Once in a while I miss a feature of my warden when I raid on my mystic, but really not very often - however I do think everyone in my groups would much rather be healed by a mystic. Several of the previous wardens I know are now either chanters or bards, as wardens were the first choice of healer to be asked to swap to a more desired support class. Wardens can do the job, but generally people would rather someone else did the job: at least in raids anyway. Occassionally wardens can't do the job, I can't see some of our mages reliably getting through waterside of R&R aoes without both wards and cleric hp buffs; I'm sure some people might want to shoot me down for saying that, but for us it's true anyways.
Looking at the current oppinions voiced these days of what makes us not desireable for the end game raid content. It seems its pretty much the same old complaint , The class is great in an all around sense , but doesnt really have something to stand out when compared to the other healers. The devs have spread our abilities out so much , and in keeping balance , they are watered down so to speak. So they will never be desired over another class that can get the job done when min/max in a practiced raid group(excuse me if im off the mark , havent raided since Kos) It seems to me , through our AA's we should be able to enhance 1 of our many abilities to a level of uberness desired for raids, But at the cost of all else. Just for some crazy off the top of my head Idea's im thinking something at the end of 1 of the 4 lines in the warden tree. Movement line : Rooting grove ... roots all enemies AOE 50 meters/30 sec , works on epics .... stuns/stifles/roots the warden. CA line : Leader of the Pack (enhanced natures pack) Turns group members into a wolf pack and spawns your natures pack. Stifles group members (no spells castable) increases health and dmg of group members by x% (all pets and dumbfire included) Lasts 30 sec ... (shape changes everyone to wolf form???) Reformation Line : Enhanced Heirophantic Genesis ... Basically just give it a much larger heal amount ... I cant remember what its doing right now , and if it doesnt stun/stifle the warden currently ... then it should while in enhanced mode. Cure line: Just simply have A Raid aoe detriment prevent for X amount of time ... again stun/stifle the warden. Im not saying these are the awnsers , just some crazy Idea's like I said.
I don't know. I think wardens are fine the way they are. I have no trouble at all with solo content. I wouldn't know how warden does in a groups, as I've learned to NOT group with people at lower levels based on the bad experiences I've endured on other characters. I've yet to get to end game level on any character, and I've never raided in this game. By the looks of what everyone is saying in this thread, if I continue to play a warden, I likely never will raid (not by my own choosing, but rather because asking a warden into a raid appears to be equated to scraping the bottom of the barrel to fill a slot). Nobody wants to be the last kid picked for the kickball team. I'm not sure which class to make or continue playing now, but warden is obviously NOT the best choice, according to this thread.
Terina@Blackburrow wrote: Wardens do well in all areas of the game except raiding which is why I think we need to avoid asking for outright buffs to the class. Even in raiding there isn't really anything wrong other then they we don't fit anywhere. Raid leaders like to have certain healers in DPS groups because they add buffs that make a big difference in the performance of those groups. They also like to have certain healers in the tank groups, but HoT is the least desirable healing type so we don't get included there unless they need to go with a third healer for some reason. What has typically happened for the last 3-4 years is that raid leaders will add a Warden when breaking new content and then dump them for a DPS class against things they can kill easily and this really hasn't changed. In the last expansion where it wasn't a good idea to have a Warden as the only healer in a group because they didn't have the cures required. That has changed but we are still a third choice at best for any of these spots leaving us back where we were a couple expansions ago.
Generic123 wrote: @ Terina : Certainly dont "Not" pick this class because of this thread. Its meant more of a focus discussion on something needed only effecting 5-10% of the game ... hopefully /shrug. The warden is a great class solo,group,questing,sitting afk,PvP,BG ... But the raiding content like generic just said ... We "Become not needed" due to the rest of the group getting better at surviveing ... and prefering to get some more dps (conserve time) With the Leader of the pack spell I mentioned ... I was trying to think of a way to increase our whole group DPS , at the cost of no healing in group for that period of time. Except mele proc heals ofcourse Hey maybe a fresh look on the subject by you , could yeild some good idea's ? You could probably find some raid walk throughs on EQ2 wiki ... give ya a ruff Idea anyways.
NolaDragon wrote: This is Terina, posting on my monk's persona, as that's what I've decided to play on. I apparently favor the classes considered the red headed step-children where raiding is concerned lol, as monks are wanted in a raid even less than a warden, or so I've heard, but I've always enjoyed playing this monk. My take on the game as a whole right now, is that I'd rather play as a class that I enjoy, and will likely play well as a direct result of enjoying playing it, than to sell out and make a class to play just because it might be more desireable and a fast ticket to seeing raid content. Playing something I like > Playing something I might not like. Either way, I'd have to get to 90 all by myself, so what if I absolutely hated playing a dirge or coercer? That would feel too much like a job I hated showing up for every day. I'm supposed to solo to 90 just to help a bunch of schmucks out in a raid that couldn't be bothered to mentor down and help me level up to begin with? Pfft. Screw them AND the horses they rode in on. I wish you guys luck, and hope that SOE gets around to balancing all of the classes soon, but for now, I'm shelving my warden.
Yes it would be nice for our buffs to be group wide. I'll keep my fingers crossed that some dev is laying awake worrying about how to make that work. and by the way I know I'm going to get yelled at for saying this but ... I love my Warden. I've raided with her for the past 3 years and the SF expansion has only made it more fun. Not only are our heals better we now have 2 group cures (I would have killed for that in TOS lol) AND we can DPS like mad. It's going to take a while for people realize the impact that SF has had on our class. We used to be a backup healer that couldn't kill anything. Now we're more of a dps class that has some awesome fast heals and cures. Posting a parse example from Lair and Labs. I'm not in the top raiding guild , I have T2 armor and my group usually consists of a zerker, defiler, coercer, dirge, warden , inquisy. It's not the best dps but I think it's respectable for a healer class. It seems like the game is updated , the classes change, roles change but most raid leaders don't. They keep the same raid build simply because "that's the way the groups have always been set up" Maybe it's not the devs that need to change things *shrugs*
Well, Myxx... Thank you for sharing that. It's definitely inspiring. I'm inclined to agree with you on the notion of exactly who needs to be making some changes. Then again, there's always exceptional players of any class. Not taking anything from you by saying that, but maybe you're an above average player. Gear helps, but an ok geared and skillful player will trump an uber geared player who doesn't have a clue. For myself, I decided to give dirge a try (not because they are so in demand, but because I hadn't played one yet), and so far, I'm enjoying it. I miss the elite heals of my warden while attempting to solo things, but I'm still having fun. That's what it's about anyway, right? Having fun?
