Warfields/PvP Ranks/Faction Balance/Immunity/Items

Discussion in 'PVP Discussion' started by ARCHIVED-EndevorX, Jun 29, 2010.

  1. ARCHIVED-EndevorX Guest

    Neskonlith wrote:
    How is that an exploit if the drop rate is reduced? That would be the point, to promote open world PvP, and such carrying on in contested dungeons would be fair game.
    Those that are undergeared would have the instanced versions to use, and as such, you'd likely find the geared players engaging in combat in the contested versions.

    Keep in mind that your quoting me here is from my 3rd post in this thread, and that such a suggestion is ancillary, secondary, to the primary entries in the original post.
    Do you have any thoughts about the central core of the thread, aside from your concerns with the subordinate idea of contested dungeons?
  2. ARCHIVED-Neskonlith Guest

    When discussing lists, I prefer to start with one point and progress onwards from there in an attempt to avoid wall-of-nested-texts that often become TL;DR snoozers.
    If some of the ideas you list here are not considered significant enough to discuss in detail, why did you bother to include them? You evidently felt compelled strongly enough to post such an idea and then asked for comments, so I provided one on a low-hanging fruit from the bushel of ideas you offered.
    You also made the effort to preface your comment with the emphasis that you prefer the destruction of instances in favour of all-contested:

    Seliri@Nagafen wrote:
    What your posts indicate to me is that you have a preference for deleting and destroying PVE game options in order to leave broke-pvp as the remaining viable option.
    A strong open-pvp system would have more than enough willing participants without resorting to measures such as shutting down and disabling PVE options. If a "solution" requires widespread PVE content removal to succeed, then I would observe that such a solution is far too weak to be worthy of Dev resources.
  3. ARCHIVED-EndevorX Guest

    Neskonlith wrote:
    I never said this idea wasn't significant enough to discuss in detail, I simply asked your perspective on the other, primary thoughts.

    Despite it being my preference to destroy instances and have only contested dungeons, if you take in the "if pandering to PvE carebearisms precedes prioritizing open world PvP" into account, you'll realize that I also support the likely better route of creating contested dungeons, along with having the instances.

    Even if there were only contested dungeons, they wouldn't be shutting down or removing PvE options. You'd simply want to rally enough potent allies to accomplish your PvE aim. IMO, it's a healthy mix of the two.
    Note that I also wouldn't be against multiple contested dungeons of the same instance if the population grew too large (i.e. more than 40 of each faction or 80 total).
    Of course, again, to emphasize, drop rates would need to be altered accordingly.
  4. ARCHIVED-Neskonlith Guest

    Seliri@Nagafen wrote:
    For many of your other listed ideas, I currently have no additional, pressing comments for consideration since those items are generally additive to pvp options, which are positive additions to the overall game. I like changes to broken systems, I encourage adding solutions that enhance the overall gameplay experience.
    SOE has a dark history of hasty deletions and content removal as a band-aid while they eventually get around to patching in a fix, and I strongly discourage movement in the direction of encouraging nerfs on content that is fun and functional.
  5. ARCHIVED-Neskonlith Guest

    Seliri@Nagafen wrote:
    A contested area without player caps or very few artificial restrictions is desirable for open-pvp, so that players could wage "war" against each other with "armies". It is a pity that SOE hardware is currently incapable of handling the task of open-pvp when more than a handful of players take an interest in participating.
    Player caps create closed instances that are more like BeeGees.
  6. ARCHIVED-EndevorX Guest

    Neskonlith wrote:
    I agree, but, we gotta work with what we have, and maybe soon what we don't yet have, if Smokejumper's statements on hardware improvements are going to include Nagafen! ;D
  7. ARCHIVED-j6ixty Guest

    Here comes Auxillery's views.
    Pvp Immunity: Can't tell you how many times freeps sit there and appear on my track, imo track should pick up those NOT IN IMMUNITY OR AFK. Granted the afk will have to be worked out somewhat, if you move it comes off etc. Also, if you do not want to pvp then don't be there, I mean really immunity should only be there if you die to give you time to buff.
    Writs: The writs are fine I see no problem with that.
    Warfields: HOLY CRAP LAG? As a brigand with CAs, the casting delay is horrendous. I cant kill a healer if they pop a heal in between my delay. I agree with seliri on the diffrent tiers are diffrent zones, that should have been implimented in the beginning, lower levels should not be in the same zone as 90s.
    Titles: Fame decay is horrible, lost destroyer three times in three days just because I turned the game off to SLEEP.
    Toughness: Makes fighters and anyone with a full set invincible, in BGs I might as well throw my shoes at the enemy to do anything...
    Battlegrounds: Make it so the flag gives a debuff to speed or SOMETHING, a bard or SoW buffed tank can just easily pop his temps to be immune to everything and run away.
  8. ARCHIVED-EndevorX Guest

    Auxillery@Nagafen wrote:
    Well, I know Brigands are still able to DPS and compete effectively against tanks. Even non-raid geared Brigands like Hekter are very formidable in PvP. A duel I had with Hekter lasted 17 m 38 sec. TBH, I think it's best you disclose information about the state of your character, as I'm pretty sure you're in mostly Legendary! O_O

    In regards to writs, I don't think the issue is with that, but warfields rewards. What's your take on that? =]

    Kinda off topic, but snares and roots have always been vital for the Battlefield of Ganak!
  9. ARCHIVED-Skudwhistle Guest

    I now know why a majority of the server has you on ignore =/
  10. ARCHIVED-j6ixty Guest

    Pvp/Legendary gear yes, find me a scout that can dps DOWN a tank full pvp geared then come talk to me.
    As far as snares/roots HAH ok, Gogo aura of the crusader or close mind then nobody can stop them.
    WF rewards: The rewards should be increased, the amount of tokens we get for the LONG wait is stupid... 3 if you win, yeah ok sure let me waste 10 mins of my time sitting there at klak HOPING to not be vsing a stacked group.
  11. ARCHIVED-EndevorX Guest

    Auxillery@Nagafen wrote:
    Toughness:
    Pretty much most all fully PvP geared/AAd scouts can at least run a tank out of power if they don't have avatar regen charms or wrist pieces. Crit mit sets/adorns and Symphonic Allure/Blood Symphony/Blood Ritual/Superior Runes of Mending are enough to keep a scout replenished if they also have solid power regen items.
    And for scouts to be able to run a tank out of power is pretty substantial, considering their job isn't to tank and absorb an abyss of damage. Snaring and kiting a tank is still viable, but not if you want to avoid their bow triggering 3-8+ procs of theirs at a time.

    Warfields Rewards:
    I think you meant to be a bit more on topic, and ignore battlegrounds in this thread! ;P lmao. In particular, what do you think about the warfields rewards I suggested (Part 1, Section D), or can you imagine a better option to share with us?
  12. ARCHIVED-j6ixty Guest

    Sorry seliri, half tired but WF needs to have the tokens increased from 5 to 15-20. (Point i was trying to get at)
  13. ARCHIVED-EndevorX Guest

    Auxillery@Nagafen wrote:
    Seliri@Nagafen's log wrote:
    After deriving seemingly coherent focus from Auxillery, I believe his true position on the matter has been discovered...
    (P.S. Cant believe my 3rd hotbar was misaligned all this time...can totally tell from the extra frame budging in on the right side of that chat box...)
  14. ARCHIVED-Forebian Guest

    My idea is simple:
    Allow us to turn on a notification system that will have an icon on our screen when we log in if a Warfield is up and what zone it is. When you're running BGs and popping in and out there is no way of knowing if a WF is up without asking. Additionally, when using a porting system of some kind please identify which instance of Ant/CL is the WF.
    Feedback to one of the ideas here: WF by tier may be fine, but I wouldn't want WFs in a zone where I would get MOB aggro. If you have it by tier in an appropriate zone then you'll spend half you time fighting MOBs. Not what I came there for.
  15. ARCHIVED-crossfader Guest

    Here is the viewpoint from one of the many "casual" Pvpers on Nagafen.....actually right now I hardly ever pvp because of the little time I have to play with real life commitments, but I used to pvp on my templar when on Venekor and plan to again soon once I get my current toon up to par. So please don't discount my suggestions/worries. Also, while I tried to read EVERY post and reply in this thread.....I haven't had time so I skimmed. Apoligies if I post any repeats.

    Pvp Immunity:I am totally open to the idea of nerfing immunities. My only fear is this: I do NOT have the time to play the broker game or farm like so many players out there so my primary source of income is questing t8/t9. In SF currently about 3 quests give or take will net me a plat. Last night I was critically Shadow stepped for 9.8k damage and 1 shotted while questing and lost...what....60-70% of the money I had. And to be sure, I never do more than 3-4 quests at a time without running back to immune Paineel for that very reason. Couldn't even get evac off. How on earth will I make money if I can't even run immune to a bank in Paineel (I know Seliri mentioned leaving at least 3 zones immunity intact and I thank you for that). If you nerf all immunity as one poster wished, you will give rise to plat farmers of a different sort, perhaps ones who hide and farm quest turn in locations for easy money. Maybe not, but that would be destructive blow to myself as a player.
    Writs: I don't see a problem with writs either. No suggestions on how many tokens should be awarded or anyting but I don't pvp simply for tokens. I do it for the fun of the fight and the enjoyment of the friends I fight with.
    Warfields: Coming from a player on the Q side, these things are just a joke right now because of how boring they are. I don't blame the dev's for this outright (though it may have been naivety that led to the exploits), i just think it's rediculous how many players switched to the opposing side to farm WF tokens because it was easier. Suggestion: DO NOT let tokens transfer when you are betraying back. If so, make it a limited timed event to try and even up the sides. That's my only thoughts on this. It would take something massive aimed at the playerbase to make these enjoyable to me. I like Seliri's ideas and since I'm not creative I will not try to add my own.
    Titles: Make them the way they used to be. I used to HATE the fame system because I was terrible at pvp. I wanted a negative title that made players lose fame for killing me but that was because I was biter and pathetic. Now I see that I was childish to not enjoy them for what they are and would like a return to the new system. I have NO idea how I had a Hunter with 3x more deaths than kills a few months ago......just made me chuckle. Shouldn't happen.
    Toughness:I don't really have a problem with this. I do worry that once things get changed in pvp that those who were able to farm ungodly amounts of tokens during easy mode WF's will be at a definite advantage to those who are making new toons under a new? system. But other than that, I don't much care about toughness. Crusader fights are intensely boring to watch though (while dead and unable to revive), I will admit, though likely due to crazy proc heals or other imbalances that I choose to ignore. Thank you for the ability to convince your partner to jump off a cliff and suicide so the game can go on is all i can say.
    Battlegrounds: No suggestions, don't do them anymore, I may eventually but having to do a number of Smugglers' Den BG's for gear, which seem to take forever, is a sore thing to think about. Give us more types I would say.
    Closed instances vs. Open instances: I like the idea of turning more closed instance into open ones, just please institute some brawler protections next to named monsters (something that can sense FD or what not because I just KNOW players will be farming them till the sun sets in the west). That is assuming there will not be lockout timers....which brings up it's own issue that I am too hungry to think about.
    To sum it up, I know that hardcore pvp'ers want to make a haven of death and destruction on Nagafen but be sure to consider the casual pvp'er when you decide to institute changes that will inadvertantly....or purposefully, affect pve, or the population may dwindle more.

    Thank you!
  16. ARCHIVED-MalkorGodchyld Guest

    Thinwizzy@Nagafen wrote:
    Highlighted a few paragraphs that i thought were most important in that post Thin... i made some of the same points in a tell i sent to Olihin in game, mainly about the fame system. Dude...work on the highlighted portions for the core of any future "PvP Fixes" and you go a long way in fixing PvP. After u do whats quoted, build everything else around it & presto.
    Let the faction based rewards/penalties work both ways... a smaller group gets a bonus for killing a larger group of the same teir, to encourage something other than a "6v6 or run" mindset.
    Get more creative with titles when u bring them back... this is just extra but consider making suffix titles based on a players PvP playstyle. Someone who doesnt run no matter what? "The Unwavering" or something along those lines. Somebody who tends to hunt down whoever killed them? "The Vengeful" 200 killstreak? "The Undying" it may sound corny to some ppl but small things like that flesh out a pvp system and provides a little extra incentive.
    Of course before screwing around with titles the Quoted & highlighted stuff srsly needs to be fixed FIRST. I dont have the motivation at the time, to type out a detailed post so luckily Thinwizzy hit some very important points that i would have likely put in any "PvP fix post of my own" Right on Thin!

    Mariusx
  17. ARCHIVED-monte9 Guest

    This is coming from a Q on Vox who has only started playing this game about 2 months ago for the first time.
    1: Warfields.
    Splitting the zones up by tier would be a good idea. Only problem with it, only 2 or 3 tiers will ever be active. The very low tiers and the end tier. Everything between will be empty. As a lowbie grinding up, I didn’t mind everything being together.
    What needs to change are the rewards. Give the people a reason to fight again. At the moment Warfields is mostly an AFK’ers easy token system. Rewards should be done by objectives met type thing. Example: 1 token for every mage still standing/killed or 2 tokens for each tower destroyed/standing at the end. Each side getting the number of tokens for the objectives met. This will once again bring out the big group of 90’s on both sides to actually fight for the objects and there will be PVP!!!
    War field tab is a good thing. Should be an easy way to see if warfields is up and zone. Having Warfields winners get a extended buff for winning is a GRAND idea. This helps PvP’ers and raiders as well. Gives people a reason to fight even after they get all there.
    2: PvP Titles.
    Could care less. I think this favors the side with more people. It is much easier for an over populated Q side or Freep side to get easy rep, zerg mentality.
    3: Faction balance.
    Not sure how you can really fix this. May be if one side is extremely over populated; allow an entire guild to switch side. This would be on a first come first serve bases. Done on a Manual level with an SOE employee Ok’ing and doing the transfer. There guild hall would transfer over as is along with all their member characters, bank accounts, spell levels and all. When one side gets way over populated, SOE can put out a request for a guild or two to switch side. Guilds could volunteer for the transfer and SOE would choice one or two to go over.
    4: Immunity.
    Only issue I have with this. You should not be able to receive any rewards or updates while in immunity.
    5: Gear
    Easy way to fix items. Add toughness to all fable armor. Shard armor and all. This will make all types of armor viable, and give new PvE’ers a better chance when they hit the BG and Warfields.
  18. ARCHIVED-j6ixty Guest

    Seliri@Nagafen wrote:
    Ok copying my text when I was tired... yeah you are not going to get my 100% correct views because I was tired. Secondly if you want me to post again dont try and humiliate me. Thanks.
  19. ARCHIVED-EndevorX Guest

    Forebian wrote:
    In regard to your worries about dealing w/ aggressive mobs if warfields are relegated to the respective zones of the tier, I completely believe there are enough paths w/ no roaming mobs that would make avoiding them more than possible.
    Despite that, even if there are minor adds to fend off in the course of fulfilling revised warfields objectives, most all trash has been changed to essentially be ineffective at meaningfully damaging those geared competently in their tier, which is fair enough IMO, since players of such caliber would be the type of competition encountered.

    monte9 wrote:
    2 & 3.) If a passive system for faction balance is instated, equity in competition may be seen even for Vox, which may possibly aid in restoring quality group vs group PvP.
    4.) AFKers would abuse this and only leave immunity to be rewarded at the last moment.

    Auxillery@Nagafen wrote:
    Pshh...was nott trying to humiliate you bro, that's messed to think I'd be like that. No joke. =o The intention was to portray the idea that I wouldn't photoshop or fabricate support! 8]
  20. ARCHIVED-monte9 Guest

    Seliri@Nagafen wrote: