Mage fixes?

Discussion in 'Mages' started by vexen, Jan 18, 2022.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Moss Well-Known Member

    I believe you are missing the point and why so many are whinning.

    Last post of Kander on forum December 10th, last post on Discord December 8th and it was on small subjects. No communication for the last 6 weeks, not a single official word about players concerns.

    Players have been reporting mage problems since the vey first day of beta and it has not been acknoledge since them.

    And I'm sure we could all agree players have been loud enough about it, only asking to know what was happening.
    AOE1, Banana Tree, Sigrdrifa and 2 others like this.
  2. Magdaddy Active Member


    You want double damage (or more) before modifiers plus recovery time cut in half? You're out of your mind. If you're that far behind equally geared scouts, there's a lot more going on for your situation than a class imbalance. The changes you proposed would make mages more broken than scouts have been at any point this expansion.
  3. Magdaddy Active Member

    It's not one third. Good mages can do about 70% of the DPS of equally geared and skilled scouts. When you so grossly exaggerate, it becomes impossible to take any of your complaints seriously.
  4. MSMS New Member

    You don'k know good equipped and skilled high end scouts ;)
  5. Sigrdrifa EQ2 Wiki Author

    I'd say mages are doing about 30% of equally geared/equipped scouts, myself.
  6. Magdaddy Active Member

    You're right. My guild (Rawr) worldwide firsted all the DPS check mobs on the wings of our scouts (including my alt ranger Magatron, who is decidedly a "good scout"), but I probably don't know anything about scout DPS. Good call.
  7. Magdaddy Active Member

    You can say whatever you want, but that doesn't make it true. If you think mages are parsing 30% of scouts, you need to find better mages for your testing. I haven't seen anybody post higher parses worldwide than our Beastlord (Rummars) and for each of his raid parses I've seen one of a mage doing approximately 70%. Again, if you think it's 30% then you REALLY need to send your mages to EQ2 school.

    30% would mean if our alleged "best DPS worldwide" Beastlord was doing 2T, then a mage would do 600B, which is obviously not even close to true. We have enchanters doing that much compared to scouts, and enchanters are not worse than T1 mages, despite all the memes about mimicry.
  8. Clintsat Well-Known Member

    The difference depends entirely on the utility involved and the content reviewed.

    A 30-50% increase in mage DPS isn't unreasonable based on the content we've seen so far. A higher-end boost might put them slightly above scouts but scouts have the benefits of casting while moving, BL can replace chanters/healers in a pinch and rangers are (surprisingly) less worried about distance to the mobs than most mages. Sins would need a slight boost because of their range dependency.
    Miauler and Magdaddy like this.
  9. Magdaddy Active Member

    I absolutely agree with this. If mages are around 70% of scout DPS and got boosted 30-50%, that would put them at 91-105% of what scouts are doing. That's a very reasonable range.
    Hellfiren and Clintsat like this.
  10. AvenElonis Well-Known Member

    LOL I think I been saying 30-50% increase in mage dps for over a month now ;) we'll see on the 1/15 I guess.
    Beee likes this.
  11. Beee Well-Known Member

    From the actual ongoing raid: Scout 4,4T best mage #5 at 500B on trash in Fading Light
    But this should not be the number for balancing.. just to show up that somthing is complete broken

    And from T1 Named (which shows the T1 times are OK right now)
    (06:07) The Vetrovian Mantrap: 5,78T Scout-Claw of Khati Sha-5,03T
    Scout | 1,40T
    Scout | 891,37B
    Scout | 604,80B
    Mage | 574,36B
    Mage | 423,44B
    Mage | 410,97B

    But hopefully Daybreak truely monitores the stats and the fights
  12. Melt Actually plays the game

    Power of Mind + swash, bigger AoEs than mages have range
  13. Twisty Well-Known Member

    you guys are having a silly argument. there is no universally correct %-gap between scouts & mages because of 2 main reasons:

    a) the shetterino boat we're sitting in with cmit mechanics and some CAs bypassing it wholly or partially. this means that even if that age-old "equally geared and skilled" checkbox is hypothetically checked, if they're equally geared at 610k solo pot vs T1 raid mob - you can easily see mages at 30%, and 70% also feasable at 650k solo pot. imagine finding ourselves in a tub of lard where both of you actually quite reasonably can be right. coombaya?

    b) that age-old "equally geared and skilled" checkbox has always been laughable, but still valuable as a thought experiment at least in the past. i think we've jumped the shark sufficiently far circa last xpac, again in large part with how cmit works, that it's no longer valuable whatsoever. just cause solo stats for ppl are near-identical, in-combat variance of like 20k pot, 30fervor, 10adc short of cap and 1k CB is easily ~50% performance delta on that individual. and that in-combat variance is super trivial to happen without being aware of it happening. at least before in-combat stat comparisons could be somewhat deduced with Spark baselines and the like, but because of a) that's doesn't work anymore either. edit - well it still works for that, but the 1-2punch of drawing conclusions from it is no longer there due to a)

    so just take this all in and prepare for the inevitably amazing outcome that this "Great Mage Fix" will bring us
    Miauler, Beee and Priority like this.
  14. AvenElonis Well-Known Member

    @twisty - I really hope conjy, necro, warlock and wizard get help on 1/25. Coecers and Illys seems to be better (not sure why).
    Beee likes this.
  15. Ashandra Well-Known Member

    Traditionally for some reason they seem to get stuck on main and the swarm pets damage output due to multiple factors effecting this ie pot and diff types of fervor (the way it’s worded) along with how hidden mit effects things whichin turn tends to make a rough ride for summoners when it comes to tweaking .
    Beee likes this.
  16. Morprulz New Member

    As I have been a paid subscriber for 15yrs AND that I also use to be a coder for fun, I more than most can understand why things break and the fix that so many are shouting about isn't just a "press a button" and the world is better kind of deal. My point was that there is way to much whining and complaining when things don't get fixed at the speed in which most people feel it should. My point was that fixes take time and there is no magic fix at the speed of light when it literally takes thousands of hrs to pour over code that after 17rs is already in the billions of lines if not into the trillions category and try and find what the error was. What kind of response do you think people would have if the devs were to say "hey we don't know what the issue is because we are still pouring over all the code trying to find the error"? The response would be "these devs are idiots, these devs don't know what they are doing." When a patient person would realize that "hey, it takes time to find what was actually broken and then more time to actually fix it." With all the lines of code to pour over, hell I'm surprised and glad that at least they have an idea on what might fix the issue. Spend more time walking in another person's shoes before you start trying to cast doubt on what you consider subpar.
    Beee and Twyla like this.
  17. Tanto Done, finished, gone.

    It was reported widely during beta. That was months ago, there is no excuse. The players feedback was (as usual) ignored, that is all.
    Priority and Beee like this.
  18. DENSER Well-Known Member

    I really like the way we present, often explain things by analogy. it shows how much we want to be understood, coming from different countries, horizon. no irony in it( Obliged to specify it, because by writing, you know, the interpretation...).

    I understand your point of view, but I remain blocked on my ideas (a little obtuse perhaps).
    I am rather one of those who could understand a difficulty Met by the devs if they shared it, instead of waiting until the last moment, because a lot of people ask questions.
    Like you I support this game for a long time, like you also surely I love this game. Like those many players who complains and support eq2.
    we do not waste our time here for the pleasure of laying down our grudges.
    It should be a breeding ground for them of ideas, estimation of player satisfaction, exchange.

    now, I am calm, there was an exchange, a beginning of communication and therefore yes, more conducive to listening and understanding .
    Silence sometimes is not the best option
    Beee likes this.
  19. Beee Well-Known Member

    With the rising combat mitigation some meachnics just dont work.

    Training dummy in a guildhall shows this very nice: Some combat arts and effects are not or almost not effected, and some (mainly spells) amlost complete supresssed. You have a complete different parse with and without combat mitigation

    So I dont think a solid solution is to rise all mage spells by a factor xx%, it's a bug in the basic mechanic.

    Some things - like pets and swarmpets simply do not work, which hits some classes like summoners and others are not effected.
    It depends on the big plan how much a celestial summoner pet should do. It has spells, Abilities and things from AA which count for the player and should be scale with growth of the player. But pets do not and did not scale correct.
    Some pets (eg beastlord pet) seem to work, but they are effected by set boni like Forlon Pingyuan Diqu by 18%

    We are takling for 3 months (since beginning of beta) about not scaling effects and imbalance and hopefully they react before next addon and next problems ;)

    With the actual existing mechanic almost every mage should change to a scout, but no i will not play a beastlord just because a conjurer does not work atm :cool:
  20. DENSER Well-Known Member

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.