(The process of) Leveling Crafting is Exceedingly Boring.

Discussion in 'Tradeskill Discussion' started by ARCHIVED-Tatwi, Mar 1, 2012.

  1. ARCHIVED-Rainy Guest

    what it sounds to me like is that EQ2 system is RNG heavy on the making item part, and SWG was rng heavy on the gathering your resources part.
    and I HATED interdependancy for one reason only, WORTS. the fact that Alchemists basically owned the soul of every other crafter in the darn game and didn't need jack squat from anyone else to do so. as an armorer, I HAD to have tempers. I couldn't make anything without them. but I literally had nothing to offer an alchemist other then money..and they knew that. and it was the same with the other professions to. so they price gouged the heck out of everyone.
    now SWG seemed to have trumps of customization. that would be nice to have...though not sure for stats. cause then if you didn't get the right materials to get the 'best' stats...well you might as well not even bother. but for looks, that's be nice. maybe be able to get player made outfits that are similar to the massive influx of things going to the marketplace, hmm?
  2. ARCHIVED-hortefoutre Guest

    Agreed with the OP, domino made the process less tedious with crafter AAS and tradeskill quests. But I still hate the button pushing part.
    I have no better system to propose but Eq2 team should try to make tradeskill way more fun.
  3. ARCHIVED-Mermut Guest

    I disagree with the premise that RNG is back weighted (during the processing phase) in EQ2. One of the things I like best about EQ2's crafting is that most failures to craft an item are my fault, as a player. I missed a key reaction or 3 (or had cat step on my keyboard ;)). Once you learn the 'cycle' of crafting, you know exactly when a counter can come up, and just watch for it. I agree that it can get dull sometimes, but then I find mindless dungeon grinding can get equally boring. EQ2s strongest point is that it has so MANY different aspects. Crafting, harvesting, quests, shinies, decorating, grinding, instances, raids, etc. There's no way they can make it so every aspect of the game appeals to every player, but they've done a pretty good job at giving every player a number of things they DO like.
  4. ARCHIVED-Rijacki Guest

    Mermut wrote:
    Agreed. The crafting process of EQ2 has as much to do with the RNG as fighting mobs does on the adventure side (which is also just pushing buttons, if you really think about it, with almost the same degree of interaction and feedback to the process). If you use the wrong reactive/buff at the wrong times or miss too many of the significant events, it's the same as using a bad casting/CA order, not healing/curing, bad positioning, etc.
    Just as there are poor adventure players, there are also those who don't have the crafting system managed well. Just as there are better adventure players, there are also those who manage the crafting system better. The better players often have a hard time understanding why others decry the system, just look at the so-called casuals vs raiders threads for an example of that on the adventure side.
    Every month or so there will sprout up a thread exactly like this on the crafting process. Usually it's someone new to crafting and, just like the OP for this threa, it includes demads to change the crafting process to something that individual would find more engaging (or less effort as the flip side) in exactly the same way there are threads popping up every month or so on how thus and so self-proclaimed casual (or even a new player) complains about how they want thus and adventure aspect changed to suit how they would prefer to play.
    There are players who LIKE this form of crafting system (there are players who wish it wouldn't have changed from the original, or hadn't changed with a couple exceptions). There are players who LIKE the various types of adventuring content. There are even players who like this crafting and like the various types of adventuring content. For them to like it and the OP (or others not to like it) really only comes down to gameplay preferences.
  5. ARCHIVED-Tatwi Guest

    Rijacki wrote:
    I am not new. Not to EQII, not to crafting.
    The reason threads pop up about this issue frequently is because crafting is very popular (as the recent poll confirmed) and because the crafting proccess is exceedingly boring.
    Comparing the crafting process the combat process is invalid, because:
    • mobs do not spawn out of a combat station placed in a house
    • there are more than 6 combat abilities available to players
    • mobs have more than 3 abilities to counter
    • combat can happen in groups
    • there are thousands of combat quests
    • there are dozens of zones to engage in combat
    • there is a virtually unlimited amount of instances to combat within
    • and so on...
    All you're really saying is that you like the system to be too boring for the majority of people to engage in, because it makes you a special snow flake for liking it.
  6. ARCHIVED-retro_guy Guest

    I much prefer EQ2 crafting, mainly because SWG doesn't even exist anymore.
    I loved levelling my carpenter, even when there were subs involved.
    However I did take about 6 years to level my alchie, in the end the crafting writs were the only way to go, they make it go fast.
  7. ARCHIVED-retro_guy Guest

    feldon30 wrote:
    Well that's where you guys are going wrong.
    1-2-3 are the durability buffs, you need to be using 4-5-6 for the progress buffs, and only use the durability buffs of the durability bar starts getting dangerously close to losing the 4th bar.
    Time you presses with the sound effects and don't use a button if the "boosh" sound is about to come, as that's when the icons come up that you need to counter, you don't want a button queued up incse it's not the right one to counter the effect.
    And yeah, I fall asleep at the workbench all the time.
  8. ARCHIVED-Tatwi Guest

    retro_guy wrote:
    1-2-3 was a figure of speech.
  9. ARCHIVED-Rijacki Guest

    Tatwi wrote:
    I did not stoop to insulting you, please leave insults out of it. I actually didn't say whether I like it or not, that is your assumption. You also insult and characterise people who don't 100% agree with you in derogatory terms. That isn't needed for a discussion. Your opinion is valid for you. The opinions of others are valid for them.
    The crafting process IS like adventuring combat. Both push buttons. Period. It doesn't matter that there are more or less buttons for one to push (and there are many discussions and disputes over whether or not each class has more than a handful, 6 or so, -useful- buttons to push or whether or not it's better to put them all into a single button as a macro to push over and over). It doesn't matter that there are more zones to push buttons in for one than the other or even that there are more quests for one than the other (up until Domino was the tradeskill dev there were -no- quests for crafting other than the writs which were even missing for a long span of time, at least a year). Crafting can be done in groups even in a raid sized group, even if each individual member is not working on the exact same thing at the exact same time. Mobs don't spawn, but the events to counter do occur. Mobs don't respawn in many locations either or don't spawn out of the one thing your killing. Each mob you take on in combat is like a single recipe. The PROCESS, the mechanics of crafting and combat are remarkably similar.
    Should crafting have more quests? Right now, at certain times of the year, it's possible to get to the mid-30s or even higher without crafting more than a small handful of recipes that are in scribed books for your class. There are those who like questing (either for crafting or adventuring) and those who do not.
    Should there be group content for crafting? Each attempt to add some of that dynamic is met with loud cries of derision and insistance that crafting only be solo-able. Have you done one of the crafting instances? In beta they were going to be only completeable by a group (i.e. shorter time they had to be completed in which would have required crafters working together) with only the Mara daily for solo. But that was loudly and voriciously complained about, so the completion time was left more open ended allowing soloist to do it but with a reduced potential to get the best rewards (which has also raised complaints, of course).
    Should there be crafting required in adventure zones for certain adventure content to be completed? That, too, was tried back near launch and was met with loud complaints from several sides.
    You can take a portable station 2.0 into virtually any zone in the game. Thus it IS possible to crafting in nearly unlimited locatons. Yes, you would also have to take resources with you, but how is that not like needing to take along armor, weapons, possibly potions, etc as an adventurer? Yes, you would have to plan for the amount of crafting you want to do. How is that different than an adventurer preparing to go into a zone? As for zones specificially and only designed for crafting, yes there are fewer of those. Should there be more? They added a new one with Frostfell, they added the crafting instances with TSO, perhaps they will add more. Will they ever equal the number of zones available for adventuring? unlikely, but the crafting game is not where the majority of the players spend their time even if they do like crafting.
    I am glad there have been improvements to the crafting process and to the crafting experience overall since it was gutted near the release of KoS (LU 20-something). I hope they continue to add Options for players to do in crafting.
    I, personally, preferred the crafting process at launch (with the exception of providing the perfect greed/gouge situation) and also, personally, preferred the pre-NGE crafting system of SWG. I know many who didn't like the EQ2 crafting process at launch or even after the cross-crafting books were introduced (taking out the single class dependancy and allowing everyone to make all their own subcomponents). I know many who like the crafting process now. I know many who like a crafting process they can largely ignore (or even, sadly, automate). I know many who like a crafting process with absolutely zero player interaction other than handing stuff to an NPC and getting a finished product later. I know many who like the EQ1 click-click-hope-item or WoW's click-click-item. I know many who prefer Vanguard's system (where if you didn't happen to have the right counter agents to random events in your crafting interface before you start crafting no knowing what potential event would occur, you fail completely). And so on.
    The system you find "too boring for the majority of people to engage in" might be the system someone else does like for whatever reason and that doesn't make them a "special snowflake" any more than it makes you a "special snowflake" for disliking it. It doesn't even make them any more childish to say "here are some things you might not now" to try to show you what they like, than for you to demand it needs to be changed now now now now just to suit what you think is the only possible way it should be.
  10. ARCHIVED-retro_guy Guest

    Originally the crafting stations were to be interactive, whatever that meant. Perhaps to counter bad effects e.g. the book icon comes up you had to click the book on the desk, I can only imagine how awful that would have been.
    Could they be mini games? There are hundreds of highly addictive mini Java games around, one of those pops up when you start a combine.
    Crafting could be greatly improved, but I'd hate to lost the old system though as it's fast-as to make items, afterall, once you've levelled to 90 you don't want to spend forever farting about to make just one item (WORTS anyone). Currently if I want to make a few hundred itsm on my carpenter, it's very easy and quick, I relly don't want the system slowed down to just make levelling more exciting.
  11. ARCHIVED-feldon30 Guest

    Rijacki wrote:
    I have four level 90 crafters all with their epics. It's not only "noobs" who have expressed how dull they feel the crafting process itself is. I couldn't tell you how many guild levels I've grinded by rush orders for hours straight til I wanted to puke.
    When 1 person says something, you can dismiss it. When 2 people say it, well maybe they're copycats. But if 3 people say it, then maybe it's an organization. And if 50 people say it, then that my friend is a movement. With apologies to Arlo Guthrie.
    Sorry, but I don't agree with the idea that crafting is basically the same as adventuring. It's like saying that Dungeon Maker Avatars (which have 4 buttons on long recast timers) are barely indistinguishable from adventure classes which use 25+ buttons. A Yugo and a Ferrari both have 4 wheels. The similarities end there.
    I'm glad you are happy with the current crafting process. But can you try express it without taking a swipe at other people who disagree with you?
    retro_guy wrote:
    Back when I started crafting, you had to arrange your own hotbars with the reaction arts you wanted. For whatever reason, I put Progress on the left, and Durability on the right and I've kept them that way. So yes, the default UI has Progress on the right, but that's not how mine is set up.
    BTW when I started crafting, you had to manage your power, and completing a rush order within the alloted time certainly was not a foregone conclusion. These days, I typically finish a rush order with over 4 minutes left on the clock.
    retro_guy wrote:
    Unfortunately the sound effects exacerbate the sleep process.
    I wish they'd give us a little puzzle, or some path that we have to fill in. For accessibility reasons, it should be doable with 1 hand and without any kind of special coordination. It doesn't have to be Sodoku or Pipe Dream but 3 buttons every 4 seconds is torture.
    One of the reasons I liked pristine bonus is it gave me a break from the monotony of rush orders. Cracking open the recipe book before each recipe was a little respite.
  12. ARCHIVED-ratbast Guest

    crafting is amazing. crafting has huge potential, but it is currently a shadow of what it could be. i dont understand what is holding soe up. its a blank slate, an empty universe. time and again, soe pits crafting against the marketplace. the correct conflict should be between crafters and a task (instance) or crafters and each other (broker/comission bids) or crafters and raiders (many ways) or crafters and an artificial market (fake stock exchange). SOE plz stop shooting yourself in the foot. if all you give crafters is simple items to make (no coop activities like raids:4 mara missions are not enough), of course they will pushback against marketplace fluff items. going from adv 1 to 90/200 with epic repercussions done in ry'gorr gear is far more than going from ts 1 to 90/40aa decked out with far seas gear, all factions, all recipes, shawl, pop, epic. crafting is underdeveloped. it is flat at endgame with everyone having it all. it could be so much more. its community is generally positive and kind as well, a great atmosphere to build around. continuing to design 90% of content for adv, who are generally more nihilistic and toxic, is unfair to crafters as well as unhealthy for long term community. AoD was a good step in the right direction. i would like crafting to evolve into a dynamic political merchant society, lead by players not npcs. having real control of gameworld resources. im all about the dynamic. would love to see merchantkings of respective cities (elected players) for crafting side and deity avatars for adventuring (bestowed on raiders for contested accomplishments) from my perspective, the biggest gap is the current underdevelopment of endgame crafting. imagine if adventuring had 4 instances from 1-90 (max of 1 per day) and less than 2 full sets of gear for your class. making items is like killing solo content in overland zones (adv and crafting equal for solo content), crafting is failing in heroic and raid content, itemization, backstory/lore timeline. progression has been turned over to research apprentices, instead of raid drops from tradeskill raids with tradeskill guilds. if the response from the ingame poll really said there are lots crafting, maybe the next poll should be 'would you raid crafting if it was beefed up in challenge and reward'. i find it amusing western civ is all about building, but in our play we focus almost exclusively on destroying and killing, even when customer choice shows building as a preference. there could be 2 simultaneous raid progressions going on, 1 for crafting and 1 for adv, with progression on one front making it easier on the other.
  13. ARCHIVED-Tatwi Guest

    Rijacki wrote:
    Riding a bike IS like piloting a 747. Both requiring steering. Period.
    Stating that some people enjoy feeling special, because they do something so colossally boring that most people don't bother with it, is not an insult, it's simply acknowledging a reality of the MMO world. Sadly that reality does nothing more than limit the appeal of a game, because the "special people" shout down any reasoning that may reduce their specialness, thus removing any point of engaging in dialoge.
    I have provided my feedback to SOE. Feel free to fill the rest of thread with comparisons that don't make sense.
  14. ARCHIVED-christinee Guest

    Crafting is boring - NOW?! Personally, I hated the early days of EQ2 crafting with sub combines, trading with other players, WORTS, gouging for subcombines, WORTS, more endless subcombines, WORTS, neverending competition for harvests, dying at the forge for a missed reaction because of a RL interruption, etc.
    You want to talk about BORING - IMO original tradeskills in EQ2 was BORING. Watch as everyone in your guild outleveled you because you wanted to be the guild tradeskiller but only had so many hours in the day to play and had to sacrifice leveling to make a provisioner or outfitter. Stare at the tradeskill window for hours on end hitting the reactions so you don't die at the forge. Being happy with a few bubbles of exp after a multi-hour session. Running out of raws and harvesting the same zone for the nth time to the point where you had the placement of every single mob nearly memorized. Tradeskill exp did not match adventure exp not to mention there was the added issue of having to get harvests to level up. When you adventure, you don't have to "Get" anything to get exp. You go out, kill mobs, get exp. Crafting, there's no getting exp without getting harvests (this is pre-pack pony days). Even doing adventure vs. tradeskill writs - talk about IMBALANCE! It took twice as long to do a crafting writ when you factored in having to gather the raws.
    I took a three year break just before SF was released when 5 of my 7 tradeskillers were all at 50 (except my provisoner who was 80 with the earring and my sage who was 60). I returned to EQ2 this January and was blown away by the changes to tradeskills. In the few months that I've been playing since the new year...90% of my time has now been spent doing tradeskills and decorating houses.
    I LOVE tradeskills now! The tradeskill quests are a fabulous alternate way to gain exp without having to grind writs. With full vitality and tradeskill AA's, I've leveled crafters from 50 to 90 in about 5-6 hours of grinding writs. The exp moves, which makes the process LESS boring. You SEE Progress - therefore you're motivated to keep going. Pack ponies eliminate the need to harvest raws which speeds up crafting now as well. If you get tired of watching for reactions or staring at the tradeskill machine, just pick a quest and start working on it. Heck, there's even dailies that will give exp and faction!
    Tradeskill armor, prayer shawl, earring, etc., WOW! Tradeskills are finally on the same planet as adventurers now (whereas before they were barely in the same universe). Tradeskills are FUN!!! My husband and I were able to level a guild to 30, get a harvest box, 3 pack ponies between us, and level up our crafters.
    I LOVE leveling a crafter. I LOVE tradeskills now (whereas before I loved them, but also hated them). Even tinkering got some loving. Pre SF I leveled my tinker to about 144. It was painfully slow, no reactions, endless need to harvest, no benefit. Last night, in about 3 hours, I went from 144 to 300 in tinkering thanks to the pack pony, AA's and the changes to tradeskills.
    I'm even considering starting a few new tradeskillers because I enjoy it so much and would love to do the lower level quests with them.
    To me, it's FUN sitting in front of the machine, waiting for a reaction, watching the xp bar move. I pop in a good movie while doing tradeskills and the time (and exp flies!). I feel productive because I can kill two birds with one stone. Sometimes I zone out just hitting 4-5-6 with my left hand on my 2nd computer with EQ and surfing the web or playing java games on my main computer with my right hand. Sometimes I'll just use tradeskills as my "quiet" time to de-stress, reflect on life or whatever issues are plaguing me in RL, and think. Tradeskills are PERFECT for that. I like to use tradeskills to "unwind" and help me get sleepy before bed. It's better than Ambien (no nightmares!)
    Perhaps it's those things I just mentioned that the OP and others find so boring. To me, it's relaxing, enjoyable, and fun!
    SWG was a completely different game from EQ2, even though they are/were run by the same parent company. Just because someone liked tradeskills in SWG doesn't mean that they're the right choice for EQ2. Those differences are what made SWG UNIQUE from EQ2, just like the differences between EQ1, EQ2 and WoW, Rift, Vanguard, LOTRO, etc.
    What YOU find boring, others find fun and vice versa. You like apples, I like oranges, should farmers stop growing oranges because you don't like them?
    It's fine to express an opinion about an aspect of the game you may not like. To push it on others and "demand" that the developers change the game to suit YOUR likes when there are thousands of other people playing the same game is inconsiderate to those that like that part of the game.
    Liking the current method of tradeskills is NOT about feeling special - it's about the INDIVIDUALISM of what "I" like vs. what "YOU" like. If you don't like tradeskills, don't do them. Why do you feel like you HAVE to like tradeskills? If you want the benefit of tradeskills, then know that you have to endure the process as it stands now and let the end result be your satisfaction.
    It would be the same principle as if I started asking that all raids be eliminated and ALL end game boss mobs be soloable because "I" find raids extremely boring, to the point of being ready to pluck my eyes out with dull knitting needles. BUT I "want" the benefits of raiding so they should be changed so "I" can enjoy them. To me, raiding is nothing more than "hurry up and wait", kill boss mob, wait for rebuffs/rezzes/etc., kill boss mob, go home with loots (maybe, if you're lucky and the stars are aligned and something drops that you need or win the roll on. Woo hoo...*yawn* Yet a majority of players live for raiding - good for them! They enjoy it, it's their form of entertainment, that's what makes them unique (or even special) from me.
    So by your theory, I could say that you like raiding as it is because it makes YOU feel special to be able to go kill some uber boss and get uber loot that I probably won't get because I don't enjoy raiding.
    You have your "specialness" in raiding, questing, grouping, whatever you enjoy doing in EQ2 and I have my "specialness" in crafting, decorating and soloing. If everything in a game was designed so EVERY single person thoroughly enjoyed EVERY single aspect, what a BORING dull game it would be.
  15. ARCHIVED-Deornwulf Guest

    Tatwi wrote:
    Insult people much?
    I have crafted in EQ, EQ2, SWG, LOTRO, WoW, EVE, TOR, Vanguard, and a few other less memorable MMOs. There is no game now that can match the complexity and depth of SWG. SWG is gone so there are few options for the serious crafter. EQ2 is the only remaining game that has even a slightly interesting crafting system AND process. That is why I am playing it instead of TOR.
    I like the leveling system because it does not appeal to everyone and there is no easy button. While one can simply buy or PL adventure levels, a crafter has to take it slowly. There is no rushing the process. One must be patient to level a crafter in EQ2. Which invariably means that crafting will not interest those lacking in patience.
    Your criticisms are invalid as there are multiple ways one can level a crafter. The process is only as boring as you make it. I can endlessly repeat certain instances to grind levels and AAs and be more bored doing that then I would be leveling a crafter.
    The choices to level a crafter are more varied than leveling adventuring classes.
    1. Follow the crafting timeline and level through crafting quests. One will end up going all over the map to complete the crafting timeline.
    2. Complete crafting writs to both gain status and levels. With the right potions, one can average a level per 3 writs. That status can be as lucrative as grinding any plat run instance. (I'm not going to tell you how because if you can't figure it out, you don't deserve to know.)
    3. Create items for sale to friends or for yourself to use. There are players who will buy handcrafted items for whatever reason but more money can be made by selling mastercrafted and Ancient Knowledge items. It might be a slow way to level a crafter but it is not going to be boring.
    4. Simply grind items at a crafting station until level 90. That is the most boring way I could think of to level but it still is a choice, the only choice your entire argument centers on.
    To gain levels as an adventurer.
    1. Quest
    2. Grind
    3. Spend 1000s of plat buying every collection item in the game.
    (4 is more than 3)
    Your complaint seems to imply a desire to have an easy button to press to instantly be a level 90 crafter. Unlike adventuring, there is no quick and easy way and we crafters like it that way. If you don't like leveling a crafter in EQ2, THEN DON'T DO IT. Realize that EQ2 crafting is not for everybody and either be happy adventuring or go play TOR where you can send your companion off to do all of the dirty work for you.
  16. ARCHIVED-Deornwulf Guest

    All of this talk is just a waste of time, any how. The MMO Development Gods have declared that since raiding and pvp types find crafting boring, all players find crafting boring. Therefore, crafting must be an easy button so that the raiding and pvp types don't have to take any time away from raiding and pvp to craft.
    It seems that the Devs have no interest in making a game where crafting actually takes time and thought like SWG. Just like "SWG players didn't like to read boring stuff so we made the NGE," "players don't want to have to think or spend any time to craft."
    The current trend is to make crafting barely enough of a sideline so that the game can claim to have crafting.
  17. ARCHIVED-Rijacki Guest

    Tatwi wrote:
    You're still missing a Major point (maybe colourising and bolding will get your attention).
    Crafting in EQ2 was more involved with resources, components, and even a slightly more complex process (you actually could use more of the buffs other than just the 6 highest level that are replaced for you as you level up so you never even notice they change). The primary component of any but the most basic subcomponent (Wash, Oil, Resin, Temper) could influence the final outcome. You couldn't make an item better than the quality of it's primary component.
    The whole process was absolutely gutted around the release of KoS and got almost no attention at all until RoK when Domino started. The system that it was, which involved more complexity, was gutted because a large portion of the player base complained about it being too hard, too long, too whatever. It was gutted into a super basic process because that was easier for the tradeskill dev at the time (and he even botched it horribly then) and they weren't going to allocate more resources to it.
    Domino added more variety to the experience with quests, tradeskill instances, special class rewards, a heritage quest, filling in recipes for nearly every class (in the "progression" concept that had been botched by the previous dev), got more (and better) house items added in, etc. Yes, she also did streamline the process a bit more because there were -still- complaints about how hard it was. Heck, there are still complaints today if someone has a couple bad RNG moments while doing a click to start and completely walk away from the keyboard to let it self complete without pushing -any- buttons. She also did it to make more sense with the reactives/buffs actually increasing in capability while leveling (previously, a level 20 buff could be considerably better than a level 40 one, and I think I remember them stopping at level 40 leaving you with using grey 'spells' at level 60+). A lot of players (myself included) disagreed with removing 1st pristine as the solution to the constant bickering over thus and so class having easier leveling vs other classes (even if that had already been smoothed out with writs being better for some classes). Even the massive bonus XP writs and quests give was in response to players complaining about the slowness of leveling. Now crafting levels up at lightning speeds, even in comparison to the fast leveling that is now the adventure game below 80.
    But, back to the real point, do you really think they're going to allocate much in the way of resources now to crafting? About a year ago, there was an open position for a tradeskill developer. Many of those who had applied for the job got back a letter saying SOE decided not to fill the position with a specific tradeskill dev. Unless -that- changes, there won't be a specific tradeskill dev. Without a specific dev, there is a snowball's chance in Hades of having the system completely and utterly changed. Heck, even when we had Domino as the tradeskill dev she stated very clearly in many of these types of threads that a complete and utter change to the system was not going to happen.
    Does the tradeskill system in EQ2, as it is now, appeal to everyone? NO. No one has ever claimed it does or it should or that anyone is wrong for not thinking it is a good system or is wrong for thinking it is boring to them. BUT, there are still people who do like the system, even as it is, and their opinion is just as important as yours. No amount of you demanding that your opinion is the only opinion which is valid will make it so. No amount of Feldon chiming in to agree that he also doesn't like the system will mean that every single player that likes it is wrong. No amount of me saying I preferred the original EQ2 crafting system (or the SWG system or the Free Realms system or the Puzzle Pirates system) will mean I unreservedly like the current EQ2 system and think it 'should' be the only system no matter if Feldon declared that or you declare it or any other "special snowflake" declares it. BUT, I do and will stand up for those you are insulting by characterising them as having the wrong opinion just because it doesn't match yours. It is inconsiderate of you to insist they're wrong to like it just because you don't.
  18. ARCHIVED-Rijacki Guest

    Deornwulf wrote:
    That is the exact state of crafting from when the previous dev gutted the sytem up until Domino started. I'm afraid it might go back to that.
    And, that is exactly how it is in most games. SWG (pre-NGE) was the shining example of truly innovative and robust crafting in a game and its like is probably never to be found again, sadly.
  19. ARCHIVED-christinee Guest

    I can't help but get the feeling that this thread is not so much about the current state of the crafting system, but rather that there is an aspect of the game that some players do NOT enjoy while others immensely enjoy certain aspects and that bothers them to no end.
    In other words, it's almost like an elite mentality where "I don't enjoy that part of the game therefore it has to be changed so "I" enjoy it but the heck with those who do enjoy it. I get this feeling every now and then when someone makes a simple request or posts in the homeshow forum (or even here) about how they wish there was such and such house item. Then a bunch of other people would come in and post responses like "sure, let's waste dev resources on stupid house items and decorating that nobody plays instead of itemization/raiding/real content, etc. If you want to play build house, go play Sims".
    As I said in my post, I could make a post in the combat forum or general forum and say that I think adventuring is too complex with heroic opportunities, adorning, learning important stats, all the spells and buttons to mash, etc. I think adventuring should be simplified and made not so complicated and intricate.
    However, everyone here knows that the second I were to make a post commenting and requesting (no matter how nicely, even if I say pretty please with sugar on top and a cherry) that I don't like the combat system and I think it should be changed, I would get the same dissenting opinions (if not worse) that are being presented about tradeskills here.
  20. ARCHIVED-Plaguemeister Guest

    I will grant you that crafting is boring - 3 combines and I'm down for the count. If your random button mashing you ahve not even bothered to figure out the basics of the crafting system. The buttons all serve a purpose and if you mash them mindfully you will find it goes much better (but stillq uite boring). Random smashing buttons and you deal with RNG fail - mash buttons in the right order and ZERO rng fail occurs.