Venril Sathir - unfair roadblock for some classes

Dasein wrote:

I found this in another thread, someone said low power was the only fail condition, yet this guy posted 5. (maybe 4.5)
People I know that need venril, pay a raid guild 300p for the update or they are screwed, no one even goes down there to try and get the upate any more.
I personally have tried about 50 times to take him down, and always there is 1 person who screws up. Since I am not in a raid guild i have to take what I can get down there, and since TSO is out and u high powered peeps gotother things to do, it is time for him to be nerfed.
this encounter was built for hard core raiders. not raid alliances that are still trying to work through the content.
Keeping my power between 30 and 60, self cure with a pot, seems plenty easy to me, but someone always f-es it up. to my friends that need VS for their mythical updates, I just say "Pay for it or your screwed"

Nexona is not a "well designed encounter." Punishing a raid for too much DPS is a ridiculous concept, as is making people click statues or harvest for the entire fight.

We just re-did VS with a raid consisting of many alts , not all of whom were well geared...

We wiped on the first pull due to someone getting a massive power drain , 2nd time we killed it with little or no problems , it's all about paying attention and bringing lots of cure nox pots.

CoLD MeTaL wrote:

What I am hearing from this thread is that VS can be killed by as few as 12-15 people.
If you really died 50 times, and the same person had trouble more than 3 times, I would ask them to just stay dead. They will get the update regardless.
It comes down the maturity of the folks in your raid. If their response to "Since we are having some troubles with VS and we really want to get it done tonight, we're going to try it with a core group. Do you mind staying down?" is F-U and they ragequit or get all mad and start bleating in the guild chat, well then maybe they should not be in your raid force.
From everything I have read about VS, yes, it forces your raid force to pay attention to what they are doing, break out their their standard routine and think for a moment. But that is really the only beneficial aspect of this fight as far as I can tell. After that it comes down to dumb luck, nobody going LD, lagging, getting feared at the wrong time, etc. so in that regard, I have no problem with trying it a few times and then asking folks to just stay down. If we succeed and get 24 folks flagged for VS and they are truly upset that they couldn't participate in the whole fight and want to take another stab at him later on, we can do that when are flagging guild alts. Holding up the whole guild so all 24 people can feel like they did their 1/24th of the fight seems a poor choice. The fact that raid guilds broke up over this fight due to hurt feelings is still alarming to me.
I think most guilds who are selling mythical updates just have outsiders play dead during this fight. I could be wrong...

Rayche@Antonia Bayle wrote:

Yep, my thoughts exactly. I quite enjoy the Nex fights. Everyone has to work really hard, lots of stuff to watch out for...but fun and rewarding. VS quite the opposite; nervewracking chance and luck.
I didn't realise some classes actually get an option of VS or something else... wtf LOL

So how can a raid of 12-15 kill Venril? I am a bit curious as we tried it with 17 the other week and was unable to do it because most of the raid was hit with his fear/stun. I was under the impression that there needed to be 15 people between him and the healers to protect the healers from this effect.*

*We also had bug issues with the statues and decided to quit after a few extra "training" pulls to train new statue watchers.

Aeviel@Venekor wrote:

I think you're confusing the Pawbuster stifle effect with Venril. Venril's fear is reactive, so it doesn't matter how many people are in the raid.

Thanon@Runnyeye wrote:

You're so right!
Best part of those scripted fights is not only do you have to do everything EXACTLY on a already decided linear line, which makes it, guess what.... Much more boring that stuff where you can improvise like Rumbler, Wuoshi, etc.
Also, it's also great, and I'll say this again, since EQ is so stable and then you fight Switchmaster or someone and 6 of your raiders get booted, get the yellow screen, you wipe.
FUN!

Aeviel@Venekor wrote:

The only way to proc VS's fear is to attack him....just make sure your healers don't attack him at all and they won't receive the fear , if your healers are being feared , remind them they're healers not DPS on this fight.

Aeviel@Venekor wrote:

That is not how the fight works to my knowledge.
He has an 8% chance to fear anyone who does damage to him. Healers should not be doing ANY dps to him.
Every 38 seconds he does his AoE nox which must be cured immediately.

Add the two together and you get this loop:

• When Toxic Infusion nox occurs, cure it.
• DPS for 30 seconds.
• Stop DPS for the last 8 seconds before the next Toxic Infusion fires. That way if any fears happen, they have expired by the time TI happens and everyone can cure it.

wullailhuit wrote:

What he is talking about is the AoE mez that effects the closest 15 or so people. Just like the Pawbuster fight.

My guild has taken VS down and will again if needed but that doesn't change the fact that this fight is just stupid and NO ONE wants to do it. I have zero issues with SOE changing it. I think they should change some of the wipes to make it so if you do mess up there is a chance you can battle through it. Make the statues that spawn killable rather then wipe. There is no need to change the whole fight just weaken it a little.

Took us a while to kill this mob, but once everyone got to grips with keeping their power around 50% it was cake.
Dont joust the aoe. Keep all your dps in and use druids to group cure when the aoe hits. Make sure the druids arent dpsing to avoid the fear. Make ur raiders self cure the non-aoe nox.
Have your ACT person watching for the pwr drain dot and have them call out whoever gets it so they know to stop ca/spell until its gone. Two people on the statues, one person to disable his ring.
Practice makes perfect.
If your guild can farm vp then vs is easy.
One last thing, if you get one person always wiping the raid or any other weaklinks drop them from the raid.

This is the first I have heard of a 15 person AoE mez. What's the timer? Are there any special triggers? I thought this guy had enough effects. So druids have to be ready to group cure mez in addition to all the other stuff?!?!

Must have been the mez, since I am a healer (and a girl... a girl!!) and I was getting the mez effect which of course caused the tank to die since only two of us healers standing at max range didn't get mezmerized.
Thanks for the advice. We'll have to try him again. We, personally, know people hate the VS fight because with any other raid mob in the game that we play around with (From Labs to TSO content) he is the only scheduled fight that we get less than the 24 required. Any other day we have 26+ people from our raid alliance show. This is unfair to those poor classes in our alliance who need the VS kill to progress in their mythicals. Maybe we'll offer more DKP for VS attempts/kills.

All of your DPS should be in front of the healers.

We added more dkp for the extra suckage of killing VS too
The mez or stifle that you are experiencing I believe is the trauma AoE. It hits a certain number of people starting with the closest to VS. As long as you are at max range and your dps are between you and the named then you won't get hit often by that. If you do then have someone outside the MT group cure your trauma so you can cure your group. Its how we dealt with that early on. Now that isn't much of an issue for us though.

Aeviel@Venekor wrote:

The trauma doesn't hit 15 people. It hits several close to VS but that's it. As long as all the healers are behind the DPS they shouldn't get nailed with it. Most healers also have ways to prevent stun/stifle as well so even if it does hit them there shouldn't be a real issue.
Everyone needs nox potions. If you have people on VS that don't have nox potions or won't use them, just kick em. There is no reason for anyone to be there that can't listen.
VS doesn't take a Master's Degree to figure out. People just need to do what they are told and "ONLY" what they are told and he dies.

On a side note:
You only need one person with the cube to click statues. You stand in the middle up on Venril's platform between them. They always glow at the same time so watch one click it the moment it glows turn and click the next one. It's not complicated you just have to make sure you get to the statues on the pull. Just run right past VS he will ignore you. And make sure you enter combat in some manner. Heal on the tank, send a pet, buff or debuff on the pull, ect...
I am able to click both statues myself, and repeatedly make and buff pets to send at him, and also change the name of those pets in the processs to things like "Curethenox", "Watchyerpower", "Minusfiftydkp", "Moredots", "Yourmom", and "Arewedoneyet". It's really not complicated.
Nothing about VS is complicated. You just have to get people to follow instructions and stop trying to "improv" during the fight.
Spamming CA's or spells to get power down is BAD. Leaving sprint on so you can jump or strafe back and forth is BAD. letting your power get below 40% is BAD. Letting your power get over 50% is BAD. Not using a cure nox pot regardless of cure healers is BAD. Trying to DPS is BAD.
It's just stupid things that people can't help but try to do that wipe VS raids. It's not because it's hard.

I'd just like to report VS is down.
Thanks guys for your support.
Gratz Iled on your Myth.

http://www.eq2zone.com/forums/showt...828 <-- Venril Strat and more ... nuff said.

This thread wouldnt be needed if more people decided to visit =)

xpraetorianx wrote:

I've used your site many times and it's very useful but it doesn't stop people messing up.