LFG Window

Discussion in 'Developer Roundtable' started by ARCHIVED-Rothgar, Dec 10, 2008.

  1. ARCHIVED-Windowlicker Guest

    There's a few problems at play here.
    1. Years of abuse from Plat sellers, and a pre-existing reflex based on old-world needs to hide one's presence in a zone has resulted in far too many anon-players running around.
    2. The LFG window lacks the functionality we require to create groups.

    Currently, if we attempt to use the LFG window we will encounter:
    • Zero people LFG
    • Zero groups LFM

    When filling a group, this results in a requirement to:
    /who all Guardian 77 80
    /who all Berserker 77 80
    /who all Shadowknight 77 80
    /who all Paladin 77 80
    Then a barrage of random /tells going out to any players that are reported by this query. Of course, this completely misses anyone with the anon flag. The main reason for this, is that absolutely nobody uses the LFG tool.

    So how about reworking the tool? Have the tool ignore the anon flag, and list those players in searches. Have everyone, and I mean everyone in the game who isn't grouped listed as an available player that is possibly LFG. This plays directly into the fact we've already established that people are NOT going to use an LFG flag, and are NOT going to use the tool to list themselves as "Looking for group".
    Either way, we'll have to send them a /tell asking if they're interested. Either way, we'll have to query the information. How about making that part of the process easier?
    This tool shouldn't list what zone the players are in, however it should enable us to create a list which would include them. Let's be honest, people will use the ANON tag even if they absolutely have no reason to use it. Heck, some people just like the pink name.
  2. ARCHIVED-kaeric23 Guest

    What I would like to see is LFH (Looking for Help). A checkbox could be added to each quest page in your journal, and you could check the quests you want help with. Anyone bored, feeling helpful, or also needing help on a quest, could /lfh and see a list of quests that people who are logged in want help with...grouped by zone (defaulting to current), sorted alphabetically, sorted by level or grouped by toon. Just as /lfg, it could be automatically turned off when you join a group and re-turned on if you want to be interrupted during your group.
  3. ARCHIVED-ke'la Guest

    Zahne@Mistmoore wrote:
    CoH uses a system like this and while it does lead to a number of blind invites(I always say no to blind invites) it also does make grouping easier for the people who do send tells first. However, I would add one thing to it that CoH also has and that is a NOT looking for group switch, basically the ablity to flag yourself as someone to not send a tell or invite too(though it would still display the name).
  4. ARCHIVED-Tinrae Guest

    I would have a problem with the system automatically listing me as available players if I'm not in a group, as I don't care to join random parties. I'm happy enough with my group of guildmates and friends and would be slightly annoyed to receive /tells all the time asking if I want to group when I'm not interested in doing so. If there was a switch to set me as NOT LFG that'd be fine however and I'd support the idea.
    I don't set myself as Anon or Roleplaying either, because as a crafter I like players seeking a high level crafter to be able to find me for potential commissions.
  5. ARCHIVED-ke'la Guest

    Tinrae wrote:
  6. ARCHIVED-Anonolo Guest

    I'd love to see a LFR/LFG Function as follows:
    1. Better "LFM" for both, raids and groups where i can check classes i need to fill up
    2. Maybe a toggle for autoinvite. If level and class is matching with the information i filled in "LFM" the person who acquires gets an auto-invite. This would be awsome for pickup-raids aswell. People could invite themselfs into the raid when they meet the pre-requisites.
    3. LFG/LFR for Twinks/2nd Chars
  7. ARCHIVED-Albright Guest

    Rothgar wrote:
    -Yes.
    -It works.
    -No one seems to use it.
    -a 1g reward insentive for a successful group formed through the LFG to each member. Could be exploited, but set in place a tick-over of LFG successful use to 30 minutes. So no messing about with it. * Also could do other insentive rewards to successful groups formed. I doubt you'd beat gold rewards though.
  8. ARCHIVED-Fival Guest

  9. ARCHIVED-Eugam Guest

    Rothgar wrote:
    The window is good as it is. Just noone is using it. Thats not the windows fault :) People just love their daily LFG ritual in 1-9 and 70-79 ;)
  10. ARCHIVED-Motzi Guest

    Rothgar wrote:
    My Opinion:
    The current window is rich with features and has nearly every element that can add functionality to it.
    Do I use it?
    Yes. But only because I can't put up a LFG tag without using it.
    What do I like?
    Searching for group function shows groups my alts might want.
    What don't I like?
    No one uses it, making the tool irrelevant.
    My Suggestion:
    Remove the panel from game. Restore the basic /lfg tag, however ALLOW use of the /lfg tag WHILE already grouped. Also add a /LFM tag.
    This way we can just do /who lfg and /who lfm and quickly find what is out there. We're more than capable of parsing that list of levels/class/zone from the who command to contact other players or not.
    The features of the panel adds unnecesary complication. Players don't use the panels because it is just simpler to use level chat. Reduce the effort to flagging LFG, LFM, LFW to 4 keystrokes (/lfg, /lfm, lfw) and players will use it.
  11. ARCHIVED-Sipico Guest

    Usually my posts are removed by a moderator because my comments stray from being constructive into other realms by discussing the size of the bus that carries the programmers and/or designers to school, what they do with their time instead of playing the game, and suggestions that are probably anatomically impossible.

    I will endeavor not to make any of those mistakes in this note.

    I don't use the LFG tool. Why?

    1) We have all been conditioned NOT to use it. I remember trying to use it and it would CONSISTENTLY report erroneous results. Did the designers ever fix this? Who knows. Not me. I stopped using it because it was worthless. Nobody ever responded to a single bug/petition that it was fixed or agreed that it was broken.

    2) Everyone begs for groups in channel. That's it. Plain and simple people BEG for help running quests. The sophomoric method of BEGGING for help is just another symptom of the real root cause of all of EQ2's problems.

    3) Heuristics. sony does not understand that word. Nobody working at sony has ever done a heuristic analysis of the game. If they would only do a simple heuristic analysis of the game they would see huge flaws that are relatively easy to fix.

    4) sony employees don't play the game. It's impossible to think that they can play the game and not see these problems. Someone should make the designers play the game as a regular user. Let them sit on quests for 2 years or more begging in channel for help.

    5) Not finding groups is the largest and most common time sink in this game. Most quests and even epic events are simple if you can find the players. sony will never fix this. sony does not want this fixed.

    How difficult is it to put in a tool that allows me to see who's working on quests that I want to finish. Heck there are some great zones that I just like playing in, without needing a quest. I like helping.

    Diablo had a better method of finding groups. Players named the games according to what was happening in that game, and everyone joined to help.


    My suggestion is to start firing people. Start at the top.
  12. ARCHIVED-Mytilma Guest

    Do you use it? No.

    What do you like about it? That's a difficult question...

    What do you NOT like about it? For the little use it provides, it's too complicated.

    Do you have any suggestions for making it better? Yep, see below:

    I would use it more often, if it would allow to display WHAT FOR you are drumming up a group. I have a lot of quests on hold, because I don't want to bugger people with it who either aren't interested in it or have it already done.

    So long story told short, I want a window, where I can enter, what heroic quests I am working on at the moment with the most priority. But if you make it a free edible textbox, it won't work, because everyone would write and abbreviate the quest in a different way, so that a search for it would not be possible.

    A solution would be to add checkboxes to the quest journal, where you can check a number of quests, say, 5 or 6, not to overload the feature. Thus telling, what quests have at the moment the most priority for you.

    In the LFG window, add a drop down menu, that contains all your checked quests. So if I look for help with a certain quest, let me choose it from that menu and check with a push button, who else is working on it. When I see a number of players, with level and class, working on the same quest, let me ask automatically (by pushing another button) "Hi there, I am working on quest X, would you be interested to join?" Perhaps even a button to invite that person, but that's optional.

    I'm aware, that lots of quests (namely HQs) consist of many steps and what I am proposing does not provide the information, what step I am on. I don't have a quick solution, but thinking of it, I would still find said feature pretty cool.
    The quest should be automatically unchecked, when you complete it. People who are grouped, should not be visible in the search, not to bother them in vain. If possible, let the player choose "I want to get tells from people doing my priorized quests, even though I am grouped". There could further be a checkbox "Members of my guild preferred", but that's also optional.
    Could further add a general search ("What are other people trying to do?"). And an option for the most common stuff (AA runs, XP gain, general shard runs, daily double, most popular dungeons etc.), without having to ask everyone, what he wants to do. So if I'm always open for a shard grind, let me check a box and be done with it, and everyone who thinks similarly, will see my name.

    I didn't read the whole thread, so if others proposed the same thing, I don't try to steal your idea, just telling what I would like to see.
  13. ARCHIVED-Golbezz Guest

    The real problem isn't with the LFG window. The "problem" is that skill levels, equipment and playstyles are not compatible at the high end. TSO is a great example since the group instances require a good group to complete and hardcore players don't want to waste their time using a feature that doesn't mention their playstyle or gear.

    I see people forming groups in the channels that look something like this:
    Palace group looking for DPS, must have mythical, PST.
    Why would the player forming this group want to look at a list of dps classes that are all /LFG (assuming people actually even used the /LFG window)? It is easier for them to send the message to the chat channel until they find someone and the "must have mythical" comment gives people the idea that it is a well geared and experienced group. In a few minutes a DPS class with their mythical sends a /tell and joins the group which ends up taking less time than the group leader trying to search a list of DPS classes that are /LFG.
  14. ARCHIVED-Censeo Guest

    When I hear about offering rewards for starting a group EQ1's Group/Raid Leadership Abilities come to my mind, which were pretty nice.
    I'd personally like a simple /lfg mode PLUS a advanced LFG window if you want to spread some additional information out to the world...also a pickupraid/LFR window/tab were you can subscribe (like the Valentine's Day run) with a adjustable class array (like 4 melee fighter type, 2 chain/2 leather/2 plate healers, xx mage dps, xx melee dps) or some sort of that. The raid leader/starter gets the offered toons level and class (even if anonymous /hint) and can pick people up more easily, also you just could put in LFR/Levi by choice without worrying to miss a level chat message while you're crafting or on /brb bio
    By now I'm not using the lfg window at all besided I'm that much bored to open it....
    give us /lfg easymode back!!! *lols*

    Censeo Darkwood 80 Inquisitor/80 Carpenter/400 Tinkerer
  15. ARCHIVED- Scholar Guest

    Rothgar wrote:
    I dont group much as I either solo or go with guildies.
    I dislike using the chat channel as there can be a lot of msgs and I tend to miss annoucements. Especially if I am actually playing the game and not staring at the chat channels.

    Suggestions:
    Auto-announce on chat channels that your LFG
    Remove AFK and maybe anonymous if you are setting up a LFG flag.
    Allow us to add alts that are LFG but are offline. Guess that means adding a who to /tell option
    Is there a slash command that toggles /LGF on and off? Guess I should go look.
    Be able to specify zone

    Thanks for asking
  16. ARCHIVED-QuiDex Guest

    I use the thing all the time (LFG Window) however even when I am on for like ten hours straight I don't get a single request to a group. So apparently no one uses it which makes it innefective especially when people tell me they don't use it because they get crappy groups. I also have people tell me get a guild group which would work if they werent 6000 guilds with only a few people on at most times. Or if the guild that has lots of people on it says you cant join until you are level 80 with good equipment & spells. So its no wonder most of us are having to solo most of the time. I am not whinning about the situation just trying to inform the SOE staff about why no one is using the LFG Window. I have been playing since day one of EQ1 and back then we did not have guilds however we had lots of groups. I will say that lately there seems to be more people wanting to group and have been getting some nice groups. However not one of those have been a guild group and only a couple have been via the LFG Window. This was written to inform and give positive realistic feedback not to offend or start flame wars.
  17. ARCHIVED-Cubey Guest

    I played a few mmo that have similar LFG windows and in those game they was a necessity of life and if anybody used any chat other than guild chat to start groups they would be rediculed and shamed for it publicly. I have no Idea why everquest 1 or 2 players seem to insist on using a chat spam in chat groups to find a group it's annoying, I never see anything in the sea of text to even notice the request it just more unimportant text to me. And 3 It is not on demand if the request scrolls of the chat channel well then nobody cares anymore if you are looking for group.. SO yes I use the LFG window it is not that hard it's just a mouse click or hotkey away, it's fine the way it is though it should list race ETC besides class.
    Your request to join a group stays there at all times with a short comment on what you want to do why do you think chat channel spam is better than it? I moved the chat channel to it's own tab so I would not have to watch it..
    I mean everquest 2 LFG window now is way better than the other games LFG windows and people used those more. hell I will say it now in Final fantsy 11/ eve online/whatever people only used the lfg window to get groups and it looks like a stone age tool compared to everquest 2 window.
  18. ARCHIVED-salle Guest

    Do I use it:
    • Yes, not regularly and not for a while, but I have on occation.
    What I like about the it:
    • It doesn't spam channels, or require me to use them.
    • The roles checkboxes, lets people who play their class in an unusual way do so.
    What I don't like about it:
    • No one uses it ;)
    • Even though it's simple I'm sure it could be made both more simple in appearance and more powerfull as a tool if used propperly by a player.
    • There's not enough tie ins with other parts of the interface.
    What I'd like to see done to it:
    • Show the LFG/LFM information in more windows like in guild tool and friends list. There's probably even more ways ones LFG status could be put out there for people to see. Would be interesting to see in guild tool if a guildy was in a group LFM players I can just hover the LFM text in the list and see his/her group and where they are or what they are looking for.
    • Use information from windows to form groups, when you get the accept a quest window, have an option to start looking for group for that quest and from buttons within active quest or quest journal windows.
    • Make it easy to set up that you want to go to a specific instance or set of instances.
    • Have the tool suggest that you form a group if enough other players are looking for the same and the mix is deemed good enough depending on a few things.
    • Make an interpreter that uses player written information and turning it into lfg flags and lfg tool information. either if you're writing in a channel or making it directly into /lfg, having a list of standard abreviations for zones, make the search use boleen expressions like not etc. so /LFG 80 Guardian/tank ROK, TSO not HT, COA and it'd interpret it, set the lfg up. If I did it into a channel a box would pop up asking me if I wanted to be flagged as LFG (or LFM). People do seem to be quite comfortable using a text input style similar to this already (as in the spam messages you see, just adding a few parameters. and it can then even be macroed so if you want to do the same thing, like the 2 sharder, every day you could just have a macro to start LFG for that day's 2 sharder quest.
    • If you're LFG flagged for anything and a group LFM but not for what you are flagged for, but say are for a quest step you're on, you could get a notifyer about it. giving more people reason to have the LFG flag up so they'd see these things without having to do much but slack.
    • Give people rewards for forming up groups using the tool, perhaps by giving people doing it often a tittle, or increasing the loot drop rate for that group by 1% or a temporary buff as long as you're in the group with a tiny effect like out of combat runspeed and hp/power regen.
    • Make it usable for pick up raids to use and anounce their raids/raidtimes. listing classes/roles they need, just like for a group.
    • Make a LFG and a LFM channels for the people who still likes to see these things as chat chanel text. where all people putting in LFM or LFG will be put into the channels formated pretty much like the standard texts are now. or as they themselves wrote their /LFG or /LFM
    Hmm that's all I can think of for now.
  19. ARCHIVED-Jeepned2 Guest

    Hey Rothgar, really wish I had some decent input for you on this one. But it's been so long since I've used the LFG window, don't even know what the current one looks like.
    Unfortunately none of the recomendations I've seen so far would get me to use it either. Normally I'm already on the toon that I want to group with, and a shout or two in chat normally get's me a group. Or a quick "Group LF" is about all that is used anymore.
    The LFG window is just one of those things that years ago was almost critical to have but has since been regulated to uselessness due to a lack of use.
    Good luck with this one.
  20. ARCHIVED-DeathRide Guest

    I am very disappointed in the /lfg window to be honest. I am currently migrating to the game from Wow and when I do find groups it is very enjoyable, but frankly no one uses it.
    I think at this point unless you make it a needed tool, no one will use it, which is unfortunate.