Player sentiments against Charm, like this, are EXACTLY THE PROBLEM. Classes are bland AS A MOTHER JUNKER with all of these EXCESSIVE, UNDUE nerfs. Now, Troubadors/Coercers are just your run of the mill DPSers/DPS modding noobs. Charm gave them & Coercers priceless, invaluable utility. Escape boring, cookie-cutter limitations on choice, absent all depth. Find the return of loyalists who favored multi-faceted, varied resources. Also, I do definitely think an across-the-board, absolutist reduction of stoneskins would be uncalled for. Maybe only for Beastlords.
Would not be opposed to chanters getting charm back. No thx to troubs charming and evacing from every fight they can't win. Simply not being able to do certain damage sources or all damage sources to a player while they can damage you is completely unbalanced. Sorry you don't have the common sense to see this. 20seconds of not being able to hit a player while they can hit you is unfair for obvious reasons. If you cannot do anything to a player they should not be able to do anything to you. All of those types of buffs should be like the predator sta line endline.
this is off topic.. but yes, this is VERY important. Yes if charm came back, it would have to keep them locked in combat once they cast charm.. the problem was that it took you out of combat. Veil of Notes duration was reduced to 12 seconds.. unless cast before PvP combat.. and most good players know to either mez you, stun/evade/hide or run away for the next 2-5 seconds its up for as for the other abilities... they are fine imo.. if we listened to you.. there would just be one class in the game
did you stop playing pvp a year ago? or longer? or was you talking a bout DA + Parry buff, = a bit too much
Some classes are capable of that and some classes are not. Some classes need to be able to hit you to land cc effects in which they cannot with Veil up. Also you fail to recognize that troubs can mezz stifle evade etc as well. Troubs are basically rangers with CC. " if we listened to you.. there would just be one class in the game " <--- that is a common excuse used to defend overpowered abilities. Reducing or removing the ability to not be able to be hit a troub with melee/ranged attacks while they can still hit you would not make troub like every other class, troubs were troubs before they gained Veil of Notes. Having charm keep you in combat would be a fair trade off for regaining charm. I am all for classes being defined by different abilities but some abilities are just too unbalanced. For instance... predators can parry all attacks with Impenetrable but they also cannot attack during that period. That is balance.
Funnly thing here back in ROK on Naggy people called the game Ever Scout because one or two good scouts could tear a full group of questers apart. With TSO things became balanced due to some nerfs of some ablilities such as charm and the buffing of others some stone skins and such also with the intro of real PvP gear with real usable procs for PvP. Guess what people still killed people we learned how to get past things. TSO or The SK Odyssey as some of us call it brought a huge buff to crusaders mainly SK's and while yes we did ask for them to be toned down and or a nerf nothing really happend but we as players learned to kill them anyway. Please stop asking for the game to be dumbed down even more than it already is. Play smarter
Everyone always tries using the excuse that others want the game to be "dumbed down" or every class made the same when someone asks for more balance. People who play the overpowered classes like to try to quickly shoot down any meaningful suggestions so that they can remain overpowered. I can kill any class in this game. I am not saying I cannot. You are trying to speak condescendingly to get me to fold and it won't happen. You want to be able to damage other players whole they cannot damage you for obvious reasons. Guess what new guy? There was pvp and class definition before these abilities were ADDED to the game. Stop making excuses and trying to keep OP abilities OP. No one should be immune to all damage while they are fully able to damage you, period, let alone for 10+ seconds when you can kill someone in half that time. You "play smarter" and learn how to pvp without immunities to damage sources as your crutch. Also PvP gear with "real useable" procs was introduced during RoK.
but now, they have a 2 second stifle, no charm, 10 second mez and 1 snare, and terrible single target DPS. A Ranger has 3 snares, root, poisons (with stun[if still works]/snare), insane single target dps, can stay max range if they are not stupid.. apart from mez they have better CC abilities than a troub... (i'm including snares). My biggest attack on a geared person does 7.5k dmg MAX.. i of course have CoD which gives me 3 procs of 7k max dmg (if it crits on a well geared toon, after the 30 second potency buff) A ranger can get me to 50% hp in a 0.5 to 1sec CA + Procs, and i have ful 94 gear.. i wouldn't say a troub is like a ranger without Veil of notes, a troub (dirge) would never win a fight against a good playing scout now that stifle lasts 2 seconds. Against someone who is good, it's required to stand any chance at all. Cheap Shot + Evade + EM = 7+ seconds of VoN wasted, predators can use parry buff, so they only get 5 seconds of tiny dmg.. and a swashy.. Delethen knows. can you explain how you would win this fight when the ranger can evade more than you, snare more than you, even with veil of notes? pause at the end and see how much dmg i did to him with my 2 biggest hits + 2 autoattacks + my temps. Without the old stifle, VoN is required to stand any chance.. if we stood still at range both attacking each other, i wouldn't be able to kill him in 12 seconds.. yet, he can get me to 50% hp in less than 1 second + evade more?. This is why we can attack and predators can't THIS is Balance from 10 days ago. -- slowed down 50% but.. i'd swap it for 8 second stifle anyday now that autoattack has been fixed. The problem in this fight for him was that he thought i was probably trying to hide and get out of combat, if he'd have kept max range, i'd have stood zero chance even with VoN.
Before I even finish reading or watching this video I'm going to remind you right now that bards are SUPPORT classes meant to offer medium level scout dps with support abilities to enhance a group. A bard should not be able to kill a predator 1 vs 1 anyways as 1 specializes in dps and killing and one specializes in supporting their group. If you understood class roles this would be alot easier. Anyways I will finish reading and watching your vid now. Edit: Read the rest and watched the video and could have easily won that fight (if you didn't) by evading then mezzing, debuffing, hitting your the many abilities troubs have, VoM, stifle kill. There you go. As a support class you killed a T1 dps class. Is that balance? No. You are right. It isn't. You also could have lead with Veil of Notes which would have given you the pve effects and had 20sec of the ranger not being able to hit you... roll your face on your keyboard... win.
Bard is Support + CC (was).. the reason i've played a bard in EQ1 and EQ2 is for CC... CC classes win 1 v 1s not by insane predator smashing buttons dps.. but by timing abiltiies and using CC. Because a class is not the highest DPS does not mean it can't be the best in 1 v 1s... here you are making a fatal error and i'm finding it difficult to not say something derogatory to you. In fact, that's probably one of the most "crazy" comments i ever heard.. that a Support/CC class should not be able to kill a predator. Enchanters and Bards have ALWAYS been good for 1 v 1s... without sounding egotistical.. they require my thought but have the abilities to kill. you are one of the people in pvp that thinks DPS is king to winning... of course it is when it's really OP and you aren't ready. btw.. is there a paticular troubadour on nagafen that is killing you?... is it me? .. can I ask for your toons name, or can someone else tell me. ok.. so i could easily win without VoN. 1. he has more evades. 2. he can keep max range and snare me to death. 3. If he breaks mez just once i'm dead. 4. VoM? (sorry i don't remember that abbreviation) 5. There is no time to debuff when mezzed + the debuffs do absolutely nothing in pvp now. 6. Stifle lasts 2 seconds now it's been nerfed. 7. roll a troub. i'm glad you posted this post, because now we know you are either out of date or ........ i know about casting the veil of notes before combat.. and yes.. it should be fixed along with DG.. i've said this in a massive thread titled DG Exploit on the old forums.
actually i agree. rangers do have to do a lot if they are good and play the class to the max.. just like ANY class. but it's always been the case, that a bad ranger/assassin could practically do most of your hp before you even started (if they had the gear).. and kill people easily.. of course there is still the ones of exception skill, who you can tell that are good.. keeping range, snaring, hiding etc... e.g. Kilo is probably the best ranger atm that i have seen (there are others that i haven't seen). A Troubadour has the lowest single target dps of all the scouts lol.. .. in fact.. probably has the lowest single target dps out of all classes in pvp (not including healers and some tanks).... I won't fall into your troll trap about troubs, because you obviously don't know anything that you are talking about.. but i will say that you really have no idea about EQ2 PvP on the Nagafen Server, owned by Sony Online Entertainment. If a ranger who catches their prey alone out in an open zone cannot kill their enemy then there is a real problem with the game. Scouts catch each other.. did you know that other scouts have track too.. wow p.s. i don't care if you do or don't know who i am, i'm just a troubadour and i just wanted to know your toons name.. because i'm pretty certain if you PvP'd on nagafen, then i have a video of you dying really easily and making numerous mistakes because you didn't know your class at all. please please, don't say you are Sora.. is that what your sig says????????? l o l
Also the time on his ACT data and chat log do not match up & were clearly pieced together. In addition you can clearly see in the chat text in the video when he asked me to fight him I said "Sure but I have no pvp crit mit so you will easily win". You must have been desperate to pull out this video of a completely off balanced fight and try to use it against me.
I would love to know what OP class I play. Seeing as how I have at least 1 of every arch type btw as in I have a Pally, Zerk, Ranger, Mystic, Temp, Warden, Troub, Wiz, Necro, Illy, Monk, Brig, BL, and a Guard to round things out. Now with all these I do not play them all regularly just every now and then. All of them can seem OP in one way or anouther esp in the right group. However solo they all have thier weakness and it is not my fault or the game develpoers if you as a player cannot find them. I will give you some of them right now if you are fighting a Zerk ( which I am sure you will think is OP ) try range DPS dont hit them with melee that is what heals them. You hit em with a bow or thrown weapon they do not heal. SK again if you are melee damage try some range DPS when you see thier health get low cause if you are in AOE range they will heal. Casters each one is diff Necro for instance keep up the interupts/stuns same with healers scouts get on top of em keep em infront of you and dont let em kite. Learn to read the buffs on your target also and know what they do just like a raid mob such as Levi if the Druid has not pulled the buff of Levi better just use Melee or it get reflected back. As for your retort to my play smarter comment I believe I just gave you a bit of an education so you cannot use your ignorance of how PvP really works as a crutch. Also I started playing on Naggy with the release of ROK and the gear was crap v's anything better than MC gear even then it was not that much better I personaly do not define that as usable. The first real usable PvP gear came out with TSO.
Nothing you said was really on topic or made much sense. You compared 1 class vs 1 class when if you are talking balance you need to compare 1 class to all of the other classes. You gave very generic and almost child-like examples of how to fight certain classes which for the most part just made you look like a newbie repeating some of what someone else told you yet you failed to understand. Also if you started playing on nagafen with the release of RoK then you would know that the good useable pvp gear came out with RoK & decent gear was added to the good gear already out there with TSO. In addition, if you started PvPing during RoK then you missed the years when PvP was great, active, and more PvP involved so you really should not try giving your kiddy list of how to fight other classes to someone who has been PvPing a lot longer than you.
You are aware I assume that DG is complete and absolute garbage in pvp now after 2 successful nerfs...so before you request another nerf sledgehammer to it please be aware of its usefulness or in this case extreme lack thereof.
Perhaps you should be aware of more than just the posts that effect the classes you play. Had you scrolled down a few posts you would see that I was joking with a friend. On the topic though, DG gets it's full PvE duration if precasted.
do you just make things up?? lol .. Intensive had no raided gear... you had a full set of PvP armour + full set of flurry jewlery, and best 2h of anyone on the server.. items that hardly anyone had bcause you geared out your toon on AB, then transfered to nagafen.. then after you never won against undergeered toons with OP autoattack you left. you are funny.. yes everyone knows you, and it's certainly not for your pvp skills
you are correct about an un balanced fight.. raided flurry jewlery + autoattack + best 2h + insane HP+STR (from jewlery) at that time = guaranteed death, but you somehow managed to still lose even with the triple deathsave + heal + CM nothing was pieced together, a whole server witnessed the event and your behaviour you are (in)famous i will give you that
