State of the Wizard Address (Serious)

Discussion in 'Mages' started by SacDaddy420, Dec 24, 2015.

  1. SacDaddy420 Active Member

    It's bad. I havent seen this class in such meh shape since T5 when I was a power feed bot. Masters of none, theres better choices both ae and single target if youre interested in dps. Which I assume all wizards are ( well that and our leet roleplay).

    I'd like to have a constructive thread here, so if your replies include razor sharp quips like I cant believe there will be any wizards left in a week or, Im going to sue DBG; then please, post that in the other thread. Thanks. Replies about how Im terrible tho are always allowed. Cuz I love that. And I know.

    So what can be done? Well, if you have around a million plat I guess you can out-infuse everyone else and compete that way. But I dont. I think we should see a return to our single target mastery.

    I'm talking about a major bump to manaburn, and a viable left side spec. For years now, everyone has been right side. It's been fun, while it lasted, but now it doesnt compete. Rangers and locks own ae, and just about every other T1 beats us single target.

    MB should be a 2-3 billion hit imo. And that heat proc should be increased cuz we cast so few spells, it simply isnt powerful enough. I think that would be the easiest and most effective way to return this class to its rightful spot, Im tired of being a 2nd class warlock.

    Thanks for reading, please discuss.
    suka likes this.
  2. Liou_Unrest Active Member

    What would really help the sorcerer archetype is getting them back to their roots. Wizards should be the king of ST mage DPS and Lock should be the king of AoE dps. In AoM, Warlocks were the king of both for the most part. With scout boosts and BL taking over the hill in almost all scenarios.. I agree wizards for the most part need some help.

    One thing to keep in mind though... not everyone can be #1. Generally speaking, there is an eb and flow with itemization and class balancing, and there will be a time where classes will be a little weaker but still viable. Although I agree with you OP that wizards might be teetering in the "not viable" category.
    KythosMeltdown, RedBB and suka like this.
  3. Eles Well-Known Member


    Amoon and Alenna like this.
  4. Yards Well-Known Member

    I'd give up on expecting anything to be changed with AA's. Almost every classes AA's are outdated in one way or another and that seems to be something dbg does not want to touch.
    Kuulei likes this.
  5. Xabbu Member

    Eles: /agree Liou_Unrest
    Xabbu: /agree Eles
  6. Schro New Member

    Daddy fat sacks has all legitimate complaints in my opinion.

    In addition to his complaints I'd like to see the cooldown on Fiery Blast reduced considerably or just a complete reworking of the ability. Having to juggle the cooldown on top of shard generation is a major pain in the ****, especially when you don't even get enough time on pulls to cast more than 1 or two spells. With the insane burst capabilities of pretty much every other DPS class, shard generation in general is extremely difficult unless you have a brave mass pulling, well geared tank.

    I should be a viable DPS, even in a non ideal situation. It's not fair for me to require a troub and an illy in the group in order to be valuable. Scout don't need anything really, other than a way to drop aggro.

    This is the age of the scout.
    Amoon likes this.
  7. Simien Active Member

    Some possible ideas or solutions. As previously mentioned, fix left side Prestige.
    2. More Ice Shield damage and have it proc off of abilities rather then dmg received.

    3. Manaburn dmg increase.

    4. Quicker stack building on single target.

    5. Faster casting times on big comet..fusion etc..

    6. Add Ice Comet and Rays to the instant cast at 150 stacks for single target with higher percentage to reset Fusion. (Giving both Eci and IC the chance to reset Fusion)

    7. Shorter cool down for FB...OR a small or rare chance for a FB reset with also resetting stacks to 150.

    I dont know...but something...please.
    suka likes this.
  8. wanderica New Member

    I'm pretty new to EQ2 and Wizarding, but even I have noticed a few things, and mostly agree with what's been said already. I'd just like to offer a perspective from a new player with nothing but other MMO experience from which to judge EQ2.

    First, Manaburn seemed useless from the get-go. Perhaps this would change with a proper group setup, but with our pathetic power return abilities, I just can't see justifying blowing all of my power on it. Ever. I don't even keep it on my bar. Recovering mana is hard enough when the Templar has to scrape me off the ground as it is. I'm not gimping myself by spending it all in one go.

    Second, Fiery Blast. /sigh. I understand that FB is our thing. It's what makes us Wizards, and the numbers popping up when one can properly execute a Fiery Blast rotation is cool to see. The problem as I see it, however, is that only happens once during a fight. Our cooldowns just don't line up for consistent use. Again, I get that this is just part of being a Wizard; that it is part of learning our class to know what to use and when, but the whole thing just feels . . . clunky.

    Maybe I'm way off base here, and if so (since this is the serious thread), I hope someone will point out why, but here's my idea for it. I'd like to see it turned into a toggle ability that when toggled drains mana at x% while boosting abilities total damage by y% (modified by potency) as additional fire damage. If you get the math right, it might even turn Manaburn back into a spell one would want to cast again. blow everything in one go on one massive manaburn or drain power over time for crazy AoE. I think this type of approach, at least for me personally, would put some much needed rotational consistency into our class. This type of a change would, obviously, be very bursty in nature, and you would definitely see some peaks and troughs in a graph of our damage over time, but would aid immensely in helping us compete on the short duration nature of fights these days.
    suka likes this.
  9. SacDaddy420 Active Member

    Alot of these ideas are quite interesting and I thank the posters for the input. I hope it continues. However, I still feel the simplest approach is usually the best. Bump the damage to MB significantly, bump the Incinercation proc, and please, if these were to actually be implemented, allow Fiery Blast to count the TOTAL MB instead of the 1/6th or whatever it currently does.
  10. Xabbu Member

    I would even be happy with a significant decrease in manaburn casting time. Maybe I'm weird, but I don't have power problems, as long as I am in a group with a decent healer. Sanguine Sacrifice allows me to manaburn without having to worry, but the amount of time spent casting it as it relates to damage output means I rarely do. That and Sac's suggestion to count total MB dmg towards FB I think would do it for me.

    And Sacdaddicus, since you gave us an opening: you're terrible. And thanks for this thread.
  11. Tharrakor Well-Known Member

    I am enjoying this thread with ideas and hope, I was saddened by how wizard class has been steadily fading. So far this thread has been kept clean and mature and I hope it will stay as such.

    I know I've said this before but I'll put it in here aswell.
    I would love if FB was two keys instead of one, one key for charging it and another key for shooting it, like RO/VC. Example: Tank pulls a lot trash before named fight, wizard will charge FB and will have a semi pre built spike for the named.

    I agreed on the points made about manaburn, make it hit harder and cast faster. However, making it as jaw dropping as it was at its prime might be too much. As you really don't sacrifice anything by using it anymore, other then dps atm tho. One potion will put u back at 100% power again.

    Fix left side prestige and make it great Singletarget dps, that's the most important thing right now for me. The "building increments" system on the right side is a very punishing system and can be very frustrating in many cases, and in todays eq2 not effective at all.
  12. Schro New Member

    You know... allowing Ice Comet to reset Fusion would be pretty amazing in itself. We could then spec fire prestige and still not lose valuable Fusion casts.

    I'm just spitballing while servers are down, but here goes:

    I would like to see the increment system impact Surge of Ro. If you are going to force us to wait until the stars align to drop our damage in one lump sum, at least give me an incentive for sitting on stacks.

    - at 50 increments Surge of Ro deals an additional 50% fire damage.
    - at 100 increments Surge of Ro deals an additional 75% fire damage.
    - at 150 increments Surge of Ro deals an additional 100% fire damage.

    Remove stifle and add potency buff to Harvest Mana.

    - using Harvest Mana increases the caster's potency by 15% for the duration of the spell.

    Make Vital Transfer a group spell.

    - casting it drains the wizard's health but refunds power to the entire group instead of just the wizard.

    Upgrade Protoflame:

    - depending on wizard spec, the limited aid pet becomes either frost or fire. Upon being killed or reaching max duration, the pet explodes dealing AoE damage to max of 8 targets.

    Upgrade Fortify Elements:

    - depending on spec, wizard gains a considerable boost to corresponding resist. A frost or fire wizard should be able shield his group against his chosen element extremely well.

    Mana Intromission:

    - wizard transfers 50% of power to target.

    Rays of Disintegration:

    - 10% chance to disintegrate (deathtouch) non epic targets. I mean... it's called Rays of Disintegration, right?


    - target takes damage every 3 seconds increasing in intensity until the spell breaks.


    - give this spell a chance to reset the timer on fire dots. Something that is burning doesn't stop burning until it's extinguished. Even a corpse will burn. This would make it so immolation is cast at the beginning of the fight and sustained with Firestorm. Fireshape could make this way overpowered, but... you know... just throwing stuff out there.


    Completely new spells:

    Ice Block:

    - the wizard encases himself in a block of ice, negating all incoming physical and ice damage.


    - the wizard hovers 1 meter off the ground, able to walk over water and ice with no difficulty. Wizard becomes immune to knock backs.
    Smite likes this.
  13. Sylke Well-Known Member

    I don't play and have never played a Wizard, but I think this idea would be rather cool (and useful) for you guys.

    I would add some timer on the FB nuke (similar to the VC timer) so it can't be held onto forever. On top of that, maybe add a short duration (15-30 second) temporary buff that would increase the damage of the FB nuke by a sizeable percent (30%?). This would add incentive to using the nuke immediately, but also help to overcome the gap between AE and single target. Or, that's how it would work in my mind. :p

    Keep the ideas coming though. Wizards definitely need some help, and constructive ideas are probably the best way to go about that.
  14. Tharrakor Well-Known Member

    Yeah Rays aren't that cool cuz of its casting timer, fusion is a way better spell for resets because it's much stronger. Right side wins.

    Left sides instacasts allows more spells into FB, and frozen det/rain adds a ******** of dmg to it. Right side wins.

    I don't think Protoflame need any tweaks, it's one of the best fillers.
    Instead reduce base casting on ball of fire and hailstorm.

    Allow Unda into FB calculation.

    Most mobs are immune to Shackle where it matters, if they weren't and it was used as a filler spell for a dmg tick tanks would absolutely hate you.

    Honestly don't see any use for Ice Block Cept if you know ur gonna pull aggro, would still be another thing to waste time clicking on, adding more temp clicks that aren't prepull will add seconds, seconds=dps.

    Stifle is already removed from harvest mana with a focus point, a clickie to turn this into a pre pull temp that gives u pot or CB but drains mana instead would be pretty cool tho, Cept I think wizard have enough stuff to click pre pull already.

    Keep them ideas coming tho. I like reading this thread!
  15. Penta Member

    I think it'd be a nice start to allow the doublecast damage of all spells (and procs) to be awarded into the totality of fiery blasts (while active). Warlocks are not penalized (when they hit their equivalent) for doublecasts. Why are we? Especially considering their absurd temp stat inflation last expac. Also, they're not that poorly off this expac either, with both pot and CB to their temp (and doublecast).

    For the longest time, doublecast was what separated wizards from the rest of the pack (myth buff). But that option has been available to everyone for some time, and typically has greater effect when stats are shared.

    Manaburn is useless.

    The left prestige tree is useless.

    Even if the cast time of rays were reduced it would make no difference. And gaining an extra 50K ab mod or whatever,to my next spell is not enticing. Who cares when you can easily compensate with your wand hitting for millions?

    has spoken
  16. Penta Member

  17. Entropy Well-Known Member

    Uh, a few points of clarification to above:

    The new hard cap of 3k CB most definitely affects warlocks negatively this xpac, as we would be well beyond that now during our burst (with FC up). Yes, FC is more useful than FB. No, it's not like warlocks are dancing happy jigs right now either.

    I'm not sure what crazy trade offs you are taking over the hypothetical extra 50k abil mod you mentioned, but mod is still the #1 stat to get for sorcs. You can easily softcap all of your autoattack stats with almost no effort. At that point, the only wand stats left are SWDB and Flurry... and you can't get either of them in abundance without grossly penalizing your CB/POT. Autoattack will always be between 5-10% of your parse at endgame (depending on gear and spec); it's not worth hurting your potential DPS from spells (which is the VAST majority of it) to improve your wand.
  18. Penta Member

    Freeze ends up being one of my top 3 parses when I look at my stats, and that's auto attack damage (with could infusion). I've seen my wand hit for millions at a time, not every time mind you, but often enough. If my ability mod were say, 65K, that added to my spell rotation would only give 650K, given I could fire a spell every single second for ten seconds. Which can't be done, at least with sorcerers. My wand auto-attacks every 8 seconds. I'd rather take my chances with my want hitting big, and I never miss, and I have a 100% AE auto chance, so that works out splendidly. Wand damage has been a huge part of sorcerer dps, since ToV.

    Also, I don't understand how you sacrifice pot/cb for melee stats. I think most gear comes with AE auto, spell weapon damage bonus, MA, attack speed, mit, or ability mod. You can choose what works for you. As I have seen the pot/cb on those pieces of gear (depending on same tier) are the same.

    I think your post about warlocks supposed suffering at CB cap is unnecessary. I was merely saying that they are not penalized with having doublecasts not added to their damage spike when they use Focused Casting, and that removing that same penalty while wizards use fiery blast would help to alleviate the dps imbalance people seem to be reeling against.
  19. Entropy Well-Known Member

    AbilMod is calculated in before crit multiplier, so your math here is way, way off.

    Go ahead and keep finding ways to improve that one line item in your ACT parse, your wand damage... I'm going to be focusing on the spell portion that makes up the other 95% of my ZW DPS.
    Montag likes this.
  20. Penta Member

    Ah, I see. When ab mod was explained to me, it was presented as just a number added to your base spell damage. I was not aware it was multiplied. IE if I cast fireball and it does 500 pts of damage, and your ab mod is 50 another 50 pts of damage is tacked on, the end, making the damage 550.