed in-game. Maybe someone else knows?
it's hinted at in the Channeler epic, actually, that mortals/conjies in essence have some ancient 'pact' with the elementals. seems like a 'we answer when you call, you don't do horrid things to us when we do' bargain. during the course of the questline, the guy your tracking keeps trying to turn stronger adn stronger things into constructs. one of them is an Elemental, that is NOT pleased with what he did and threatens that he and his ilk will break the world for mortals breaking the pact.
The following is official EQ Live lore, and, (since it predates the time split), is also official for EQ2. These books were obtained in New Tannan in game on the Plane of Knowledge. Additionally I believe we encounter Wegadas and the Lujien in Ethenere in EQ2. The Gihjna (as yet) have not appeared in EQ2. [Additionally I believe (though I can't be certain) that Cros Treewind, in Qeynos Hills, may have been on the Unkempt Druid faction, though Holly Windstalker definitely was not. I know there was an NPC there, I just can't remember which one] Even though it is in game lore, the sequencing is flawed as it suggests that Humans discovered the Unkempt Woods first, before the Elves. That would suggest that Humans predated Elves on Norrath (which, of course, is simply not the case) The Unkempt Warders: Volume I This work details a little of the unknown ancient legends and history of the Unkempt Warders. All the text is factual, though many parts of this history are missing. The Writ of the Wild, the ancient tome from which I gathered much of this information, is lost to me and the world for now. I give this warning and note to all who read these words: Do not use this information as a catalyst to pursue the Unkempt Woods, or the people who dwell there! This work is done out of fervent respect for the Unkempt People and the Bestial Folk who have called this region home since before the time of the Elves. Their story is great, and one that should not go unheard. Do not disturb these unique people who have mastered the true harmony of existence within the natural order of birth, destruction, chaos, and order! In any case, those who dare to trek within the Unkempt's territory will find themselves greeted with passionate virulence! Even if you believe yourself one of the purest Druids of the Mother of All's modern following, the woods are not a domain for you to dwell. Leave it be--for your sake and for the sake of the last pure forest to grace the face of Norrath since the destruction of the Elddar! ~Anonymous The Unkempt Wood The Valley of the Dawn Nestled in ancient mystery and untold secrecy, within the topmost regions of the Underfoot, beneath the Unkempt Woods, resides a mystic place known as the Valley of the Dawn. This haven of the Wilding Beast-Folk was constructed in the unknown past, and concealed from the Keepers of Norrath's history by the blessings of chance. The Valley of the Dawn was constructed before the time of Man; perhaps even before the time of the Elves. The Bestial Folk known as the Tribes of the Dawn and Moon, took haven on the surface of Norrath; comfortable and nestled within the confines of the dank, dark, and strangely beautiful redwood forest now known as the Unkempt Woods. As the Solar and Lunar tribes established themselves as fierce warriors and guardians of the natural world that they revere as sacred above all else, the tribes built The Valley of the Dawn--a complex and beautiful subterranean citadel dedicated to the Laws of the Wild that these beings protect. Within the First Era of Man, when great civilizations and cultures were still in the far distance of time, a nomadic tribe of Humans stumbled upon the redwood forest. The Tribes of the Dawn and Moon were curious, although they did not interfere with the Human's initial presence. When the Humans had shown themselves to be intelligent beings that wished for nothing other than their own survival, the Tribes approached. It was the Gihjna that the Humans first encountered-- the Ursine Behemoths who represent the side of Life and Creation within the Cycle of Nature, and who comprised the Tribe of the Dawn. The gentle, although wary, Gihjna interacted with the Human tribe over the course of a single year, and in that time, the Gihjna lent their knowledge and beliefs to the curious and eager Humans. The Lujien--the Wolf-Like creatures that embodied Destruction, Death, and inherent Chaos of the Wild, and who comprise the Tribe of the Lunar Tribe of the Moon--never did show themselves at this historic moment, despite their shared curiosity with their Ursine brethren. The nomads settled within the forest and adapted themselves to the Ways of Nature and the Wild as the Gihjna had taught them. They were fledgling in their beginnings as Primordial Wardens of the Wild, although their magical gifts were few and almost vulgar, for all they had learned was from the Gihjna, whose spirits are more tightly bound to the Natural World than any Human or Elf.
The Unkempt Wardens: Volume II A generation would pass before the Elves of Tunaria would first find the majestic redwood forest. When the day arrived that a small band of Scouts from the Elddar Forest found the untouched beauty of this rugged wilderness, the Human Nomads reacted as the Gihjna had greeted their ancestors. The Elves were not receptive to the warm welcome that the Humans extended, all but one--an Elf Druid by the name of Wegadas. He was curious about the Human settlers, and even more curious to find that there were no man made structures to deteriorate the Life Force of the Forest that he felt so strongly. Wegadas accepted the Human's hospitality and despite the language barrier separating them, Wegadas quickly learned that these Humans were in harmony with the Forest, and likely had been for some time. Their intense geographical knowledge of the region was precise and what little bit Wegadas had to observe. He took notes of the harmony in which the Humans shared their habitat. He was reminded much of the Primordial Elves--in the time before Takish'Hiz and the establishment of the Great Empire his people had come to be. Wegadas' Elven companions were entranced with the dank, gloomy treasure they had found. They were lured by the gentle song of the Forest's Spirit, a song that any Elf's Spirit would easily hear, and bewitched by the purity and strength of the uncorrupted and untouched Spiritual Life and strength of the wood. After a day of intense scouting and brief interaction with the peaceful Human tribe, the Elves reunited with their brother and spoke of their need to have this forest for the Takish'Hiz Empire. Wegadas spoke out against his fellow Elves, he did not wish to drive the Humans from their home, for they lived with it in a way parallel to the Elves own cultural ways. He felt that the Humans could be brought to the ways of the Elves and the Forest could, with the aid of the Elven Empire, thrive on it's own and remain the pure emerald jewel of the wilderness that they stood within. There was no need to reave this home for the Tribe, for they lived only in harmony with the Wild and Balance of Nature. The Superior in the group, a Wanderer by the name of Kuvriathan, objected to Wegadas' argument and sent him back to the Takish'Hiz with instructions to report their discovery. The Druid departed his party's side obediently, but did not leave the Forest boundaries. The Elves then tried to herd the Humans out of the Forest in an attempt to cleanse it of the Tribal presence and the taint they believed that the Humans would inevitably bring--for these Elves had seen the fledgling foundation of the Eastern Coastal Cities, and knew the destruction this race was capable of on a whim. The wary Gihjna and Lujien immediately interfered, having watched the Elves since their arrival. Unsuspecting of the fierce and powerful Guardians of the Woodland, the Elves were taken unaware. All but one of the Elven party were destroyed--Wegadas. When the Lujien came for him, he presented himself unarmed and willingly, despite the Human pleas for him to go and not incur the wrath of the Guardians that had allowed them haven in the woods. The Lujien halted their advancement when they saw the plight of their accepted Human guests to spare the Elf's life. It was their Pack-Leader, an Elder Lujien warrior known to the Human Tribe as Udos-Ehai-Digowa (Fang of the Shadow in the common tongue), that approached Wegadas and sank his great maw into the Elf's shoulder, but did not kill him. The Lujien spoke in voiceless words to the Elf, a conversation that would later be written in the Writ of the Wild, a sacred text that dictates the history and code of the Unkempt Wardens.
The Unkempt Warders: Volume III Udos-Ehai-Digowa commanded the Druid to remain in the Forest and share with the Humans his magics and his ways. If ever the Druid should attempt to flee the Forest confines, the Tribe of the Moon would kill him, for they are always watching. However Wegadas was not to corrupt the knowledge and ways that the Gihjna had taught the Humans. Wegadas agreed without argument, and the Lujien Pack faded silently into the shadows, leaving the wounded Elf to the Human Tribe to fulfill the demands that would guarantee his continued life. Wegadas learned the language of the Humans to perfection in his first fortnight. With communication established, Wegadas learned the ways that the Gihjna had taught the humans--finding them intriguing and immediately adopting them as his own, for the sake of the people now in his care, and in respect to the native Bestial Tribes that had spared his life. Over the first years, Wegadas taught the Human Tribe the Ways of the Wilderness--he spoke to them of Tunare, the Mother of All; that Great Goddess of Growth and Nature. He taught them how to pay their respects to his own Goddess without prayer or sacrifice--only that they must respect the Power of the Natural World, for as it had given them life, it could just as easily, and without warning, take it from them. This is a Law that should be neither feared nor hated, but one that is given the respect of an inevitable reality, and one that cannot be altered by steel or mind. The Humans clung to Wegadas' liberal preaching and lessons, embracing the Matron Goddess of Growth as their own. Soon thereafter, the Humans would learn the ways of the Druid--adapting and wielding the magics that Weadas taught them, and that they taught themselves at an exceptional rate. Rangers would be the first of the Master Adepts however, for the magic within them was less than their Druid compatriots, and the Ferocity of the Wild had already been established in their ways. As the Human Tribe became established, Udos-Ehai-Digowa, and the Gihjna Elder, Etsi-Agal-Iha (Mother of the Light), returned to the Human Tribe. The Tribes of the Dawn and Moon established the Laws of the Wild: None of Wegadas' tribe was to leave the Forest, and if they attempted to do so, they would be killed. They were Children of the Wild now, and their attempts to see the outside world would corrupt them. The Tribes of the Dawn and Moon also established that all who entered the Forest would be driven out or destroyed at the discretion of Wegadas and the Tribe. The third law was that the Lujien and Gihjna would remain out of the Human Tribe's affairs--so long as they maintained the Order the Gihjna had given the generations past, and that they did not stray from their Duties to the Forest that accepted them as its children. The Laws were agreed upon with Wegadas' leadership, for the Human Tribe trusted his wisdom and guidance explicitly. Satisfied, the Solar and Lunar Tribes departed, although their eyes never strayed from their Human guests. It was in those first years that Wegadas' intrigue with the Humans grew to tightly woven kinship. Slowly, he released his grip on his Elven life, and embraced the fledgling existence and culture that he was instrumental in fathering. The Elven Druid was Fier'Dal no more; his brethren were no longer Human--they were all Children of the Wild, and it was then that Wegadas learned a true peace. Finding his true purpose and never longing for the life he abandoned, Wegadas would spend nearly a century composing what would become the most revered and sacred of relics to the Homid Tribe of the Redwood Forest--The Writ of the Wild. This Sacred Tome detailed Wegadas' rebirth into the Wilderness per his own perspective, as well as the Laws that he had established and his people followed. The Tome also detailed the Lujien and Gihjna culture and their ancient tales and religion that Wegadas had been privy to in the several centuries he dwelt among them. The Unkempt Warders: Volume IV Wegadas would find several mates in his lifetime among the Human Tribe and be father to over a dozen children--Half-Elven children. The last of his children and only daughter would be named Elaryness. Shortly after the birth of his final child, nearly four centuries after the establishing The Writ of the Wild, and guiding his brethern through their newfound ways, Wegadas' was old and weary and heard the distant call of the Forest--beckoning him to fulfill his own cycle of life. the old Druid would pass into the Wilderness forever at a site that would later become the most sacred site of the Unkempt Tribe. Wegadas' body was not buried, nor was it touched by the wild creatures of the Forest. He is said to have melded into the Earth, and from his reclaimed flesh and Spirit, a Great Willow grew--the Weeping Willow of Tunare. The ancient tales of the Human Tribe would say that the Willow was a gift to Wegadas' Children and Brethern from Tunare herself. As She reclaimed his old Spirit, the Mother of All felt the great loss that the Unkempt Tribe suffered with Wegadas' passing, and listened to their wordless prayer as they said their farewells to the beloved leader. In Her appreciation for the Human Tribe's devotion to Her, and in honor of Her missonary, Wegadas, She molded his Spirit and Essence into the great and beautiful tree that eternally weeps the tears of joy and sorrow of the Tribe. With her father's passing, and the appearance of the Great Willow, Elaryness, the only daughter of Wegadas, would rightfully challenge four others--two of whom were her own half-brothers--who had made the declaration for the leadership in Wegadas' stead. The brutal, ceremonial battles would last days at a time where those who vied for leadership would hunt one another throughout the whole expanse of the Woods. Elaryness would destroy her challengers, and the Tribe, now beneath her rule, would move their bodies to the very location where Wegadas himself had laid to final rest. These brutal, and oftentimes savage hunts, (dictated by the Hunter's primordial instincts) are Law amongst the Unkempt Warders, for it is the Law of the Wild--the strongest lead whilst the weaker follow, though neither is whole without the other. Elaryness would be declared the First Hierophant of the Unkempt Warders. It was also Elaryness who would establish the Shrine of Tunare, in memory of her father and to fulfill the debt that she felt her entire Tribe owed to the Mother of All for Her gift of Wegadas, and the Weeping Willow.
The Unkempt Warders: Volume V For several more generations, the Unkempt Warders would flourish and hold true to their vows to the Lujien and Gihjan Tribes. However, it would be the settlement of the JaggedPine Forest that would render the peace and harmonious existence of the Unkempt to one of strife and true ferocity to uphold their promise and ways. When Human settlers dedicated to the ways of Karana, established themselves in the JaggedPine Forest and began to explore the surrounding areas, the Unkempt were revealed to the rest of Norrath in flurry of brutal attacks upon any whom entered their territory. Eventually, the JaggedPine would seal off it's entry to the Unkempt Wood leaving the Feral Tribe to it's own--preserving their own existence and maintaining their ways. For years after, the Unkempt seemed again to be at peace. They managed to convert several of the JaggedPine settlers to their ways before entry was impossible, as well as a few of the scarcely wandering Elves who stumbled into the Unkempt territory as the years passed both prior to, and after Wegadas' death. Now they are again in unknown and unspoken turmoil. The Writ of the Wild, the Sacred Tome of the Unkempt has been lost. Their ancient Vows to the Lujien and Gihjna Tribes prevent them from seeking the Tome beyond the Forest boundaries. The better judgement of the Gihjna Elders lean away from searching for material possession--for the Unkempt know the Tome by heart, and they may continue it's life and purpose through voice and lessons, as Wegadas had originally intended.
The Unkempt Warders: Volume VI The Unkempt Druids: Throughout the Plains of Karana, and the Mountains of Rathe, very small bands of Human and Half-Elven Rangers and Druids have laid claim to the Unkempt ways. These misguided few have recently been introduced to the true path of the Unkempt with the discovery of ancient scrolls believed to be a part of the missing Tome bound in a living weave of moss and fern--The Writ of the Wild. Few can decipher this Tome's ancient symbols, dating back to an era when Man was nothing more than groups of nomadic tribes wandering the face of Norrath. The ignorance of the Tome's true words and meaning had only strengthened the thirst for truth of the Unkempt ways in these few outcast Druids and Rangers of the Wild. Eager to know what secrets the Tome would reveal, the Outcast Druids of the Rathe Mountains sought the Hermit who dwells in his solitude in the Southern Plains of Karana. Believed to have been schooled in the ways of the true Unkempt in the Unkempt Woods long ago, the Hermit was able to translate the fragmented pieces of these ancient documents--although he would lend only a small portion of their knowledge and secrets to the curious outsiders. The Hermit gave the secret translated passages to the Outcast Wildings and sent them away--the originals believed to remain in his possession. With only a minor portion of the Unkempt Tome translation, these Outcasts began to spread their passion for the Wild across all of Norrath, looking to convert any Child of the Natural World to their cause. From the Plains of Karana, to the misty forests of the Faydark, the Outcast Druids and Rangers have gained some support, forming a small and sheltered cult dedicated to the vague ways of the Unkempt Path that they have access to. However, the Ancient Writ's words and guidance were not enough to show the curious and passionate Wildings the true meaning of what it is to be Unkempt. Their ignorance may become their downfall, for now they seek to uncover the Sacred Unkempt Woods where the ways of the Unkempt were born. The true followers of The Writ of the Wild are those known as the Unkempt Warders, who have not wandered from their homeland of the Unkempt Woods since their founding. Litle is known by outsiders of the Unkempt Warders, for they are reclusive by nature and do not seek to venture beyond the boundries of their cherished and well-guarded territory.
Its more an implication that Elves discovered the Unkempt Woods after the humans arrived. This is actually a very narrow window of time. According to the Ethernaught storyline humans were relatively new when Oceangreen was settled (the forerunner of Qeynos). At the time Bayle was active Tak'hiz was being abandoned and the Elddar were moving to Fadewyr. The elves in the Unkempt story are obviously from before this. There wouldn't have been exploration on Tunaria after the Curse of Ro. All effort went into trying to counter the curse, and then towards getting refugees to the new continent. So the Unkempt tribe was probably amongst the first wave of changed barbarians that left Halas. A generation for humans is only 20 years so the newly established tribe may have only been there for a (historically) brief time before the elven explorers found them.
