TLE Masters vs Adept 3s

Discussion in 'Test Server Forum' started by Pikaboo, Aug 18, 2015.

  1. Pikaboo Member

    We need to increase the gap between adept 3s and Masters at this point, adept 3s and masters are very small % difference I remember when Master spells and adept 3 had a larger gap between each other. At the moment it doesn't Make sense to purchase masters over adept 3s this will effect people even buying Masters. I understand Part of the reason is the Grandmaster revamp but since these servers wont have that, we should revert it.

    Sheep likes this.
  2. Kelvani Well-Known Member

    My understanding is.. they do not plan to revamp something they will have to redo at a later time and that stuff like this could impact the normal server. I understand your concern, though I admit to being somewhat confused by your referencing adept 3's. The scale is as follows, to the best of my knowledge:

    Apprentice (everyone gets this upon leveling)
    Journeyman (player made common)
    Adept (dropped semi common)
    Expert (player made rare)
    Master (dropped rare)
    Grandmaster (not applicable yet other than the one you can pick once every 10 levels)

    I assume that you are referring to Expert when you say adept 3?
  3. Meirril Well-Known Member

    When spell names were revamped adept 3s became expert spells.
    Feldon likes this.
  4. Feldon Well-Known Member

    Old vs. New naming:
    • Apprentice I -> Apprentice
    • Apprentice II -> removed
    • Apprentice III -> removed
    • Apprentice IV -> Journeyman
    • Adept -> Adept
    • Adept III -> Expert
    • Master -> Master
    • Master II -> Grandmaster
    They have always been a 3-4% increase in power as you go up each rung in the ladder.

    Ancient spells -- there are only 4-6 per class -- are an 8-10% increase in power over the Grandmaster. You can see which Ancient spells exist for each class at EQ2U - Spell / Combat Art Browser.

    P.S. Adept II and Adept IV were originally planned but never used.
  5. Kahleem Active Member

    Unless they're going to increase the power of Masters, I vote a no to this.

    Masters are currently super-overpriced on TLP (5plat for a level 30 master??), and do not provide much difference between Experts. There is currently no reason for me to purchase a master except for level 50 spells which I farm myself, again...overpriced otherwise.

    It make would no sense to reduce Experts in power, and would only be acceptable if they moved GM and Masters up by about another 5% or 10% blanket across the board.
  6. Vunder Well-Known Member

    To paraphrase the Devs.

    The game is designed around expert level spells. Anything above expert to there to give you an edge as a player and is not needed at all..aka whippin out your epeen to impress other epeen swingers.

    The spells are perfectly fine. They don't need changed.
    Filly67 likes this.
  7. Seefar Well-Known Member

    Me: I want to know what happened to adept IIs.
  8. Meirril Well-Known Member

    They never existed.
    Apprentice 1 - your starting spells.
    Apprentice 2 - the spells that trainers use to sell.
    Apprentice 3 - never available.
    Apprentice 4 - Handcrafted spells. Now called Apprentice.
    Adept 1 - dropped book, now called Adept.
    Adept 2 - never available.
    Adept 3 - Mastercrafted spells, now called Expert.
    Adept 4 - never available.
    Master 1 -dropped book, now called Master.
    Master 2- Available from Grandmaster class ability. Now available from crafting. Always been named Grandmaster.
    Master 3 and 4 - Never available? Ancient spells should be either the theoretical Master 3 or 4. Before Ancient spells were introduced these classifications existed but players had no access to them.
  9. Seefar Well-Known Member

    Sorry, yeah, I knew that. My bad for not being clear I was poking fun at the original Makers for putting in a teaser that never got realised :)
    Noizette likes this.
  10. Pikaboo Member

    Right, But on TLE servers, we cannot create grandmaster spells, So my suggestion is that WE INCREASE Masters damage. Because right now, there is a only slight number increase, because the revamped it making grandmaster spells.
  11. Feldon Well-Known Member

    Apprentice I became Apprentice. Apprentice IV became Journeyman. Apprentice II and Apprentice III could absolutely be crafted by players from the launch of the game until the 2nd and 3rd qualities of crafting items were largely removed. Remember when you could make a worked or rough oak bench?

    Actually these were called Master II from launch until LU52.
    Ancients are technically Tier 11 spells which is Master III. This leaves room for Tier 12 some day.
  12. Kappa New Member

    I agree. Having to farm for masters had actually been a really enjoyable aspect of TLE long forgotten on live. The gap should be increased so that this aspect of the game is valued by more of the player base instead of die hard min/maxers.
  13. Meirril Well-Known Member

    You also don't have access to AA. Should the TLE servers have all of the AA abilities added to their normal spells because the TLE servers lack access to AA as well?

    Let me get my soap box and my old man cane out here for a moment:

    "Back in my day everybody used adept 1 spells and we spent hours harvesting for adept 3 spells. Master spells were things raiders spent their entire carrier fighting for and they liked it. Kids these days think they need Grandmaster spells. Well, you don't. All you need is Rock on a Stick model 1 or Rock on a Stick model 2 and adept spells to kill the raid mobs your facing. Just like we did.

    Isn't that why your on the Good Old Days server?"

    Grandmaster spells were widely introduced with the AoM expansion. TLE should get them when AoM gets voted in, like every other feature introduced with an expansion.
    Seefar, Vunder, Lodrelhai and 2 others like this.
  14. Bashem Well-Known Member

    We have enough spell/ca grades in the game now any more would just make spells/ca more confusing!
  15. Zeozx New Member

    This was not his point and no masters where not only available to raiders it was dropped from named mobs even when original vanilla was around the difference in tle and true vanilla the vanilla masters where worth farming honestly I only farm named now for gear master are truly useless icefall 3 for example adept 3 dmg is only about 5 points difference so if I have master I can do a min of 5 dmg different back in the day adept 3 to master was about 100 difference in dmg so they need to scale back adept 3 or scale up masters some bc waiting on aom to make masters worth obtaining is a waste of content
  16. Meirril Well-Known Member

    I didn't say masters only dropped from raid mobs, I said raiders spent their entire career chasing masters. But thanks for trying to quote me, even if you failed.

    If masters aren't enough of an upgrade for you, then congratulations you can save yourself a lot of effort and just spend more time harvesting. If you think the only difference between an expert spell and a master spell is damage then your going to overlook the whole 25% harder to resist thing, which when you are aiming for monsters over your level makes a difference. Not a 25% difference, but enough for raiders to think its worth while. Not all spells are made equally, and amongst the few hundred spells at each tier there can be some real losers, but I think the entire argument that masters aren't good enough so we need GM spells is ridiculous.
    Seefar and Mermut like this.
  17. Tharrakor Well-Known Member

    Nothing will be resisted with all these casting skills on gear.

    I agreed that masters aren't big enough increase. At lvls 40-50 I vendor most masters for 17g because they aren't selling for higher on the broker anyways. Unless ur lucky and find a pet master. Nerf experts or boost masters. Honestly I would rather they left masters as they are and nerf Xperts, we are all OP enough as we are.
  18. Zeozx New Member

    Any your obviously don't read. noone has asked for GM spells... We simply want masters to make a difference, and when an expert is 16-20% harder to resist and a master is 23-25% harder i mean is 9% really all that much? I do look at stuff like that, and i do see what you're saying, but you overlook the point if you go back to vanilla day's and compare masters then to masters now in comparison to what experts/adept 3's looked like you'll see the overwhelming difference in them.
  19. Azian Well-Known Member

    Masters do make a difference as is. I don't have a way of going back and verifying the 2004 numbers to today but my recollection is similar to what Feldon already noted above and that they have always been a somewhat smallish % increase going from A3/expert to master.

    No change is needed in my opinion. I also think this is the type of thing that is EXTREMELY unlikely to change even if the devs agreed with the premise. They'd have to go and change every single spell and CA from 1-50 (and beyond) either on the expert side or on the master side. I simply don't see that happening.
    Seefar likes this.
  20. AstroElventy New Member

    need nerf a3 or revamp m1. if no = nobody will try farm m1- like never, because nobody will buy= minus one aspect of the game