Tank Balance

Discussion in 'Fighters' started by Priority, Jul 14, 2021.

  1. Priority Well-Known Member

    So....what's the plan? As cool as it is to be displaced from a group that would boost my personal dps by 45-60% for a brand new zerk "cuz CB", it's getting old. Are we just going to continue to ignore the fact that Zerks and Monks absolutely dominate the raid scene in terms of survival, utility, and DPS or is there a plan to actually have some semblance of parity?
    Straos, Miragian, Agarth and 2 others like this.
  2. Obano Well-Known Member

    I don't know what the plan is but something needs to be done. Maybe they should go back to the original design document of EQ2. From a post I made a few months back.

    To fairly balance the game the tank classes should be inversely proportional in terms of offense and defense. The strongest tanks defensively are supposed to be weakest in terms of offensive.

    It terms of defense the best tanks were supposed to be.

    Guardian > Paladin > Zerker > Monk > SK > Bruiser

    Offensively in terms of DPS it went in the opposite order:

    (T1 dps) > Bruiser > SK > Monk > Zerker > (T2 dps) Paladin > Guardian

    Then the tanks were supposed to have more or less equal utility. All the tank classes should have their utility brought up to Zerker levels.
    Ozzello and Breanna like this.
  3. Priority Well-Known Member

    It gets old never seeing anything from the people responsible while year after year falling further and further behind in terms of actually tanking and providing meaningful buffs. It's a bad joke.
  4. Arclite Well-Known Member

    there needs to be a radical shift in development design. The current direction is geared towards adding more and more stats without balancing the classes and content around it. The class uniqueness and relevance of AAs is all but gone which is shocking that eq2 still promotes itself of being from the old breed of hardcore mmorpgs.

    Falling on deaf ears again but...

    1. You had your fun with ascensions, get rid off them now and let classes fall back on to their own abilities and buffs.

    2. we need an overhaul of the AA system and not just what you did in this expansion where pretty much all fighters are going down the same line of ability double cast/cb/pot bonuses. Either squash down stats or bring all AAs to the same level and DO NOT use descriptions like "increases effect by XX..." - put some effort into this!

    3. Bring back the auto attack mechanic whereby the generation of main dps for melee tanks, e.g. guardians go back to timing their auto attacks with combat arts and making weapon delay relevant again. This was working fine up until you thought auto attack was causing lag.

    4. Fix shields, defense, parry, block, uncontested block, riposte chance stats. So non-brawler tanks with AAs and gear are able to climb that ladder and become defensively stronger.

    5. As said above, tanks like guards/sks give little to not much to group/raid compared to zerks/monks who not only dominate that but also bring much higher survivability/dps of their own and this does NOT mean nerfing them!

    6. Make certain stats preferable on each archetype of tanks, e.g. warriors geared towards melee stats to help with their auto attacks and combat arts (boost the CAs accordingly) and crusaders benefit more from ability double cast or spell double cast.

    7. Another simpler way would be to leverage tanks offensive and defensive stances so in defensive stance all tank classes benefit from defensive stats and higher threat generation through combat arts/spells but their threat generation is not tied with their dps and in offensive, reverse is true where a tank class can go all out dps but does not generate hate to tank. You won't need subtle strikes again.

    I can keep adding more points but the main take home message for you DEVs is that we are more than happy to provide you open feedback on what you can do. With all due respect, i am fairly confident that players who have been playing tanks since close to the beginning of this game have a lot more play testing experience than you so it is a shame that you do not use us. We all will be forthcoming, just open a communication channel, don't care if its on forums or discord and if you want to handpick experienced tanks from classes, so be it but just talk to us. You have neglected this for far too long.
    Vichane and TinweSaa like this.
  5. Priority Well-Known Member

    Again, not asking for nerfs. I'm asking for buffs so the rest of us are actually desired in raids. Make the buffs we currently give better. Allow them to scale. Make them so we don't have to continuously revisit this every, single year. Static buffs don't last or maintain value. If your entire basis for a class is behind scaling buffs, that class won't continue to be viable as we exponentially increase stats year after year.

    Stop making your life harder and give us a future.
  6. Amalar The combined salt from all of SOE/DBGs fallen MMOs

    Continue spending money and nothing will change, stop and Daybreak will SUNSET the game instead of trying to *fix* anything.

    MTX and decorators are all that is keeping this game afloat now.
  7. Priority Well-Known Member

    Some sort of dev response would be nice. "We're aware of the issues, we're working on a solution, we have no intentions of changing anything." Something. As much as some of us pay into this game on a yearly basis should warrant some communication after 7 months of silence.
  8. AvenElonis Well-Known Member

    Except Defense ((i.e. Mig doesn't mean much and Block is broken) and all tanks can tank everything :) So highest DPS and Utility win.
  9. Grandavi Active Member

    I have ignored all of this (because my main is a Paladin). I just accepted that I am kind of the joke of the party. I occasionally grab aggro and can stand up long enough for the monsters to laugh at my huge (deficit) DPS. As a Paladin... I just accept the fact that, I am a "placeholder".
  10. Obano Well-Known Member

    Well they would have to balance it so it fair. My Bruiser can't really tank "everything" anyway. Currently two classes dominate the raid scene. That is kind of broken.

    My suggestion from other threads is that Bruiser should do more damage if they are behind the mob. Remember back attacks, and positional attacks? Assassins and other scouts used to have a lot of those back in the day. Bruiser has 1 attack like this but I wish we had more of them. It is high damage but have you to be behind the mob to do it. So do high damage you can't be tanking at the same time. That should be fair right? It is a give and take.

  11. Priority Well-Known Member

    Still waiting for a response in regard to what the plan is.
  12. Clintsat Well-Known Member

    Eagle Spin is like that! There's two!
  13. Bhayar Well-Known Member

    They're trying to find someone in the company that has any clue about how tank classes. I hear when "Paladin" came up, someone thought they were talking about a TV show that had Richard Boone in it.
    Breanna likes this.
  14. Priority Well-Known Member

    I had to Google that. At least after seeing the images, it rings a bit of a bell, lol.
  15. Bhayar Well-Known Member

    I knew some of you would have to, haha. Not that the point wasn't perhaps accurate.
  16. DENSER Active Member

    yet another subject proving that devs are now simple salespeople not playing the games they 'produce', But only to squeeze the lemon Before, finally, leaving the ship for a more profitable product
  17. Ozzello New Member

    On original intent. Guards/pally should have more DPS on single targets, Zerk/SK more on Multi. Leather should NOT be DPS AND able to tank a raid mob.
    Make the defense stances a requirement to stand up to tough mobs. Make the Off. stance where it actually gives a guardian decent DPS.
    Maybe just disable bulwark in DPS mode? And DO NOT change bulwark, Hate to say it, but at least that keeps some skill in this game that has gone the way of EZ button/P2W
  18. Priority Well-Known Member

    There's zero skill in bulwark. It's just another item to keep track of. You hit it or you don't. Stop confusing skill for tedium.
  19. AvenElonis Well-Known Member

    Except when you hit - and it doesn't work :)
  20. Arclite Well-Known Member

    Bulwark is the most useless thing in the game since Smokejumpers grand scheme of having facial emotions capture.

    It does not add challenge to tanking except frustration when ability lag or reset causes it to not work at times. I can't exactly put my finger on to it but i remember it being added to cater for the complaints about not needing a tank to do content and therefore not many tanks were available. Think it was PoP or thereabouts. Another one of those things that did not aim to fix the root cause of the issue but adding another layer to keep things ticking over.

    Lastly, Bulwark should never be a metric of tank skill or tank class usefulness in dealing with it - this notion is as low as it gets in understanding how tanking works or should work in this game.
    Blazen and Priority like this.