Did I have fun last night? No! But that was because of the death = frozen bug that I was gettting, but they know about it and are working on it. The new changes look good but I was having a hard time learing to use them (I have been goofing around with a new monk newbie for the past few days and working my tradeskills on both these toons). I was hoping to get 23% last night to get lvl 51 but the death bug got me frustrated and I didnt have too much time to play last night. I look forward to getting in a group this weekend and getting the feel of the changes and even some solo so I can learn how to use the new root (which works very well IMHO). I am disappointed in the change to point blank shot. At App 1 I couldn't back up and get a CA off. It was like 2.3 second stun on the description. If you lag the least little bit its near useless at app 1. I hope these are the begining of the changes and they dont sit back and pat themselves on the back and say DONE. I hope the seriously look at the parrying issue its totally out of whack. Even my monk was getting parried by 2 lvl lower down arrow mobs (only saying this to point out its not a ranger problem only). It really sucks on the multi-shot lines, and really really sucks on hidden shot lines. Oh I havent tried it yet but has anyone checked to see if bow auto attack is out dps'ing our bow CA's? I am curious with them upping the damage on bows how close the aa and ca damage is getting. Cause if aa damage is close to CA damage then they need to up the damage on CA's some more. Oh on a good note I got Storm of arrows the other night and bought the adept 1 for it and WOW! (well WOW! if it doenst get parried to zilch). Message Edited by Bithnar on 03-24-200607:59 AM
Bithnar, In the group I was in last night, when focus was up, my bow auto was hitting for around 2k with an Ironwood and reclaimed arrows. Solo was anywhere from 400 to 800 iirc but didn't test solo long - not for damage anyway - I was messing with roots and stuns. Also, if the AA damage and other changes puts us where we need to be why up the damage on our CA's? There's no reason why our AA shouldn't constitute a decent part of our damage - in fact it's beneficial becasuse it means we can still be effective while remaining out of range of AoE's. Mirdo.
Hey Fennir... Appreciate the work you do for us all here. I also have to agree with you, which I'm sure will earn me the fanboi award. I didn't get a chance to play in groups last night and I didn't really analyze what was going on with shots and what worked better, etc. However, everything "felt" like it was going down faster and I had a good time playing because things felt like they were working. Fanboi? Not really. But I do know when things feel different. I would agree with everyone else that says we shouldn't be beat by a conjuror or a bruiser. Unfortunately there are too many variables to figure out why that might be happening. All I can tell ya is if it is happening to me, once I've actually tested it. At this point, I feel "better' after the update than before. Not incredibly scientific, but /shrug. Things everyone should look out for. What is your gear, what are your art quality, what AA's do you have and using. What ORDER are you doing things. You can't compare yourself to anybody else because of all these variables which I lovingly call LEQoS (Level, Equipment, Quality of Spell).
Tasye, What is your problem with Fennir dissagreeing with you? Do you have this problem when other people disagree with you? Is your ego such that it leaves no room for discussion? Try writing respectfully or dont write at all. Thank you Saihung ***edited for her pleasure*** I just want to add something here, I understand some people are happy with the changes some people arent. I am not even going to say if I am or not...it doesnt matter to your opinion what I think. But I think attitudes like this poster...one where Fennir was on his ranger last night and is fine with the changes working as they are....he even acknowledges that thorny trap is indeed bugged for him too. So how does someone who is satisfied become a Fanboi....and someone who is not happy with the changes becomes a whiner...I am personally tired of both monickers and think that if that is your only retort to someone saying "Nope, sorry, I disagree" then you should just read the posts and keep your insulting opinions to yourself. No opinion is wrong but any insult is uncalled for... Message Edited by Saihung23 on 03-24-200609:26 AM
Did I have fun last night? NO I went to a torig raid last night, I am 57 and we didnt need to mentor to get the update for whoever needed it in the guild...WELL, I hit my lvl 54 master2 sniper shot and it hit from behind for a whopping 2100. 2100, thats it, that spell is the pennacle of my dmg. Yes its hit harder before (3400 max with a dirge), its hit for less before, but on a mob some 20 lvls below thats as good as I can do? I say 2100 cause that was the hardest I hit him or anyone in the raid for, previously it landed for 1800 and 1700. But to see a lvl 60 wiz high dmg spell hit for 6200.....3 times my max dmg and still they complain. Ice comet (lvl 50 mage spell) hit for, this is from the wizard subforum, M1: 3221-5983, and my m2 of a lvl 54 spell hits for 2100. THATS JUST WRONG. Our CA's need a boost, poison is not dependable anymore, we all know that, so to counter that, intead of making us good assassins, how about boost our CA's by some great %%%. Our CA's are totally inadequate. They put a root on a melee attack, how about a ranged one. How about leg shot rooting, or debilitating rooting or hell, snipers rooting with its long recast timer it wouldnt be over powering, we couldnt use it every fight. As it stands we lose the root time moving to range. When the proc nerf came it put the glaring problem that our CA's are straight up inadequate to be t1. Sniping shot should hit for about 6k, its reuse timer is long and casting time is not short, nor can we cast it whenever the hell we want. We have 2 restrictions on it stealth and range, as well as the components used to have it hit. They appeased Rangers in this fix, but IMO they did NOT fix us. You can call me doom and gloom, oh well, my rangers not even my main anymore and she had been since march of last year, but we are still as broken as ever. When I duel a Guardian and snipers shot hits him for 600......after I lost to him, being 2 lvls lower than me after my cheapshot did basically nothing, was the 2 second like on heroics, and my root didnt even.....I dont know what it did, i hit him expecting to be able to back up and there he is right in my face again, so it didnt do anything, even though I did dmg to him....I was just in awe....I just couldnt believe it...once my 3rd attempt at cheap shot worked, I finally got my snipers shot off, yay 600 but YAY phantasm proc, awesome, trip fire, PROC AGAIN YES, unload all my CA's at range that I could....didnt even get him into the orange, had shissar, adeste, and phantasm running. But hey, maybe I just suck as a ranger lol, its totally possible, espescially since the class has changed 3 times in as many months, I guess I havent beat the learning curve this month yet lol. I wanted SO MUCH for this to fix us, I mean, I LOVED my ranger, still do.....and she will remain alive til the fix is there....but this was not it IMO. I was so anxious to try the patch out....and then oh so quickly went back to the Monk.....my new teary eyed main lol. It saddens me
Caelum, I'm not going into detail but extend your research into wizzy vs Ranger damage into recast timers and numbers of CA's that can be cast quickly - you will see that over time the massive damage of ice comet tends to even out vs our faster casting arts. Taking your 2.k figure for a single CA in isolation is a pretty bad way of trying to illustrate what you perceive to be the overall problem with Rangers btw. Oh, and you even admitted yourself it was a lot lower than your highest hit with it. Did you even use the focus line last night? Did you not get at least some decent crits with that line running? How was autoattack, surely that must have been hitting for more now and critting when focus and the instinct lines are running? Please don't tell me you still had your bag full of low tier arrows? The root on the melee attack is so that we can back-peddle and get in one or two ranged attacks - what's the problem with that? Too dcomplicated? too many keys to push? Like Fennir I'm pretty fed up with the posts on here - many by people slating changes they haven't even tried - let alone had the time to optimise a new play style for. Mirdo. Message Edited by Mirdo on 03-24-200602:58 PM
No, you get an A+. This forum is regularly patronized by several low-skill players who are confounded by the ranger class.
Honestly, I think that LU21 is just fine. While Precise is underpowered (especially considering that one of our debuffs is heat, and it would be nice to have a higher powered heat shot), with Triple, you have to look at the cumulative damage. Each arrow that lands has a chance to proc both the bow proc and your poison proc. Add in Quick Shot to each, and Triple does damage between stealth shot and the single arrow line. But, if you're relying on Triple and Precise for your main DPS, then you may want to consider different strategy. Stream of Arrows is our main DPS ability after level 55. Try being stealthed on the pull and using Stealthy Fire (or Veiled Fire) as the initial attack. Fire off a Confusion arrow to lose aggro and immediately move into Stream of Arrows. That should be enough to drop any heroic mob in a group. For epics, when Stream runs out, use the Focus Aim for DPS and Haste buff and stay on ranged autoattack to finish off the mob, throwing in any triple, precise, etc in between the auto firing shots. The bow base DPS increase to the ebony bow makes a big difference on autoattack. While we don't proc on every other arrow hit like we did before the nerf, changing the way we do things keeps our DPS respectable. The new changes seem to put us back in line with what the ranger was intended to be :smileywink:
I'm really tired of people throwing out the fanboi label just because someone isn't grumbling and PO'ed about every freaking thing that happens. :smileymad: We all knew nerfing was inevitable, whe just hoped that they would have done incremental adjustments instead of the big axe. Now they are adjusting rangers in the right way: a little at a time. We all know if they made sweeping changes that odds are they wouldn't get it right and we would then have to face yet another nerf. Personally i'm tired of people seeing rangers as being nothing but a bunch of whiney little kids. That said, lets keep things positive and come to some kind of consensus as to what the next round of tweaks should be. For example i think most rangers will agree we need some major increases to our arrow 'harvest' abilities. Stream of arrows is pretty much worthless, even as something to hit while afk since i bet you can do more damage afk by hitting focus fire. Do we really want the skill "fixed"? Personally i think SoA was a terrible skill in the first place since it completely dumbed down the ranger class, so instead of fixing it i think it should be replaced by something completely different. Personally i'd like it to be replaced by some kind of group utility type spell, or even something that 'harvests' fire damage arrows in some fashion.
I liked them. Of course there are some things I don't like or missed. I missed that focus only increases the crit percentage for auto-attack..that sucks, but. The root is lasting close to 4secs if not 4. Focus Fire buff is cool. Auto-attack dmg is amazing, but the range of dmg is incredible. Sometimes 250, others 900. Some dmg increase on some CAs I didn't use so much before. Wish precise or triple was upgraded, but I'll adjust. I had fun. Changes were neat. I don't know where this puts us now, and I honestly haven't grouped enough yet to see how it affects that DPS. Tobi 56 Ranger
True, the so called marque skill from tier 6 is now useless. Sadly instead of a damage skill at 65 we got a hawk!
Amen Sailhung. I will be reserving judgement on this update after some more playing. I had 3 hrs last night and played strictly Solo to test out things. I definately had a better time solo, at least on solo con mobs up to 2 lvls above. Anything that was an add though caused problems (not much different than before). The lunging line with a root worked quite well for me. I could consistently get off sharp shot and triple arrow before the root expired. I just had to root and get back just far enough (about 2 steps) where they were useable..if i went back further then I could only get one or the other off. I did have to reorder my ca's a little. On a pull when stealthy was up it was basically stealthy fire, leg shot then debilitating arrow (use to be triple arrow here) and either confusion arrow or miracle arrow (with stuns I could usually get in both). I use them here now as there damage is higher and longer cast times dont work well with the root. (see below). Then in melee I start with snipe, fatal reminder for dots (use to be lunging blade here), blazing thrust, tear then lunging blade...after the root I use sharp shot and triple arrow..which works good with the root and is why I no longer use on the pull. The nice thing here is cheap shot is still waiting to be used and dire blade/longshank/tangle flame to follow if needed. Anyways, still experimenting here. looking for someone else to post that found a good way to start/end a fight. So for soloing the root itself has made a big difference. - Single mobs are now no problem up to ^ one lvl above (didnt try higher) - Grp mobs (or single adds) can be a problem if close to lvl..even if one arrow down...
With bow being slow that's not really an issue. You do the CAs in between the auto-attacks ( you don't really have to do anything, if an auto attack is about to happen while you are casting a CA the system delays it to fire as soon as the CA has fired. And yeah rain of arrows at adept 3 can put some nice 4K big numbers on your screen when it crits.. Message Edited by Ail on 03-24-200608:15 AM
Triple arrow is T6, I was mentionning the stats of the T7 upgrade Tripple Volley. I forgot the damage of the first arrows but the third one is like 650-1148 at adept 3 with my str...
People are posting, I'm not reading the forum because I'm sick of the negativity and people are posting accusing people of being fanbois. If you're sick of people's opinion if they're not positive...then perhaps you're right and you shouldn't read the forums. Attacking the person (ie, calling em a fanboi) was determined during the Plato/Socrates/Aristotle era over 3 thousand years ago as a fallacy when attacking an argument. To summarize, if you cannot counter the argument's premise logically, then attacking the credibility of the person making the argument still does not invalidate his stance. It just means that he won and you lost. Tobi 56 Ranger
Racmoor, I believe the term you are looking for is "Ad Hominem", and I agree completely. However, due to the nature of internet forums in general, and the relative anonyminity associated with them, that seems to be the bulk of forum discourse.
