Lich proc nerfed on test

Discussion in 'Necromancer' started by ARCHIVED-Lodor, Nov 3, 2005.

  1. ARCHIVED-El Chupacabras Guest

    I can proc out lich about 21 times a minute (going full force using all tricks to proc it) on average, used a 71 second fight to get the proc rate number... with the nerf we're looking at 3129 damage per minute.
    3,129 damage per minute for the uber level 50 spell.
    1,785 healed per minute
    900 self damage
    400 power restored per minute
    So:
    885 total heal per minute
    Additional 52 DPS
    6.7 power regenerated per second
    Ergo:
    Lich nerf=a really horrible idea.
    Also, why the heck is our root changing into a tether clone? Lich is nerfed on one hand to (I assume) combat the ability to chain root and kill stuff with lich procs but now we can just nuke like mad then reroot once the fear kicks in and repeat?
    So, with that huge damage nerf to the necro's, are we finally getting the rending line changed to also proc and be player targetable? Are we finally getting a damageshield? How about our stun getting fixed? What about fixing the warlock pets buffs?
    Put the brakes on guys and think about these changes a bit and look at the big picture (as you're so fond of saying). Necro's only do direct damage and that lich spell was in line with all the other mage 50 spells, now it does 25 more DPS than swarm of bats.
  2. ARCHIVED-Tzenn_ Guest

    Yeah, I think we saw this coming in one form or another. Too many folks crying because we are outdamaging them. So for our great performance we get punished. :smileysad:
  3. ARCHIVED-MrGrimm999 Guest

    Wow, man this is a huge huge hit. Before lich was the only way to keep up with a conj dps. Now they will blow us out of the water. And they still have two spells that are really really unbalanced and bugged (which I won't mention because my conj buddies will get pissed). The even if soe thinks that lich did too much damage before we couldnt go all out because we would just get agro. It is silly to nerf it this much, that was one of our main sources of dps. And lich only really shined in long fights, which is what necros are supposed to be, sustained dps. Even with lich the way it is now, in a short fight, a conj, wiz or warlock will beat us in dps. But in a long fight we would win. I guess soe just wants us to be less dps than wiz/war and conj in every situation.

    Also, they fix the warlock and wizard dumbfire pets to scale up to level 60 but they don't change our Servile Servant to scale with our level, it is still level 52 btw... Seems like in fixing the dumbfire pets, they forgot ours.
    Message Edited by MrGrimm999 on 11-04-2005 06:57 AM
  4. ARCHIVED-DantesInfern0 Guest

    You know, I haven't been impressed with the EQ2 version of the necromancer much at all. :smileymad: Seeing this nerf, a 50% reduction in lich proc, is just another reason for me to NOT want to keep playing this class. People kept telling me that lich is one of our class defining spells if not THE defining spell for our class. Now it's been severly beaten and I'm not liking the look of things.
    SOE, you need to provide a reason for something that is as drastic as this.
    And yes, take advice from other necros, if you're going to reduce the proc damage, decrease the life exchange rate or add something else beneficial to the spell.
  5. ARCHIVED-slyfer Guest

    This really F'in Sucks.

    Thats all I have to say. It will go live because I have never seen something on test get reversed. We were a horrible class for 9 months then our changes hit and it was great. I just have a feeling they are pushing us back to where we were.
  6. ARCHIVED-Tzenn_ Guest

    What's the term I'm looking for here....

    oh yes... indian givers!

    (no.. not trying to offend, just making a point)
  7. ARCHIVED-Kski93 Guest

    I seriously can't believe they are actually going to do this. We put up with one of the most broken classes(along with enchanters) since the game came out. There were hardly any necros out there, but still some of us clung to the hope that maybe when combat changes took place we would once again have a purpose in a group. When that day finally comes all the necros rejoice because they actually made us good. Now they want to take our most class defining spell and nerf it. *Applaud* Thanks sony great job. Not only do they not give us a reasoning behind it, but we dont even get any added utility to make up for it. I could have dealt with the fact that they nerfed lich if they had fixed other things. Even if they just fixed our freaking stun and made it useful 2 second cast? maybe add another line to do something else besides just stun?
    Lets go over what affect this will have. Necromancers are as of right now a DPS class. We have VERY little utility in a group situations(our res, and couple debuffs, and our gimped stun). So by lowering our DPS you are makeing use second rate dps casters. So when the choice comes down to a warlock or a necro we will get tossed aside just like we use to.
  8. ARCHIVED-keikomon Guest

    Wow..
    This is a sad..sad...day if this patch goes live....I mean where do our class fits in raid situation? Our group buff is a joke. We got no real debuff, compared to other classes..And now they are taking away our dps? Is our new roll in raids, is to sit back and feed hearts to raid members? And rez people when they die? We have no root, stuns, stifle, and/or pacify that can effect epic mobs....I mean, c'mon where do Necro fit in raid situations if this goes live?

    Frustrated Necro.
    Kikko
    Kithicor
  9. ARCHIVED-Windego Guest

    Wow, what really rubs me the wrong way is Gallenite (hey maybe you could take a break from your FoH message board love fest and address the game your a producer of, people actually liked to see the producer comment on a variety of issues like you were in March and April) and Moorguard in the days at the end of DoF/revamp beta and post revamp saying they have extensive parses and classes were where they wanted them. Here we are almost two months later and look at this! Ridiculous. LU 16 patch notes on a whole just illustrate to me they have no sense of direction what so ever in where they want classes, STILL. I said it before and I'll say it again. As long as the top tier mage DPS classes (Warlock/Wiz) enjoy a plethora of utility above ours, there is no justification in us being a Tier2 DPS class.
    To halve the damage on our class defining spell is the wrong way to go without addressing other issues (lower utility compared to Warlock/Wiz/Conj in my mind) or equalling out this nerf by providing us a bonus in other areas. Why not make our lifetaps heal for the damage they hit for? Why not make the heal component of lich equal to the proc damage it dishes out now that it has been reduced. Let consumption heal for the damage amount it hits for. Why not raise Clawing of the Soul to 25% chance to proc and the portion healed is the same as the damage? Lower cast time on our stun? Lower reuse time on Siphon Life? There are ton's of options.
    Happy Birthday EQ2 and Necros - We are nerfing the damage on your class defining spell without addressing other issues or putting into place other ideas that could compensate for it's loss. Here is your cake, in your face.
  10. ARCHIVED-Tanes Guest

    I may cancel my account over this. I did once before revamp.. we were totaly gimped before revamp and no one would group with us.. now we are finally in a state where people want us in a group and this.. well guess what I'll leave again for the same reasons as before..
  11. ARCHIVED-slyfer Guest

    Well since our class defining spell is getting nerfed. I hope that you are planning in decreasing the damage of Devastation and Ice Comet too since they are the Warlock and Wizard class defining spells.


    Message Edited by slyfer on 11-04-2005 12:54 PM
  12. ARCHIVED-MrGrimm999 Guest

    Conj could keep up with our damage if not more because of BP and Elemental Vestment. Now they will definately do more dps on group AND single mobs. Well hrm ok at least we can stifle, oh wait, we can't stifle but they have a 12 second stifle/pacify. Well our stun lasts longer than theirs, no, wait, it lasts the same amount of time and theirs does damage as well. Well hrm, at least we can snare kite still, no hrm, we can't kite because our snare breaks with damage. Oh yea that's right, conj's snare does not break with damage so they can still snare kite. Hrm... thinking... thinking... ahha we can fear and FD and heal other people and lifetap. Well FDs recast is 15 minutes and they get stoneskin, fear is useless on raids and really doesnt help in a group situation, healing others kills us very very quickly and isnt that great. It seemed before the one thing we had up on conj was we could do more damage on single mobs pretty consistantly because of lich, now they are taking that away. They can snare kite, stifle/pacify and their stuns do damage. We can lifetap? But lich and healing others and our pets takes a lot of that advantage away. Consumption's 2 minutes recast time is a joke to really be useful, FD is an emergency spell. Lich was the one thing that we could say hah! This is the one thing we have and it is great. If you look at all our spells they really aren't a lot of damage, but with lich it put us over the top. Halfing its damage is going to have a huge effect, much more than the devs realize at this point because a lot of our spells have a short casting time and lich procs quite a bit because of that. Besides our pet it is one of our main sources of dps. This is going to go live and it is going to hurt.
  13. ARCHIVED-Kniives Guest

    Now that theses changes are out in the open, can we have someone official come to this thread and defend their idea behind this HUGE nerf ? This is not a troll or anything, I want to understand why such action as been taken on the Necro class. Especially with many other spell in our book that need to be fixed.

    For once since DoF, I felt like I was something special as a necro. I'm afraid that these "nerfs" are just a tad bit too much !
  14. ARCHIVED-jeanjuedi Guest

    This is too sad, I was always fine with being gimped in terms of short term damage, I always knew that we really shined in long fights as sustained dps. I was so excited to play my class again after the revamp, even after some the changes to our group buffs. I can't really add much more than what has already been stated, but cmon did lich really make us overpowered? In short fights that was our main dps...if we had a chance to get a spell off on group mobs that is. Lets see, int buffs no longer stack, aoe's only affect 8 mobs (out of encounter), dooming darkness nerfed (whatever, 91% at ad3 was just asking to be nerfed), pets were at ad3 lvl even at ap1 (again, no big deal since I get ad3 immediately anyways), swarm pets not scaling properly (servile soul is worthless, even at ad3), our devour health was nerfed as well as sacrificial hearts (I can't believe people still ask for this...). I know that even posting is a waste of time since lich will be nerfed no matter how much it is bemoaned.

    I will add though, that I am not here just to rant or whine, I will not be cancelling my account, as I have played through too many changes to get completely upset over this. I will adapt to the changes, but that does not mean I agree wth them.
    Message Edited by jeanjuedi on 11-04-2005 10:37 AM
  15. ARCHIVED-Allowen Guest

    I will not get to much frustrated yet until I see the LU 16 working, maybe they will surely nerf lich but will boost some of our spells like upgrade our pet s dps a bit more and reduce the recasting time of our lifetabs and Ae spells )
    Btw what that change on darkness means? Some thing like when darkness fades it cast another snare ?what what?
    I hope this new snare for us will be similar to as good as it is the new lv 55 "ancient" conjuror spell, the snare last liek 48 secs and no damage can break it, but when it fades the conjuror needs to wait 12 secs or so to recast it, still much mroe uses then our darkness line of spell.
    Would be cool to agro kite mobs again, solo some nameds using our possible new bad **** snare cause that wil be the only way to kite since dolls will get interrupt on casting when we move and still long time to cast (total useless the slow from +agil dolls).

    Allowen
    60 necro
    Mistmoore server
  16. ARCHIVED-Sir Alex Guest

    This is bull, i have played many games over the years and Devs have always been on the boards when people have had concerns about changes to game play. dose anyone at sony even play a necromancer or have any real clue what out class even dose anymore or do they just make blind changes due to other peoples whinning. I would like one of the Devs to come here and explain to us why this spell needs to be reduced considering we were to be in line with everyone else after combat revamp. why is it when you out damage a warlock or wizard all of a suden there is a cry for nerf its like the assassin that posted on out boards cring about how we were out damaging him and wanted us to be more inline with there class. this has got to stop
  17. ARCHIVED-LadyVader Guest

    Pathetic, shame on you SOE! You're pushing it now. Guess I'll have to become a full time Interior Designer and stick to the Housing threads. :smileysad:
  18. ARCHIVED-Scyros Guest

    I have a 57 necro and I'll admit when DoF came out at lvl 50-54 the dmg on lich was a bit high. But now at lvl 57 320 proc is nothing. I have grouped with several Conj of the same or lower lvl doing as much dmg as I do. And in some cases more. Add to this the fact that your tank pet's mititagtion is clearly not scaling with his lvl, and the fact that from 50 to 57 get don't get any real increase in dmg and we can easily see that at 60 we might as well hang it up. I mean my parser shows lich as being well over 50-60% of my total dmg. So this could be as bad as a 30% reduction in my DPS. IMO they should have never removed dmg scaling with lvl. If they hadn't this would be an easy fix. At 50 it procs 150ish and scales up to 350ish at lvl 60. But no, scaling dmg obviously was too complicated for someone at SoE. The combat update did make the class better is many ways, but it also made it worse in many others.
    I'm not going to jump on the "i quit" band wagon just yet. But that time is drawing near. I will at least see how bad this change is and give it some time. Maybe they will fix some of the many broken aspect of our class like they are doing for everyone else in this update. It's doubtful I know.
  19. ARCHIVED-MrGrimm999 Guest

    btw if you want a dev to actually respond to a thread, dont ever ever ASK them to come and defend a position that developers make, that is a sure fire way to not get a response ever.
  20. ARCHIVED-Leawyn Guest

    Ok, i think the lich nerf sucks. Let me start by saying that.
    But BOO ON YOU all who are whining that we have no utility. Maybe you don't know how to play the class to its full capability. But I have been perfectly capable of being the only healer in a full group killing adequately conning mobs. I have saved a raid by landing that much needed heal on the MT before he died. I have saved a raid by being able to rez up that down wizard to get that one last nuke in. I can duo with pretty much any class, especially tanks. And i duo well.
    Ok, cry all you want about Lich. Maybe just maybe they'll realign it again. But I don't ever want to hear how we are not utility. We can heal, we can rez, we can FD, we can stun (its not the best, but in a pinch it helps), we can debuff, we can crowd control (using pet, charm, root, fear etc), we have some really nice buffs/dps spells off of our Soul spells, and all the while we can be dpsing as well. And not to mention, we RARELY run out of power. Yeah, we aren't the best at any of these things, but we can do them ALL! How many people can claim that?
    Necro's are utility. And I am tired of you all making us out not to be. Live up to your potential and you can show these people that we are not only good dps, but an excellent back up healer, rezzer, and can FD when all hell breaks loose.

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