Perhaps another improvement would be to slowdown faction jumping by players who want to sway the balance of power in wf's. possibly putting an in-game timer of 3months on the ability to change factions. I know faction changing in necessary for character changing from sin to ranger etc. but that can be done with station cash too if SOE allows. Maybe a new toughness buff for guild loyalty that increases with the number of guildies in a group.
I agree and was only suggesting the degradation of the gear be tied to Open world pvp. and only to the highest tier of gear.
No way...giving one more incentive to do BG's and not open world PvP? Like we need any more of that... If anything, make it so there is "Open World" PvP gear, and "BG" PvP gear, are bought with "open world tokens" or "BG tokens"...where the BG gear either decays, or is more expensive to buy and/or open world gear is simply better, not crazy better, but better. BG's need to be less of a draw for red server players than playing on the red server to begin with. Blue peeps can claim "unfair", that they want the red rewards too, but they should learn to be happy with the BG (Blue Grounds?) rewards...or simply transfer or roll an alt. PvP rewards should always come faster and be better from, open world PvP on a red server than from constantly queuing for BG's otherwise there will be little reason to open world PvP. Simple truth: If BG's provide the easiest way for a red server player to get PvP rewards that are best in slot for open world PvP why would anyone think that they are going to log in for open world PvP until they have mindlessly farmed BG's?
Why you should leave procs in the game, but reduce the damage on them. I came back to the game roughly three weeks ago after being gone for four years. I took a low level 41 Priest I had, and with the help of my two sons we leveled him to 95, max AA and he is geared out with 450k hit points, and the ability to survive any one vs one indefinitely. Anyone who isn't being lazy also can gear up in such a short period of time. With the current procs it takes three scouts, or two mages geared to the teeth to kill me. Remove the procs and I fear I will never die on my priest. This does not make PvP fun, and it bothers me. I have a feeling those who do not want procs, are crusaders, and/or priests themselves. They do not want to die. Unfortunately that is PvP. Everyone has to die. Even worse, throw in one, or two taunters in a group I am in and that group is never going to die short of a x3, or even possibly a x4. This creates situations where it is nothing more than a very un-enjoyable lagfest that never ends. So developers I reach out to you to think this over. I initially quit EQ2 because of hasty all in decisions like this, but came back while waiting for EQNext to see if things have changed. I am not the only one who has come back due to EQNext, and we are many. The success of EQNext could very well be tied to your decisions with EQ2; "still". Please actually take the time to talk to your community this time, because it really does matter. Do not fumble the ball this time. Thanks A Concerned "PAYING" Customer.
This is what I'm concerned about too. Even with procs I find I can survive most onslaughts. I already despise Gears matches where nobody dies. These stalemates are going to be amplified by the removal of procs, unless something is done to compensate. I still think it was a mistake to introduce procs into PvP without first testing them, but now they've created a system that depends on them. Cutting them out completely is going to unbalance that system. Of course, everyone should keep in mind that our worries may be premature; it is possible that they are going to implement other changes to help balance the removal of procs. Smokejumper's and Holly's posts were ambiguous at best.
I don't know what's so difficult for you and many others to understand. SOE is not going to remove proc's and leave pvp as is. They will just adjust things accordingly to the loss of dps, hps, etc. Then they can spend time balancing proc's but please everyone stop acting like the removal of proc's is the only change coming and nothing else is to be done about it.
I've been playing Everquest since the release of EQ1, and the release of EQ2. The past has shown they do not do things as you are saying they do. Your support for the removal of procs only supports your desire to never die. The last time they removed procs from the game, it ruined it. The problem you and others have with procs is that you have to actually think about items, and how to gear up. Quit fighting for a system that requires zero thought, and puts us in a position that no one dies. The game isn't fun if we all become bored. I already do not die with procs, unless there are three well geared players on me. Without procs, a full group will not be able to kill me. That is silly. I understand you do not want to die to save your fame, but the rest of us actually fight, and the removal of procs will ruin any chance of fun because no one ever dies.
This is the biggest issue. The only open world PvP are warfronts because there are zero incentives to be in open world. Worse the expansion has created an area that everyone jumps off the islands, safely with no repercussions. They need to quit messing with procs, and work on everything else first. We've all seen the lagfest at Warfronts, and this is no acceptable. I've recently played PvP games that has had three, even four times the numbers we get in Kylong Plains, and I didn't lag one bit in those games. They have far more important fixes before they even consider procs.
I have played this game since launch and since the beginning of Nagafen. Yes proc's add something unique to pvp but only when it is done correctly. Compare the vast variety of proc's we had the pleasure of using in the earlier days of this game to the poorly balanced, bland, unoriginal proc's that were implemented this expansion. The last couple of expansions where we did not have proc's was the most balanced pvp has been since TSO. Pvp was not boring during this time either, the only reason you could consider pvp boring was the struggle to find a lot of pvp outside the WF but yet it had nothing to do with the fact we had no proc's. They never said the proc removal was permanent, also yes SOE does have a bad track record with feedback and solutions but we are actually seeing a whole new SOE lately. People are recieving positive informative emails from higher ups and alot more dev activity on forums. So yes i can be optimistic that proc removal is not permanent, they just need balancing and that SOE will adjust accordingly to their removal.
You just missed a very balanced system (without procs) and my hope is you will see it again sooner then later. If all these returning players saw what was, they wouldn't be so upset with this change. SoE is not going to just disable procs and see how it goes... I don't know exactly how they will do it, but NOBODY would ever just mindless take away the primary source of DPS. If they seriously did that, it would be an all time low... so I will assume all this "sky is falling cause we'll never die" is pointless. They will likely remove procs and scale spells and abilities to effect the appropriate new HP pools. Call it vanilla if you want, it was a balanced combat system that worked with group play and that trumps everything else imho. You can't time burns with procs and so skill is taken out of group PvP. Proc DPS is NOT skill based team play. Why don't people see/understand this. What you are seeing now is dumb. Everyone's damage is the same thing, procs. All I did to gear-out my main was look at the parse after every BG/Fight and then purchase the piece of jewelry that had the top parsing proc. I did NOTHING more and now I parse fine. And people think procs add flavor... pff, everyone is ALL wearing the same thing! It's as cookie cutter as it has ever been... stop kidding yourself. What is different now with ToV is gear choices. Even without procs... people would not be all gearing out the same. I just talked to somebody the other day about gear choices (based on stats) and we disagreed on our choices, which is great! This change is not all rainbows and unicorns... I will admit that procs do drive PvE play for PvP. It's a lost concept, but the primary source of this PvE is now instance based. We will definitely lose the people questing out ToV for the new starting proc gear, but this is a very small percentage of players now that ToV is a month+ into it's release. The removal of procs will also drive people away from new contested zones. I will agree with Savej on this point. Fabled Cleffs and the upcoming Fabled SoS will be far less populated as a result of this proc removal... but that's also assuming there would be great PvP proc gear in these zones which is an unknown. I would love to see new contested zones drop PvP tokens or gems on Nagafen, similar to Cobalt Scar. That would boost Open World PvP dramatically, so we wouldn't have to joke about how procs drive it. I also am not convinced procs cause zone crashes, but they do "contribute" to lag... that's just a fact. We all know the EQ2 engine does not support high concentration of PvP or PvE. It's the engine #1 and dynamic environment with NPCs #2, but proc calculations do contribute to lag. 1 less lag contributor is fine with me. I want people to get into PvP faster. Whether that's cheap PvP gear costs or removing toughness to scale Lethality to compensate for stat loss, I don't know. There is a solution there somewhere, but it needs to be stabilized first and imho removing procs is the first phase of it. SoE and PvP procs just don't play well. Never have, never will. /walloftext off
Exur Timing bursts, and assisting isn't really skill, it is a given. Everyone should be doing it. You can not have a truly skill based game by any measure unless everyone has the exact same stats, and skills. In a game like this gear is always going to matter first (this includes a variety of things including Mastered spells). Skill in this game is so minimal that when people mention it, I cringe and wonder why I even bother. I've played skill based games, and Everquest II will never be that kind of game. There was far more skill required in Everquest I, than in Everquest II when you could perma blind, perma fear, perma stun, perma snare, perma root, etc. Allowing for gear that has procs on it creates something this game needs, itemization. I've only been back three weeks, and I've found the itemization fun, and I do not even use the damage procs as of yet on my Inquisitor. Removing choice from any game is !BAD!. I really dislike this course of action for any game, and for any class. Right now on my Inquisitor who started at level 41, in three weeks I've got maxed stats in many areas, which is absolutely absurd. My kids didn't quit this game four years ago like I did, and they tell me your dream that removing procs was balanced is just that, a dream. They owned PvP, especially when multi-attack, and flurry were out of hand. All you're doing is moving the game further towards a Priest / Tank based game. Right now with procs classes like Troubs, and Dirges are coming into their own because they can finally do damage to compete. When I last played I felt sorry for Troubs. They were all but worthless. Coming back and seeing them do what they can, was a relief. I fear you dislike for procs is misplaced, and there is a far better solution. I'd rather see less damage per proc (for instance the 400k proc), and an increase in the amount of procs on gear, with a much larger variety of procs. This includes new blue adornments with procs on them. Do not remove choice. It is bad for the game.
You had me at EQ1.... then you lost me on everything else. I'll stand by my thoughts/experience vs "your kids".
Alot of your opinions are misguided and outdated due to you taking a four year break. Nothing against you and nothing to be sorry about but you need to be filled in on the last 4 years because what we have now is so unacceptable compared to the previous years.
Exur Myself, and 37 other people came back to EQ2 Nagafen until EQNext is released. Three guilds in GW2 have considered joining us. They would bring anywhere from 300 to as many as 700 people with them. We all open world PvP. Since reading this, we've all played GW2 again today, with a few logging into Rift. My question to you is. Do you really want to chase away a larger player base, or would you rather find a much better solution? There is no itemization in GW2, and the gear there is exactly what you want for EQ2. It has grown stale, and the fights are no more skill based than they are in Everquest II. The reason me, and others are interested in EQNext, and were having fun with EQII the last three weeks is the added flavor; "gear itemization". Do you really want to chase us away? This will also have a direct effect to EQNext.
I'm talking to my boys right now. Only one of them thought the game was better, but he said the hit points are so great it would require a minimum 140% increase in ability damage to even make a dent in his tanks, and my priests health. He believes they would have to completely change the game as it is now, in order to make the change logical. I seriously doubt the developers will put that much time into the change. I just logged in, and we dueled without procs, and the dragon line prevented my sons Beserker from killing my toon with me doing nothing but cast my single target vitae.
