Two handed

Discussion in 'Fighters' started by Jedicake, Mar 13, 2013.

  1. Malleria Well-Known Member

    lol
  2. Duele Active Member

    One word - Dragonfire
  3. Bchizzle Active Member

    Dragonfire is not even half as much dps as chaos cloud, you might see a good parse with it on a time warp when it resets and you get a 2nd timewarp but otherwise quit trying to make it like its anything special. I mean seriously hop over to flames and see it doing 100k'ish dps on the best parses over there vs 200-300k chaos clouds. Actually please keep pointing out the one monk spell that can actually double cast versus hmm how many do you have? Clearly once again you don't have a clue what your are talking about.
  4. Malleria Well-Known Member

    Bruisers get Dragonfire? Cool, didn't know that. Should seriously nerf SKs btw, amends is way too powerful.
  5. Epixz Member

    ITT duele making an asclown of himself
  6. Jacck Active Member

    Nothing should be done to Crusader's Knight Stance. 2 handers should be fixed, period. Otherwise, you would have the benefit for exactly 2 classes instead of 7. All 6 tanks classes and Beastlords (trololol). Seriously though, fix the 2 handers and forget the change to Knight's Stance. Changing Knights Stance as prescribed would me Sk's and to a lesser extent Pallies way to overpowered.

    P.S. Dragonfire does less dps than Chaos Cloud and both can be reset and TW'd. Death March a Chaos Cloud anyone?
  7. Xaxationlorex New Member

    If you're mad that my buttons get to more then you're buttons, then I'm mad your free dps is better then my free dps, is what this boils down to. Take classes out of the picture ,DW is so much better then 2h its not even funny, if you're in denial, i want your booze, you're drinking better then I am.
    if you took some one with 600ma, 75% flurry, the person dw'ing is going to close to, or more thne double then 2h dps,
    but wait, i have two weapons. I can cleave off limbs, whats your point.
    2h are broken
    dw looks super awsome.
  8. Epixz Member

    to quote corydonn from another thread :
    I date you make less sense with the same amount of words you just used.
  9. Jacck Active Member

    It's still the 2 handers themselves being broken and changing Knight Stance doesn't fix the problem but instead compound it for when 2handers are tuned with Knight's stance factored in.
  10. Sneaka New Member

    Hey guys sorry to ask, I'd just like to see if anyone can clarify for me before I go and test it once I'm done here in VP.
    I literally just came back a month ago or so to assist and back when I was on more often, I tried to DW on my zerk but found that the 100% AE auto attack only applied to 1 weapon and that my offhand weapon was also barred from flurry.

    Has there been an update which allows Main and Off-Hand weapons to Flurry? Can an Off-Hand AE auto attack?
  11. Epixz Member

    they nerfed that cause swashbuckler were doing too much dps back in EoF or something, assassin had their panties ina bunch. (wich also nerfed berserker)
  12. Silzin Active Member

    Yes your Off Hand can do everything your Main Hand can. this was changes some time during SF i think, and ever since 2H has not been as good as 2 1H.

    this has been the point of the 3 page thread
  13. Sneaka New Member

    Thanks Silz and Epix, it seems to be rather hard to get hard factual information here, most of it is bs opinions from grumpy children that don't bother to back up any of what they say with actual in game mechanics.

    Mah Wepownz do moar dmg bcuz I said so get ohur it and do it leik I does >insert random I parse this<~ <- this trash helps no one
  14. Kalmaraa Active Member

    ONe thing that should be noted is that some tank classes do require a shield for them to function properly. Guardian is a good example of this. I like to use all my buffs when it comes to fighting a named, especially the last one in a heroic or raid zone. Using a 2 handed weapon takes away my ability to use some of those buffs. My suggestion would be to look at your class and see if it has any such abilities that might be affected. If no then go for it.
  15. Priority Well-Known Member

    Did you even bother to READ the thread? Prolly not, thanks for chiming in with your winning perspective.
    StaticLex likes this.
  16. Ardur Duradan Well-Known Member

    lol, have you considered that this assumption of an intentional design choice might be more of your opinion than an actual fact? This is a thread about the changing the way the game plays, obviously the devs have been asking how to change classes, so any design choices can be on the table for discussion. But honestly, Brawlers tank anything in DoV and get to out DPS alot of classes in recklessness, and you want to think its by intentional design. They get alot more than a crusader as a design choice? Pull your head out lol. Its like you are trying to say lack of balance is a design choice now?


    No offense but I disagree. The problem here is lack of foresight after the AA/stat revamp. We used to have the archetype AAs that required us to use a certain weapon. It was obviously restrictive, but it gave weapons more of a purpose. Now we have a stat system that is tuned to reflect performance, yet most crusaders are kind of stripped of any benefit to using a 2 hander when tanking/dpsing. Yet this game makes weapons for us to use. I agree that the AE auto damage is gonna be higher. But I have never parsed near a monk in recklessness(unless its multi target encounter). I dont know that much about auto attack multipliers, but at this moment I dont think I can even come near to outparsing a monk that performs the same as me. I also think its silly to talk about how it will eventually be nerfed, if it gets out of hand it will be and thats that. At the present moment we are still behind in terms of being able to get something out of our weapons compared to brawlers. OR maybe I am bad. I could be bad for all i know. I personally feel that DW dps should be a bit above 2hander dps but not much.
  17. The_Cheeseman Well-Known Member

    The difference between two classes' autoattack DPS is but one factor in their overall balance. Brawlers have higher autoattack DPS, crusaders have other advantages to compensate. I won't bother with specifics, since anything I cite will simply be immediately denied, but that is the intention. I do not play a crusader (my pally alt is only 90), so I can't comment on exactly how effectively that goal is currently being accomplished, but claiming that crusaders are worse than brawlers merely by comparing autoattack DPS and ignoring other factors is not a strong argument.

    I don't see any data to conclude that brawlers are, on average, doing more overall DPS than crusaders. Everybody has anecdotal evidence that just so happens to support their own viewpoint, but none of it is verifiable or statistically relevant. I don't claim to know either way, myself, but a lot of people in this thread appear to be making the implicit assumption that this is true. Even if it IS true, damage output is, again, only a single factor in class-balance, so it is entirely possible that whichever class is outperforming in that area is designed to do so, as compensation for other mechanical drawbacks.

    Two-handed weapons are not as good for raw DPS as one-handed weapons. This is nothing new, and has been the case for basically the entire life of the game. Some classes were designed to dual-wield, some were not given that option. I fail to see why every weapon style should be equal in terms of raw DPS?

    In short, there are a lot of people who like to claim that something "should" be so, without saying why. Have you tried to make your case without using the word "should"?
  18. Ardur Duradan Well-Known Member

    Engage silly text color

  19. Silzin Active Member

    that Quote was about the fact that the Dev's can see discrepancies of DPS VERY easy, but not problems in fun factors. so the fact that 2h do less dps then 2 1h must be be intended. also the fact that Crusaders over all get more dps from non Autoattack then Brawlers must also be by design. since they can look at the numbers for all servers and all raids and see the averages, and the peeks and such. if there was problems with the dps output of classes they would and should address them. they may also be addressing some dps problems in GU 66, i dont know... i dont think any one knows atm.
  20. Bchizzle Active Member

    Sorry that as a Paly you cannot parse with brawlers. I would agree that perhaps a Paly might be ok with a DPS increase, however, it should bring you inline with SK's parsing but absolutely not buff up SK's DPS when they certainly don't need anymore. Asking for Knights Stance to be allowed for all crusaders wearing a 2 hander not onlly buffs palys but also buffs SK's who don't need it and effectively overpowers that class.