The truth is.. why should a new/returning player be handed all the stuff the rest of us worked so hard to get? I love to see returning players, I was one of them. Yes it took me 2 years to lvl the playing field, but now I am there. Even had I been handed all the goodies and buffs at the beginning, after a 5 year break, there was still many things to learn on how to play in the world of ascensions et al. Buck it up Buttercup. This isn't the game where everyone gets the same trophy. The parallels to RL is what makes this game awesome.. like hard work, and time dedicated is rewarded.
And this is why we don't retain the majority of returning players. Most returning players simply aren't as invested in the game upon return. If you told me it was going to take 2 years to get caught up after a long break, I'd laugh at you and find something better to do with my time. This game's population is not great, it's not even good. As of the sale, this was Daybreak's lowest performing MMO, by a considerable margin. That's not good for anyone. Returning players need to be presented with a short, clear path to getting caught up or we're not going to keep them. People value their time and money, so they're going to go where there's a more immediate return.
I am a returning player. I have to say... the auction house is ridiculous. Spell books for instance... if I want to buy a level 10 adept, people are wanting thousands of Plat for it. Where is a new player going to get that kind of money? Heck... or even a returning player. Sure you could research spells when you get higher, but by the time you get it to a decent tier, you've already out leveled it or have paid real $$ to instant boost it.
This quote is basically perfect. In older MMOs there was an endless treadmill system with no catch up which is fine....untill the same people have been on the treadmills for literally years. I understand the veteran players have a gripe with new players being handed catchup items but you basically give new/returning players a quick path to play end game or just slowly lose players over time and the game dies and the servers go offline and you cant play your game you have invested half your life in.
Do we really need another thread with the two of you going at each other on something that fills page after page on a different thread? The prices are ridiculous by the standards of even a few years ago. Which at that time were ridiculous by the standards of a few years before that. But it means that there are many rich lazy people that will pay fortunes for collectibles and harvested materials. And some of the items that the overseer missions reward. Getting hundreds of thousands of platinum your first few weeks just takes a bit of determination and access to the broker.
The broker isn't about equity based on player level. It's about who will pay how much. There's competition for low-level books from people who are levelling transmuting, for example. As a new player, you want to go out and harvest, all the time, as you are moving between quests and other tasks. Pick up shinies. When you get rare harvested materials, ask in the Crafting channel to get a player crafter to make that stuff into Expert spells and Mastercrafted gear. Most will do so for a reasonable tip (expect to pay at least the fuel cost x2 as a minimum, the more generous you can be, the more likely the person will craft for you again). You honestly don't need more than Expert-level spells unless you are raiding on-level. Masters and better are nice to have, but the non-raid content doesn't require them. If you find a cheap Master, then yes, nab it, but until you get towards end-game, I'd go with Experts all the way. Collection items that you don't use and extra rare harvest materials can often be sold on the broker for insane prices. Even pretty low-level stuff, sometimes, as you have noted. I support 13 toons on selling shinies, for the most part. (My crafting toons do sell some of their crafted goods as well, particularly furniture, food, etc.) New and returning players that want to be instantly ready for top raid guild slots, that's a whole 'nother ball of wax. You do not HAVE to be in a top tier raid guild to raid, just for starters. But if you want All The Things and must have them immediately, then be prepared to spend real-world cash to get them, /shrug
A good alternative to finding a crafter is becoming a crafter - it isn't difficult. The scholar craft that goes with your adventuring class is very useful since it can make upgrades for your spells or combat arts. Tailor or armorer are also useful while leveling. There are three daily tradeskill quests that help you raise your level steadily as well as crafting quests at most levels and rush orders after the very beginning for quick progress. The crafts I didn't mention have value as well but I find them less useful for a newish character. Though a new character can become maximum level in an incredibly short time using agnostic dungeons and collectibles if the player is looking to skip almost all of the game's content.
Thinking it's okay to take 2 years to catch up without spending money is a hilariously atrocious take. Players like you that only want to be better than others because of a mechanic that makes it impossible for others to catch up are the armpit of MMO communities. Wanting to feel good about yourself by having stuff that's impossible for others to have is sad and pretty telling of your mindset. I'm fully caught up and want catch up mechanics for any returning players because I'm not so insecure that I need an unfair advantage. The irony in your comment is that your "not everybody gets a trophy" comment contradicts the fact that you want to be able to hold up your trophy and claim you're better than others because you've been playing for 2 years and they haven't. If you're better than somebody else, you shouldn't need a time gated unfair advantage...
Question: Answer: After posing the question, it would appear that you answered it within two sentences. Nicely done. If my memory serves, for the first half of EQ2s lifespan, each new expansion made it practical for a new or returning player to catch up in 1-3 months. It still required some time, effort, learning and development to achieve, but the goal was within reasonable reach. For those who support a system where it can take 2 years to "lvl the playing field", I am not going to try convincing you otherwise. It's a preference, each to their own. I simply hold the view that such a system will cause more harm than good to a games population.
I just returned after being gone 12 years. My highest level character was 62 when I stopped playing. And I don't want any easy help from Daybreak. I'm perfectly happy playing catch up, the game is fun as hell, no matter my level. The only help I've had since being back was winning Honeybush's global "choose the song and artist" contest. I couldn't believe 1 million Plat, that's going to help A LOT, it actually paid to be an old guy who knew early '70's ZZ top songs. I came back here from ESO, where all of my characters are fully equipped with all of the best gear for the end game, and I've pretty much accomplished everything you can in that game. I would hate to jump to the end game here from level 62, I would end up missing a lot of fun content. Anybody who thinks they are entitled to the stuff players who have stuck with the game have, without putting in any work to get it, is just sad imo. Just play the game, have fun, and don't freak out if it takes 4-6 months to get caught up.
On the live servers: Do the simple daily quest at the top of your quest tracker. You earn Loyalty merchant tokens that you can buy bags of plat with if you're Gold subbed, that have 500 plat each in them. And everyone subbed or not, and on live servers and the TLs, can do Quo's gathering quests in Isle of Mara if you're just beginning EQ2 and you're broke. If you're on a low level character and the upper echelons get too tedious/long/dangerous, reroll a level 5 alt and do the first couple quests over and over. You randomly get 17g to 33g for each turn in, you just have to be level 5 to start the quest. I always run to the crafting trainer for free to start my crafting training first, but another player said it works even if you haven't started training crafting yet. On the TLs, Quo's gathering quest line is more tedious to run back and forth to, because you have to run to TS to get the Isle of Mara bell, so I make sure I train first just in case.
If you do the daily mission (Kill X mobs, Craft X items, Gather X resources, etc.) and get your Loyalty Tokens, you can trade 5 of those tokens for 500 Plat at the Loyalty Merchant in Qeynos or Freeport. I've got about 300 of those tokens from doing the daily quests, and that can help you get started. Also, selling "shinies" on the broker can net you some good coin, too. That's just a couple of suggestions to get you started on the path to riches!
With all due respect, you are level 62 and know nothing about the end game balancing that is being discussed. It's great you're having fun, but this is a bit outside of your area of expertise. Some people don't enjoy playing games if they can't compete, which makes time gated catch up mechanics a deal breaker. If there were a thread discussing low level questing, I certainly wouldn't show up to give my 2 cents because it's not something I regularly do or care about. You can enjoy the game your way, but telling other people to enjoy the game YOUR way while having no clue what the end game is like makes 0 sense.
Since the title of this thread is "To New & Returning Players," I don't see where FarmerHuck's observations are out of bounds. The players of this game encompass a variety of playing styles, and I would assume that includes new and returning players. My current understanding is that most of the game's revenue comes from marketplace purchases and subscriptions. The choices of the designers are going to reflect that. If someone can catch up in a short timeframe without spending money in the marketplace, then that undermines the marketplace as a revenue stream. If someone is only interested in the game if he or she can be competitive in a short timeframe, that person is unlikely to be able to hold an interest in playing month after month. That kind of approach undermines the subscription as a revenue stream. I certainly agree that the complexity of the game has gone through the roof since the early days. It's also true that many of the requirements for squeezing the best performance out of a toon are hidden. Even so, there is a community of people that will happily offer suggestions for speeding things up here and on Discord if the questions are asked. Sometimes folks will start a thread here with a complaint that could just as easily be posed as a question that will yield the same results with less friction.
It seems there are many that want to return and jump into being top dog in a week. Not going to happen. Not enough money to make it happen. This game is too old and too much content AND requirements that need to be done in that old content to be top dog in a month, let alone what they appear to be asking for. Those that return and pick up where they left off and relearned their class and continued on are doing fine. That neat boost bauble they get does more harm than good because it gives them false expectations. Cheers to FarmHuck. He will get there and do it the right way, not the 'free' way. And it won't take him forever to do it plus he will experience content that the boosted players probably will never see.
Nobody said you should be able to catch up in a week. Literally nobody. You guys want to exaggerate because you pretend people either want to be able to catch up in a week or people don't want you to be caught up for a year. There's a middle ground, which is very obvious if you put your bias aside and think for 2 seconds. Right now, you can't even get a mercenary buff unless you pay and your mount and familiar buffs will be worse if you don't get the p2w versions. If you want to play this game at the top level, it takes a lot of money to get properly caught up and skip the 6 months worth of grinding overseers quests for mount, Merc, and familiar leveling potions. That's just a fact. I understand you guys want to circle jerk about how players don't "need" this or that, but you clearly don't understand that some people only have fun in this game by clearing the raid content and competing to be the best in the world as a guild and at their chosen class. If you don't, that's fine. Nobody cares. However, stop pretending it's objectively just fine for it to take that long because YOU don't play the game that way.
No, he's fine to have his opinion, but telling others to "just play the game, who cares if it takes 4-6 months to get caught up" shows he understands nothing about the mindset of top end players. Telling people that want to be able to catch up and have the ability to compete to "just play the game" is absolutely pointless. Again, if you're just a casual player then play the game your way. Nobody cares. But trying to tell top end returning players how to enjoy the game is about as acceptable as them telling you the exact opposite, which would be to hurry up and get caught up so you can try to beat other guilds to raid mobs. Everybody plays the game differently. If somebody complains about the fact it takes way too long to get caught up and you don't think so (not YOU specifically, but people with that mindset), spare us the ultra casual "just take your time" shtick because you clearly aren't playing the game at remotely the same level. I've had a multitude of friends that contemplated coming back, then didn't once they found out how time gated AND expensive it would be to get caught up. It's ridiculous. If you need an unfair advantage by returning players being UNABLE to catch up for 6 months, then you might not be as good at the game as you think (again, not you specifically, just the people that argue that as a collective whole). Everybody wins when the player base grows because players return and have mechanics that allow them to be useful in a reasonable amount of time.
I don't raid. I came to this game and every single character I have I started at level 1. When I go to play a different game, I start at level 1. I don't ask for free. I don't ask for ways to bypass what those that have been there years had to do in order to get where they are. I don't complain because I cannot afford what they have. I don't expect the game developers to make it easier for me because I am not at the top of the hill. I know I will have to climb that hill like everyone else did. In EQ2 I do often see a new player or a newly returning player after a long absence struggling, GIVE them large bags, so they do not have to fight with small bags. I DO often make them expert spells for some of their most needed spells upgrades FREE using MY rares, MY fuel, MY time. I DO generally GIVE them enough plat so that they can at least get some of the basics as they play. And usually after spending hours of MY time trying to help show them where things are and tell them a few of the changes and basics they will need to progress, they either pretend I never existed OR they quit playing in a short time not bothering to return send a tell saying "hi" or even a thank you. Don't preach to me. It takes ME months to level up my familiars, my mounts, my mercs. I get NO special anything there. Oh, and I have given away MERCs to returning players FREE. I am not special. There are many old players that do the same thing I do. But exaggerate, I don't think so. I see it in general chat. I read it all here. If you don't want to do the time or the work, that is up to you. I welcome every returning and new player I meet and do my best to assist them in getting started. That is all I plan to do and if that isn't enough, I will be happy to stop doing that too.
10 years ago I was a hardcore gamer and I was very invested... I used to play a lot, and I thought it was normal that with each expansion everything was reset and my hard earned raid gear was replaced immediately by the first spoils. I stopped 10 years ago and came back on December 1st. My character is below yours because of the ethereal and ethereal shadow coins which are an absolute INJUSTICE as they impact all characters in the accounts. and even with this drawback, my character has already caught up with many former players. You always stay ahead in parse only because of these ethereals. money? it's easy to find. We just criticize the ethereals that just prevent from being on equal terms and playing heroic. We are not in PVP but in collaborative! so once again what does it change for you? you keep your money, your items, ...
