I also noticed that my spider (adept 3) didn't increase in level when I hit 24, but he was still very effective, about as good as Undying Adherent apprentice 2 from my experience. Getting an adept 3 or master 1 for a level 10 spell should not mean "I Win, I'll never need another pet". I've since gotten my adept 3 for Undying Adherent, and it's a very nice upgrade - I'm looking forward to using him for another 10-14 levels. I lucked out and found a palladium cluster my first harvesting trip to Nektulos, but if I hadn't, I would've happily coughed up some of my hard earned money for this spell. Should we not be forced to get new spells upgraded as we progress in level? Every other class does, and many of them must do the same for their equipment, where our equipment is a pretty minor part of our abilities. Take the money you save from not having to buy a suit of platemail, and buy yourself a palladium cluster or jasper - and find a trustworthy sage to make your upgrade. It's not that bad. Osso 24 Necromancer Freeport, Mistmoore
Spell system is NOT broke. It works fine, just cause you don't like it and want to keep the same spell set from level's 1-50, doesn't mean it doesn't work (not implying there aren't minor issues, but come on.) Edit: Grey spells are not more efficient as far as damage goes. Message Edited by Handlebars on 12-02-2004 02:31 PM
im sorry but the spell system is broke. if my adept 1 level 10 pet tanks better than my lev 24 app3 pet there is a problem. if a 30+ cleric is still using there lev 12 heal there is a problem. again look at my comparison. our spells are our armor, and grey spells are more effective than the new ones that are suppose to replace them for 3+ levels. every caster type is having this sorta of problem so imagine if all melee were somehow forced to wear grey con armor making it so the AC on them were no longer being applied. yes i would love to just buy my lev 10 pet spell and then buy another at 24, not buy an app3 version then have to buy adept 1 off the jerk who is selling 4 of em for 2G. or the adept 3 version for 10G, and people know they can charge this, especially for summoner pets, as they are our lively hood when solo. and thats what is going on on Najena right now. Tzucc is buying any grimn spellbinder adept 1 being sold for less then 2G and reselling them for 2G, along with numerous other class making-breaking spells (and yes my pet makes or breaks me) not at all fair and if anythin an exploit. the whoel 3tier spell system is FUBAR'd and is just another way of segregating casual and elitist players. it is also ruining the economy, which is volatile already. im sick and tired of people saying its OK or just deal with it and dish out the GOLD. these are probably the same people buying gold off e-bay, or are buying a spell for 30S and reselling it for 2G. I refuse to pay that much for a spell when 99 outta 100 of the other lev 20 adepts are going for 50S or less. luckily i bought my grim spellbinder adept 1 for 45S a fair reasonable price. I cant imagine how other necs feel when they see their lev 20 pet goin for 2G. i have no problem having to upgrade my spells, but when a level 10 pet tanks and deals damage better than the lev 24 version...bye far... WE HAVE A PROBLEM. vists the priest forums and you will see they are having the same issues with their heals. and probsbly our nuker counterparts also.
Why don't you venture off into Thundering Steppes and get the grim spellbinder adept I to drop off one of the centaur bosses ~lvl 25 which can easily be done with a group. Then you can sell them for next to nothing to all the whiners who want handouts like yourself. I have been there numberous times and have gotten 3 or 4 drops for necro pet adepts. One for myself and the other's for guildies. Complaining about not being able to get an adept for yourself is stupid. PS my lvl 24 pet tanks better than my level 10 one, I think this goes back to play style. What's your agitation at (app or adept)? Have you hit 25 and upgraded that buff? Message Edited by Handlebars on 12-03-2004 09:41 AM Message Edited by Handlebars on 12-03-2004 09:42 AM
ok handlebars is a moron or cant read i have my adept 1 GS paid 50S or so for it. 2 levels befor ei had the friggin spell hehe i have agi adept1 am only 24 all spells app 3 or better (remeber the game was supposedly based around app2 anything better is just butter) and dont dare question my play style, heh dont get much btter cast agi on pet THEN send it in so less agro... wait for pet to beat down pet to 80-70% drop dots, petrify root if agro rinse repeat. throw HO's in too. yes i understand them and yes i know how to use them grisly mark app3 mark of miasmic app 3 sittn in bank, all "handed out to me" friggin Jizagoff try countering my post instead of attacking me
It works the same for melee. As a Ranger, when I got Pierce as a replacement for Quick Strike there was hardly a difference. Quick Strike was just about as effective and conned green while Pierce conned orange. As I leveled Pierce became stronger and started doing more damage and now quick strike is almost useless and grayed. Here's what else people need to understand: When you gain a new spell it is at apprentice I. APPRENTICE! Do you know what an apprentice is?? It's not a master, you are just learning. It cons orange which means you have just started to be able to use that skill! You are still learning it, therefore you are not going to be able to use it to its full potential until you practice it a bit (by leveling and upgrading the spell). When you learn something new you don't know how to do it very well, that's why it seemingly sucks. Nothing is broken.
You're complaining ppl are selling them for too much, I was staing you should get them and sell for cheaper, apparently you can't read, and by judging the rest of your whining posts on every topic in this forum, I doubt you are a good player.
I don't find my pets underpowered at all and only have the Grim at adept 1...I bought it for about a gold and a half i think? Having said that I do group a lot, but still use my zombie (app 2) to hold, block and offtank and he seems to work fine...
I see nothing to say this is really a problem.. people are still thinking in terms of EQ1 and pet progression.. this is not EQ1. It makes a certain sense that an Adept III level 23 pet would tank better than an Apprentice III level 24 one. I wouldn't expect the overlap to be such that an apprentice spell would come close to that of an adept. It may be your 'Level 10' pet but as above.. this isn't EQ.. that's not you Level 10 pet.. that's your level 10 - 20 pet. Even in EQ1 by the time you dinged 20 did you expect to see an even con pet anymore? (been years since I played a necro can't remember which level the max pet wouldn't con even anymore). If you had the adept III level 24 pet it'd likely be a whole different story.. if the new one didn't exceed the first in that respect then I'd be a bit more dubious. I'd imagine soloing will get progressively harder as you level anyway.. whether you're supposed to be able to solo all the way up or not, nobody said it would be faster or give you as much out of the game as you can get grouping. I think what puts people's backs up the most is the amount they have to work to accomplish things.. this is still a fledgeling game with a new economy. People are taking what they can get for everything so that they'll feel like they're getting ahead.. only to spend it all on some obscure thing they want that someone else is charging multiple appendages for so that they can get ahead... only to do the same for someone else. In a few years half the lowbie chars will be running around with adept III pets and twinked as much as they can manage. There's still lots of time.. nobody needs to stick their face to a grindstone and race to the end of the game yet. Deep breaths, relax.. look at the walls in the zones and notice the details. Take time to hug an NPC and spend an hour emoting handing out flowers to players as they go by. Or do what I did.. delete your 20ish char (with 20 in a Tradeskill as well) and start a new one. Wipe it clean, don't even strip the gear. Better to find a class in this game you enjoy from the early on than rush to 50 and then realize you gritted your teeth through it only to bitterly complain the class wasn't what you wanted it to be.
Would you like it better if abilities never got old? If there were never new abilities because the old ones would always be good? Yea, thats what I thought.
For anybody that did not relize this, You are a Necromancer, not a summoner. What good would all the new pets be if the old pets maintained their strength all the way up. Summoner pets are only there to get you to the Necro pets. Once you have optained and upgraded them they will do you well for a long time.
But your armor analogy makes no sence. You are comparing a rare (and very expensive) version of a level 10 spell to a store bought version of the level 24 spell. If your tank had some form of uber epic armor that added 250 health or some craziness, but was grey by one level would you replace it for generic store bought armor with almost comparable AC? The adept 3 spell was meant to be rare, and as such it is much better then the store bought alternatives. I only have Tel Rec. App. III, and my Grim Spellbinder (adept I)holds aggro better, and almost tanks the same at level 20. And Im sure that by level 24 the App3 version of the Zombie will definitely outshine my app3 Tel. Recruit. Remember how much of a massive power upgrade going to adept made? How is it fair to compare an adept spell to an apprentice one with only one level difference? The only reason people are seeing it as a problem is because they were lucky enough to get an Adept version of their spells. The people that don't have a problem with it are the ones that just upgraded from an app II -> app II (like the game was designed around). If you could go back to the beetle and compare that to the zombie you would see what I mean I bet. Everquest is all about finding awsome stuff, so why would they make something you can buy in the store more powerful then something that was (as an above poster stated) extremely hard to get considering its level(20 hours?). You are shocked that a 20 hour reward lasts a little longer then the apprentice II version was designed too? I would hope it would still be useful one or two levels after turning grey considering the time commitment to obtain it... People have just been spoiled by their adepts and don't want to come to grips with the fact that they were so powerful before because they had all adepts. If you want to maintain the same power ratio then you will need to maintain all adepts again. Necromancers that had adept III's are expecting to have the same overall power with app. II everything, and to me if they did that would be a broken spell system.
In addition, the tell recruit was meant for lvls 10-24. Once you get the 24 pet and move to lvl 25 and beyond, the 24 pet keeps getting better while the tell recruit stops.
It seems that the formula is that once once you reach a level where you get the "new" version of your spell (new pet, nuke, dot, etc.) your old spell quickly becomes replaceable by it (as low as the app2 version)unless it is adept3 or higher, and even then the spell starts to outweight the Adept version within 2 or so levels of aquistion. They've built in quite an amount of interdependency into the game (within the tradeskilling community and between "hardcore" adventurers and tradeskillers). I find that at 24 the adept3 tell recruit is only a slightly better then the app2 version of undying adherent, and perhaps that's just because I'm comfortable with the tell recruit as I've been using it for longer. I'm sure at 25 the margin of difference will shift in the other direction as the 24 pet lvls to 25 with me and the tell recruit stays at 23. Just like the tell recruit before it, the priority is on getting a higher level version of the lvl24 pet spell (I'll be moving it to adept3 as soon as I level my Sage skills). I've also noticed that my Adept3 Storm of Lightning is now ineffective damage-wise compared to Blight app3, etc. I'm sure as soon as I get Pestilential Blast it'll be replacing my Adept3 Dust Storm. Also be prepared if you do move the 24 pet to Adept 3 that at 34, you'll need to do it all over again as I'm sure the lvl34 app2 pet will be comparable to the Adept3 24 pet, and outlive it in a level or two I think there are a lot of strictly "adventuring" characters that are powerleveling past the rate of Sages on their server and disappointed with the performance of app2 spells because they are "mediocre" in performance. That's as it was designed. App2 is "average" at best (meaning you could play the whole game through on app2 spells but it won't be very exciting). I'm fairly certain that only about 30% of spells per tier drop Adept I books, while the other ones you are reliant on tradeskillers for upgrades. I'm don't think many people are aware of this as they are constantly advertising for WTB adept I drops of books that *never* drop. At that point you need to start hunting for Sages for your app3 version, and mining for rares, as that is your best bet to upgrading those spells. Either shift in to tradeskilling yourself to get your spells, or hunt down the highest Sage on your server and start picking up upgrades. If they are struggling to level then support them as you can, because you are reliant on them for your continued success (unless you want to play the game through at mediocre, which sounds blah to me).
handlebars, judging by your posts you dont even play a nec. saying we are fine and everything is ok, heh yeah right. i am going to list the necro bugs for you: pet dancing with mob all over zone, losing hate making you chase it around, which can and will lead to agro which can and will lead to death. just imagine if this were happening to everyone else when they solo'd while LFG!!!!! pet disappearing in walls pet making mob disappear into wall pet animations only working on 1-2 versions of our pets. pet breaking mez because 1 of the 3 mobs attacking you did aoe b4 enc could mez even tho you have MA targeted and hit attack and back off numerous times. SoR (swarm of rats) cancelling dot's on mob (tho if its up i cast it first anyway) no real use for necs in group, we are a dps thats it, while enc are dps and CC and wiz types out DD us so do bruiser types. and if you dont believe me get an enc or monk or any bruiser type, moderately equipped, and have them solo next to you. watch who kills faster, bet you its not the nec. I have AQ6 done, nice gear, all app3 or better and was having an enc solo faster then me who didint even know what AQ was. and before you flame me and say i dont know how to play how about you go try it out ok>?>?>? i was doing as much damage as possible, even drawing agro every now and then, tho i could easily have done more. the fact that i have been looking for SoR adept 1 for 3 weeks and havent seen one (both markets) the fact that i could say the same thing for a few other nec spells while the last few are opinion, lots of others "whiners" feel and have expeienced the same thing. i too solo'd the ent mobs in nek at 20, lil down time, except when my pet does the dance with mob thing. the fact that most of the necs bugs are related to our pets is just sad. the fact that they have been in since beta and every nec i know has /bug'd em and we have gotten ZERO response as to a fix, is rather unacceptable.
Its handelbars and I play on the befallen server, go look me up. Here is the link: http://eq2players.station.sony.com/en/pplayer.vm?characterId=204264201 Message Edited by Handlebars on 12-06-2004 11:02 AM
caliron.... i compared my adept 1 spider..at the time i bought it 50S now 2G or more on Najena.... to my 24 app3...player bought and made for 1.5G. if a tank is wearing grey con armor THERE IS NO AC, so the 250 health would easily be given up for a new aromor piece that gives AC and some stats, that is exactly why my comparison does make sense. and the devs said the game was designed around app2 spells ALL my spell are app 3 or better where di you even come up with the app 2 thing..... i have 3 app3 spells i cant even use yet sitting in the bank. myproblem isnt the fact that i have to upgrade, its the fact that the new spells are not as effective as the one it is replacing until 2 levels or so AFTER you get the spell. maybe when you ding 24 and see that your spider..wait you still have the beatle... tanks better than your new spell even at app 3, you will see where im coming from. (this is not my opinion it is a fact) and moving from app3 to adept 1 is not a MASSIVE jump, essence shift app 3 to adept 1 is 5power per tick difference, coming out to a total massive bonus of 20 power. app3 BE was doin 20-25 adept 1 24-29 per tick, toltal extra damage 30..... or one extra tick. i could go on but i wont. yes adept 1 is better but itsnot as MASSIVE as you make it out to be....
did you see that name i put at the front of the post and how it wasnt yours....... seriously dude, if its your intent to chime in about how good necs are and how they are fine why dont you MAKE A POINT. call me a whiner whatever at least i make a point to my argument, not just say things like "i like my nec, sure the pet pathing thing is bad, but i can deal with it." Message Edited by reefus on 12-07-2004 10:06 AM
There is no point I need to make. I like being a necro, I don't think the spell system is screwed up, I am not pissed they haven't fixed the pet things yet, I have no trouble soloing or keeping aggro off myself. Your POINTS are just complaining, why don't you PM your name and server so I can check out your gear.
