Ideas for Green Adornments

Discussion in 'Items and Equipment' started by Menelag, Dec 8, 2012.

  1. Menelag New Member

    Ok, we all know that some of the better Green adornments take obscene amounts of grinding to level up, and this would be fine if the benefits the adornments provided were worth the wait. Forgive me, but 300 hours to level up an adornment that gives you 20 multi attack, 40 str, agi, etc, and 20 dps mod just is not worth the grind and leaves me with a bad tase in my mouth. Adornments that take this much time to level up should at the very least be unique and not just offer the same stats that are already on virtually every piece of gear. My suggestion is that for those types of adornments, reduce the time it takes to level them by 50% at the very least, but add very powerful unique adornments that give you benefits that don't already come with the gear you're looting. Some ideas:

    Universal Adorns, provide desired benefits to any, or most classes-
    -10% increase to the values of all groupwide buffs
    -10% decrease to the power cost of all abilities
    -Increases the duration of all temp buffs by 5 seconds
    -2% reduction to all incoming damage
    -Reduces the reuse of combat arts by 10%

    Fighter Adorns, geared specifically toward meatshields-
    -removes negative effects from the fighters offensive and defensive stances
    -Gives combat arts that stun the target a 2% chance to strike additional targets in a short radius
    -10% of all hate generated by the group is transferred to the fighter

    Priest Adorns-
    -Improves the reuse of the priests primary group cure (not the ones from aa or myth quest) by 5 seconds
    -Improves the radius of all AoE beneficial spells by 10
    -1% of the damage dealt by the priest is converted into a heal, and distributed across the group

    Mage Adorns-
    -When the mage takes any damage, 2% of that damage is converted into power for the mage
    -On any hostile spell cast, has 3% chance to increase the damage of the next spell by 5%
    -Beneficial temporary buffs have their values increased by 5%

    Scout Adorns-
    - 2% chance for any combat art to strike additional targets in a short radius for 10% of the damage inflicted
    - Reduces the duration of combat arts that deal DoT, making the damage occur faster
    -Removes negative effects from the scouts offensive and defensive stances

    These effects would be the "reward" you get once the adornment hits level 10, with previous levels being standard stats.
    This would make adornments that take ages to level worth leveling and give players a true sense of accomplishment once completed. As it stands now, green adornments feel like a lot of work for virtually no reward, and the benefits from them are boring and cut and pasted from every piece of gear in the game.
    Ideas?
  2. Daalilama Well-Known Member

    TBH I agree the green adorns are somewhat meh and your suggestions was what I had thought they were leaning toward when they announced green adorns that level up with you as you adventure....and not the bland extra general blue stats we got.
  3. Mermut Well-Known Member

    Reuse, at least for priests and mages, is pretty much wasted these days as most (if not all) top tier toons of that class have it maxed.. and the second reductions from AA and procs do NOT stack with the 100% reuse, unfortunately.
    I do like your idea overall, however.
  4. Estred Well-Known Member

    Your system also is borderline trying to replace AA's found in the KoS AA Tree's and class abilities.

    Removing detriments from offense stance is something the Warrior tree has.
    10% hate transfer... now you are infringing on Paladins and Guardians.
    Improving spell radius: There is already a red adorn for this.
    getting hit for power: since when should a mage be hit? Chanters have this already for their groups.

    And just a question are these the max (lvl 10) adornment Ideas for you? Keep in mind you also have 3 green slots. Does it seem really all that balanced for a tank to get 30% hate transfer for existing? If you stacked duration removal adorns then dps would spike insanely fast and PvP would go out the window not to mention any tank without your proscribed "meatshield" adorn would lose hate almost instantly. Your mage adornment would make chanters very devalued because a mage could get 6% of a 100K AE meaning 6K power every AE or Power-Drain.

    I understand you feel greens should have more "umph" but this is not a balanced way to do so. Currently believe it or not the Green Adorns at lvl 10 are by far the best adornment you can/will ever get for jewelry. A quick comparison say you are looking at a Prime Consecrated Soul Trap which at lvl 10 gives:

    +33 str +33 agi +33 sta +33 int +33 wis

    +17% Attack Speed +17% Multi Attack Chance +3.8% Crit Bonus +3.8% Potency +300 Ability Modifier

    Lets break this down.
    33 to all green stats is almost a Skyshrine ear proc on its own.
    17% Attack Speed. Take 2 of these and you have a 2nd Haste stack on you (Gloves + Green = ~84% Attack Speed)
    17% MA currently white adorns take 2 of these and only get ~10%.
    3.8% CB and Potency. As white adorns stand you can only get 6% of one of these stats without sacrificing red slots.
    300 ability modifier this is a free Drunder Set bonus almost.

    Now if you have 3 of these Prime dps adorns you have.
    +99 str +99 agi +99 sta +99 int +99 wis 51% Attack Speed +51% Multi Attack Chance +11.4% Crit Bonus +11.4% Potency +900 Ability Modifier

    You um... like your free piece of HM Raid Gear there?
  5. Estred Well-Known Member

    Suffice to say I don't agree with your proposal. You idea however is somewhat intriguing though difficult to say what is and what is not worth our time. Green Adorns level as you play, if you are trying to "grind" them you are not going about it right. It is a passive reward considering we lose nothing as all Green Slot jewelry has 1-2 White slots too just like previous stuff. It's an addition to our repertoire of stuff as adventurers.

    Have you unequipped all your "magic" arms and armor to see how strong your lvl 95 really is if they were nothing but a commoner?
  6. Daalilama Well-Known Member

    TBH Estred I think he just like a great many of us half expected something else in the form of a green adornment kinda like he suggested maybe not exactly as Men suggested but there was alot they could have done to make them have the wow (no pun intended) factor. As it is they are (if you have all three) 1 more raid stat item. Thats not to say I wont use them but considering the hype they gave them and the information they gave out (which amounted to nothing more than green adornments level up as you use them) I figure alot of the community guessed they'd be incredible....
  7. Menelag New Member

    It's not "umph" that the adorns need, it's stuff that you don't already get on legendary bracelet #3,552, ie. crit bonus, attack speed (which by the way most classes will already have capped at 95). These are some general ideas and I understand that some balance would need to be struck. I would not recommend that adornments of the same type be stackable, so you could only really use one hate transfer adorn (great for bruisers, or other fighter classes that have a harder time holding aggro). Sure, you can get a red adorn for spell radius, but wouldnt it be nice if you could instead use the green one and get a different red one for that slot?
    "Your mage adornment would make chanters very devalued because a mage could get 6% of a 100K AE meaning 6K power every AE or Power-Drain." If you read my post, you will see I said "2% of all damage recieved". A 100k AE would almost always kill all but the best geared mages, and even then I would make it so that it only works when you are actually taking damage, wards would negate the effect. This would not devalue enchanters at all as far as I'm concerned, as most of the time mages don't take any damage anyway. An individual proc would be no more than say, a manastone. Heck bump it down, to 1% or .5%, idk.
    "Removing detriments from offense stance is something the Warrior tree has." Why couldn't there be an amazing green adorn to give other fighters this option? Just throwing out ideas here.
    "Reuse, at least for priests and mages, is pretty much wasted these days as most (if not all) top tier toons of that class have it maxed.. and the second reductions from AA and procs do NOT stack with the 100% reuse, unfortunately." The reuse adorn is aimed at scouts/fighters, since they do not get a lot on gear as it stands. Sure, you can reforge your gear and get some (our guild's main tank is a monk who has been sitting at around 45% reuse for a while, not PoW geared, but good nonetheless).
    The adorn that reduces the reuse of the priests cure spell would override reuse speed entirely making the base reuse speed 5 seconds shorter.

    New " TBH Estred I think he just like a great many of us half expected something else in the form of a green adornment kinda like he suggested" Exactly this. I, and pretty much everyone I know, expected something along the lines of a good raid gear proc, but in adornment form. Crit bonus is good, so is multi attack, but unless you can get yourself geared up in PoW gear, any MA above 600 is wasted and would be better reforged into something else. I was just hoping for interesting, powerful effects from these things. That's all.
  8. Estred Well-Known Member

    I understand this. You did not specify that these adorns were LORE adornments. My values are based on what I see. I am in the minority of HM Raiders I know this. You also did not specify that wards would negate the power proc as it was soley based on HP that you lost not incoming damage.

    If you can think of a different ability for Stance Mastery in the Warrior tree let me know. If you want to give a class-endline skill as an adornment then I was Legionairs Conviction on an adorn (I am being snarky to make a point). Classes btw cannot cap on CB or Potency. I have had 700% Critical Bonus before and let me tell you that fight was hellish to tank because of the near 40-50 adds I was tanking with our SK. I as a fighter sit at 72% Reuse Speed static and have procs for it. I use at least 12-17% from adornments. Unless you raid you shouldn't expect to cap out all these skill easily and that is what the Green Adornments right now aim to do. Help those who do not have raid gear to fill in some holes in their armor so to speak.

    I think you have a generally decent idea; to make green adornments have unique effects at lvl 10". For this to be more easily balanced though if it were done then procs would have to be moved off Ears/Necks/Rings and put on Green Adornments. Balance becomes very unstable with too many procs going off. I am still against giving out Transfer Adornments, Dmg -> Power adornments (exploitable in older content) or DR adornments.

    Unfortunately your adornments are taking the place of Alternate Advancement points in a few areas such as your suggested DR and Threat transfers. There are AA to increase spell ranges and there are already adornments that do this. There is one in CoE that increases Auto-Attack, Spell-range and Ranged... range by 11% and that's on 1 adornment. I stick by my statement that balance wise the current Green Adornments are fine as is. They are little upgrades to your existing stats not fantasmagorical new toys for us to waggle around. They are to be carefully figured out which is best for you or what you want. There are %HP, %Mitigation, Attackspeed and MA which btw both don't cap they convert, there is also Ability mod which by far for most dps classes is the most sought after under CB and Potency.

    I can see you disagree with my stance though. I have stated my views and you have yours. I do hope you can be alright with that.
  9. Estred Well-Known Member

    I didn't buy into the hype of the Green Adorn, I figured it would be just like the Yellow and Red adornments. Unique little bumps that we got for getting Heroic and Raid gear. Never expected to see Red's on Solo Gear like we have with the rare drops now.
  10. Menelag New Member

    "I can see you disagree with my stance though. I have stated my views and you have yours. I do hope you can be alright with that." I'm actually glad we disagree, because of the conversations it provokes. More details can be worked out when people disagree, and a happy medium is usually the result.
    I'm in a guild that is allied with a couple other guilds for a casual raid force. We are serious, but not too serious. There are some classes that suffer, and though the new prestige abilities adress some of these issues, there are still people left sitting on the bench because their class is of no particular use to the raid. I feel adornments like these could help people who prefer playing, say, a bruiser, perhaps find a spot on our raid force. The ideas I threw out were very general, meant mostly to spark a discussion on this, for example you pointed out the pvp side, and much like other procs on gear the effects could read "Must not be engaged in pvp combat". The CA reuse adorn could be cut down to 7% or even 5%, which would make any scout or fighter just as happy (as you know, reuse doesn't come easy for these classes). What I would really like to see are class specific adornments, a-la some of the older raid gear, but I think SoE's limited bugdet doesn't allow for this depth anymore. There are infintie possiblities with this kind of thing and my objective with this thread was successful- to get some kind of discussion going about this.
  11. Estred Well-Known Member

    Ya know I can maybe see Class Specific versions of adorns to make up holes in their unique make-ups. As I stated I felt your original ideas were a bit "blanket" type fixes. From what I see in HM content here are some issues that plague us.

    Memwipes Excessively: We tend to hold hate so a 10% Transfer wouldn't help much though it would make us very powerful in heroic content almost to the point of trivializing it. For a HM Tank to lose aggro it has to actually throw them off the hate list.
    Heals are solid: As before unless we are deathshot we tend to not die so DR doesn't benefit us except make us more OP.
    DPS: This is the one area many guilds lack very very much in even HM Guilds like Kharma. I can see new dps-centric Greens maybe useful.

    I am interested though now, what do you think is lacking the most from greens because as my original higher post if you get 3 Consecrated or hell 3 of any adornment they get overpowering in their stacked effects.

    Do you feel they are missing diversity? Utility? Damage? Survival? Perhaps it just is that the lvl 10 has no flavor like a unique proc or sustained effect? I love constructive discussions and am glad you wish to have one instead of mindless yelling at each other so please let me know.
  12. Thalador Active Member

    How about adding something useful for mages like SDA?
  13. Glassjaw Active Member

    Reduce the amount of xp required to level them by ohhh about 75% and leave the stats as is.. they are just adornments not AA on an item.

    The amount of time it takes to level this is out of hand and if the intention is for that to keep people playing in order to achieve max level.. I don't see that being a very positive reinforcement.

    Let's see new heroic and raid zone content every 3 months - that will keep people interested.
  14. Xeos Well-Known Member

    Green Adornments should have had stats that most classes cannot attain by normal circumstances.

    IE Combat Art Double Attack, Spell Double Attack, Spell Flurry, Spell Autoattack Flurry, AE Multiattack, Base Reuse Speed Reduction, Strikethrough Immunity (%). Even these above listed as temp buffs via a proc, instead of straight percentage would be nice.

    Class specific adorns could be added that would make certain combat arts instant cast, lower reuse on certain cas/spells by a ton, or add unique effects. Ala red adorns, but with other archetype specific bonuses and the ca/spell bonuses would be the very last level.

    To less of a degree: damage procs, power procs, ward procs, massive amounts of ability mod etc.

    Plain stats get rather boring after a while.
  15. Vlahkmaak Active Member

    Green adorn:
    * Upon any hostile pvp combat action this effect will dispel targets merc.
    * Upon any hostile pvp combat action this effect will dispel any merc, friend or foe, with 50m.
  16. Daalilama Well-Known Member

    Agreed with the duration it takes to level them up...this should be looked at and I believe if you have more than 1 green adornment on your gear it looks like the xp any of them gets slows to a crawl worse then the snails pace it is now.