Nagafen PvP Beta

Discussion in 'In Testing & Test Server Updates' started by Caith, Feb 6, 2019.

  1. Zenji Well-Known Member

    No thank you. That would single highhandedly remove several classes from being "viable" in pvp.


    That would be terrible, you would have raids requiring people to drop in groups of 3 and then trying to reform to pull.
  2. Siren Well-Known Member

    Of course, your thoughts would be more viable *if anyone was actually doing any PvE.* However, about all they are doing is exactly what Sixgauge says: 6 man groups of oranges are facerolling their own same-faction greens with rez sickness ad nauseum. ;)

    And temporary beta = temporary live characters, too. What you see is what you get. Nagafen beta = Nagafen live.

    The only people who don't want this situation fixed are the orange 6 mans who don't want their perpetual "gankers griefing greens" behavior stopped at launch.

    The sad thing is, these gankers and griefers are going to kill their own server just like they killed the Nagafen beta server population overnight. It never recovered. The only thing that remains to be seen is if Daybreak is going to actually address this situation by launch or not.
    ArcaneCognition likes this.
  3. Sixgauge Active Member

    If classes aren't viable in PvP, that's a different issue. Also, having 6 or 24 people doesn't change whether or not a class is viable, you would just fill those slots with viable classes.


    No you have people outside the raid running defense for you. Either way, if you want the pvp server to be viable, contested raiding is an after-thought and way down on the list of things to worry about.
    Siren likes this.
  4. Zenji Well-Known Member


    That is the most delusional thing I have seen posted about this server yet. What most people did on Beta did not reflect how they will spend most of there time once the server goes live. People will raid, run dungeons, harvest, craft, quest etc.


    Do we even play the same game? Do you know how group/raid buffs work? The more people effected by the buff the more impactful it is. So yes limiting it to a 3 man group vs. 6 or 24 does effect how viable a class is.
  5. Siren Well-Known Member

    No they won't. Live characters are temporary, too, 12 weeks til the wipe. Not to mention that crafting XP and adventuring XP are terrible. No one is doing any of that now, and they won't be doing it come launch, either.

    It's clear you're one of the orange 6-man gankers, though, desperately wanting to continue griefing your own side's greens (and your faction's greens can't even combat their rez sickness, let alone the 6-man orange ganker groups griefing them to death).

    How pathetic. And soon after launch, you won't even be able to do that anymore, because most of the players will have bailed off Nagafen live just like they bailed out of the beta after a couple days, never to return.
  6. Vythare New Member

    First off, I wanted to say thank you for the beta. It's been a blast getting to relieve that PVP itch again. I’m not going to tell the Devs how to make their game and I’m also not claiming to know everything, but I have spent a lot of time playing on PVP servers throughout my time on this game and would play on a PVP server every time over a PVE only server. These are a few of my thoughts as I wrap up my playtime on the beta and look forward to the transition to a live server.

    Classes:

    I played a few classes at lower levels and multiple more at the cap with the buff. Class balance wise, there's a few things that seem imbalanced but most of which have always been a staple in the world of PVP. I don't mind changes in CC as long as there are increases in damage or other viability to compensate. Things like casting times in vanilla are always going to make classes like Shaman irrelevant. It's like any other competitive game, why play shaman when I can play druid and be more useful? I understand its nigh impossible to balance 24 classes to give each a level playing field, and honestly some classes SHOULD be better in 1v1 and fulfill different niches in groups as well, but the casting times on larger group wards and heals while being interrupted are generally just not fun from the healer's perspective. I'm sure there are more examples of this than just healers, but that is what I spent most of my playtime as in beta and have the most personal experience to back up.

    Soloability:

    Fundamentally as a game mode or server based mostly around PVP, it takes away a lot of the soloability of the game. The last few days of beta I would try to find fights solo and just get rolled by stacked groups. I have a couple friends who played the beta as well but different timezones and work schedules make it hard to consistently have a group with them, and I would find myself spamming LFG to inevitably wander around town until I gave up and logged off. I remember back on Vox a lot of the best times I had in PVP were when you would be just questing solo and it would immediately be a fight to survive when someone of the opposite faction rolls in. I’m hoping PVE becomes more of a thing once we transition out of beta and into live, as with a limited time frame on the beta of course pvp comes first.

    Itemization:

    I think the decentralization of the game from PVE to PVP makes itemization harder to fulfill. (I understand that the point of the server is entirely PVP based). Crafting XP is so slow, you're left with a lot of gray items simply by out leveling the crafters. I don't want to introduce Lethality or Toughness back into the game, but I think that a currency dropped on player kills (Blood Money) that can be used for somewhere between treasured and mastercrafted gear might not be a bad solution, and also won't devalue crafting. (Maybe be able to sink some SP or coin as well depending on how the economy looks).

    Griefing:

    While the point of the server is to rack up as many unique kills as possible and the majority of your xp comes from PVP, it’s just not fun to die, spawn, and then immediately get whacked with revive sickness still in effect. It would be nice to have some safety of not being griefed by the same player, if they’re on your recent, and not grouped you can’t attack them until they hit you (or your group). Or if we had an immunity on death that lasted until you entered combat with a monster, zoned, or hit another player. This could probably be abused to some extent, but it might keep people from logging out for good day one, after getting whacked by the same scout 4 times in a row. I like the idea of free for all simply because it basically doubles your number of targets and can keep active PVP with a smaller population.

    Bounties;

    With the one character on the server rule, it would be cool to see a broker of sorts, where you could offer up coin to put a bounty on another player’s head. Maybe give them a non-removable suffix title like “The Wanted” and let people contribute to the bounty (with a minimum coin threshold so we don’t have 3cp bounties), and then split it between all who contributed to the kill. I don’t know how much Dev work that would take, but with one character on the server, it could be a fun mechanic. Maybe a server broadcast when the bounty hits certain coin thresholds like 1p 5p 10p etc. I suppose you could just die to a friend but then you lose your precious fame! ;P

    I’ve loved the opportunity to shed more blood across the Norrathian countryside and appreciate all the dev work that went into this server and hopefully will continue to go into it. I want nothing more than for this server to flourish and bring back pvp for good. Thank you for reading this text wall and appreciate any feedback to any of my above points and opinions. See you all on live!
    Siren and meowza like this.
  7. meowza New Member

    Griefing .... idea , i would like to see that your immunity upon reviving be extended ,players that kill you more than once, in a 5 min duration or in till your off there recent, get a heavy penalty like the loss of FAME , as if there being killed them self's by Griefing you ... now some may cry this is PVP, So deal with it ,yeah i get that too but generally those are the people doing it .. We honestly lose players to other severs because of this very thing !
    LOVE LOVE LOVE .. THE WHOLE BOUNTY IDEA
    Siren likes this.
  8. Gankednshanked Active Member

    I’d be curious to know how many of you experience griefing from
    1) being target grieved, IE you change zones and try to do other content but people follow you around to kill you
    Vs
    2) Rezzing at the same spot over and over
    3) actively attempting to pvp, but dying over and over.

    I think in any of the cases that might deserve empathy, it’s 1, but it’s a pvp server, not a care bear server. If you don’t want to die, don’t play. If people are preventing you from questing in EL, go quest in Zek, call them out globally, bring friends, do something else. I don’t actively try to grief people, but if I see you, I’m going to fight you.
  9. Siren Well-Known Member


    2.) News Flash: When you croak in Antonica, it doesn't give you the option to rez in Zek, EL, etc. Shocking to you, I know. You freaking rez in Antonica or you close the client window to shut the game down because you can't even log off. And try running as a green with rez sickness while 6 oranges are on your tail. You aren't even remotely going to be able to make it anywhere before you are griefed over and over.

    Get a clue, and please spare us the "it's your fault this is happening, greens!" nonsense.

    3.) No green in their right mind is charging at orange stacked 6 mans. Again, get a clue, and quit blaming the lowbies desperately trying to level for your repeatedly bad behavior.
  10. Gankednshanked Active Member

    2) Grow up.

    It’s apparent that you don’t factor in the entirety of the PvP system and narrow in on what you believe will be the actual experience of players on Nagafen. Compounding the fact that players can only have 1 character + the insane leveling speed, nobody is going to be sitting in Antonica griefing questers. The only instance in which this might occur is if people start leveling a week or two into the server as solo players, where those players are 44 and trying to quest in Everfrost. In this case, there is a natural price to pay, and we will call that “growing pains”. Rarely will people decide to deliberately pick on solo questers, and even more rarely will they be allowed to do so for a prolonged period of time. Other people will be roaming around Norrath looking for PvP. They aren’t looking for solo questers, they’re looking for other people trying to PvP or take meaningful objectives.

    3) it’s clear you don’t know me and are misguided in who you’re pointing fingers at. It’s pretty easy to dismiss your opinion when you tunnel vision on BS.
    Zenji and Daarkstar like this.
  11. Okanagan Member


    Completely untrue.

    I know of many people who are not playing the Beta anymore (including myself), because it's the Beta. Myself (and my entire guild, and many people as per the unofficial discord) have full intentions of raiding and gearing our toons, doing PVE content etc, on the actual launch.

    People aren't doing this on beta because "lol it's beta".
    Zenji likes this.
  12. Trasor Active Member

    While I am not seeing updates on discord, there have been rumors floating around on the duration of Beta.

    Will another expac be released so that we can test AA in PvP combat as well? I believe then we would have blue stats mixed in for crit chance, casting speed, multi-attack, etc. on gear so I view that as the more challenging time.

    Thanks!
  13. Alarra Well-Known Member

    I would say that the reports of only 60 people logged on at the time leads me to believe silence on diiscord means another thing entirely.
    Siren likes this.
  14. Kazooooooooooo Active Member

    False, our community manager is just afk diddlin away instead of doing her job of yanno... managing the community and beign the pipeline for communication. Not sure how she has a job tbh. I believe both kander and caith are making solid strides but the need to be more transparent with their ideology instead of making changes that seem to be on whim with no clear direction.
    Gankednshanked, Daarkstar and Peak like this.
  15. Comintern New Member

    I have played on Tallon Zek and on the old Nagafen. I would come back for a new pvp server, but not for a 3 month deal. I'm looking for a more long term experience.
    eelf likes this.
  16. eelf New Member

    Yeah I would to and bring it back just like before gu53. No PvP or PvE gear/stats. Earn your gear in raids or lots of pvp kills to buy more gear at merchant in KP.
  17. Daarkstar Active Member

    Was tempted to make a new thread as there are so many awful suggestions in this one that it hurts my brain to keep up. Overall I'm pretty happy with the direction of things and have thoroughly enjoyed beta, especially the FFA. Those complaining about griefing and FFA aren't going to be happy on this server regardless, if they want 'fair' then there's always the arena in WoW or something....

    While most people I spoke to seem to be pretty happy so far, there are a few stand-out issues that need looking at.

    Stuff that needs to be addressed:

    CC Durations
    PVP templates are obviously borked. Many classes have had their primary CC abilities nerfs down to a fraction of a single second. This is class breaking for more than a few classes. I saw that the only inquisitor CC ability last just 0.8 seconds on a 45-second recast.... not even worth casting. Then it seems a few classes missed the nerf with warden group-root lasting a full 39 seconds in PVP.

    Summoner Pets
    Necro tank pet seems to have strong encounter CC abilities on a low cooldown. Conjuror scout pet needs a nerf of their single target attacks. Galestorm was frequently hitting for over 1,000 at level 50, combined with Blazing Avatar a conjuror can take out 50-90% of a players health in a few seconds without casting a spell.

    Rogue Offensive Stance
    Need to remove the interrupt component from the "on every attack" part of the buff. Currently, this means that EVERY combat art will interrupt casting... which is crazy. As a caster, it is impossible to do anything against a melee class that can completely shut you down with very little effort. Keep the damage component, rogue dps seems decent as is.

    Shaman/Cleric
    Shamans and Clerics are awful in PVP at the moment. The best pvp groups has two druids or one druid and a paladin. Templars and Mystics are decent because of the regenerating wards and Oberon/Focused Intervention but still second-rate to any druid. Inquisitor and Defiler are deadweights in group fights. Changing group ward/reactive to a 3 second casting time will do so much for those classes, but they will need some other boost to anywhere near as good as a druid.

    Brawlers
    Medium damage and little survivability. Don't seem to serve any function in PVP at the moment, not even viable solo vs most other classes. Avoidance doesn't seem to be working so well for them.

    Pact of the Cheetah/Fae Fires
    Pact currently can be cast in-combat and reduces damage taken of the group by 40%. Remove the damage reduction component and make the run speed out-of-combat. Fae Fires is craazzzy strong.... 3 procs of 400-450 damage on each player (and pets) in the group... that's over 10K damage... and this stacks! So two furies can pop this ability and the opposing group will just melt (saw this happen a few times) with no way to outheal the raw damage. Reduce the power of the ability by 50-70%. Currently, furies provide insane heals, great utility and the best possible damage boosts... why play another healer?

    Rogue/Hunter Poisons
    Especially at low levels, the merchant poisons are doing crazy damage. If this isn't fixed before launch there will be a lot of people exploiting this.

    Disable Familiars
    I assume this was just an oversight and these won't be launching with Nagafen, which would be terrible for obvious reasons.

    T5 Fabled Loot
    Procs on fable loot need immunity added to them in PVP. Currently, a player with just two items is almost unkillable as there is no immunity or limit to how often then can proc which means you can be stifled or feared constantly. It's not a big deal with one or two players in a group fight with a piece each but towards the end of vanilla when players have loads it will totally spoil pvp up until level 60. Group fights will just be 'whoever has the most proc gear'.

    Racial player tracking disabled
    Obvious, please disable otherwise everyone will just roll Kerra.

    PVE XP
    Not sure if this has been balanced again since I hit 50 way before the beta buffer. XP from PVE should be a feasible option for leveling to prevent players who can't get a group or want to run some zones can progress without getting turned away.

    End-game raid/contested content
    Seems all too easy, many of the X2 contested were killable with a single group of players without experts (before the beta buffer). Please buff up raid content a little to make actually contesting contested possible.

    Please update us again about the changes you are working on in the coming weeks. It's super important for us to know what's being done as it will decide on what we play come launch. At the moment most people have told me they are either going crusader, rogue/hunter, druid or summoner based on the current state of things. Would be great to finally see some diversity on a PVP server.
    Ishtara and Ajjantis like this.
  18. Nuada Member

    u say all that standart stuff need to be changed after that u have new classes.. lol

    and what is with ur loevly sk?? not one word about him?

    i see Harm touch also not in place, i mean it has nearly a 6k hit and with a beta buffed bubble i have only 5500hp !

    also nerv harmtouch 50-60% minimum

    You do that as well as it suits you, and forget the most important thing then
  19. rpreed80 New Member

    I was playing an SK, Harm touch hits hard yes.... but it doesn't hit for as much as it says in the spell description against a pvp target. It never one shotted anyone..... Most I saw it hit for was 50% of someone health. And it's one target...... and a 5 Minute recast. Not that OP
    Siren likes this.
  20. Gankednshanked Active Member

    Comments in red.

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