Fix berserkers pls.

For a long time now the berserk class has been forgotten when it comes to end game. Most ppl use them to power lvl other toons with and so on. With the prestige points that came sure zerks got a small boost. But so did every other tank class. So berserks is still the worst of them all when it comes to tanking. You dont see much complains about it any more since most have given up hope of the class ever being able to compete again on a raid level. And most ideas that are up on the table are either to OP or stuff that dont need to be fixed at all. Here i have a small list of not to OP things that would make the berserk class a better tank again.
1.The damage with a shield (defensiv) on both warriors is a joke vs ALL other tanks. Remove the 30sec down timer on reversal and make it proc on every avoided hit.
2.Hate is very bad on the class. Add a small hate siphon on berserk, And make the hate proc on Adrenaline crit again.
3. Remove cancel by CA on dragon reflexes. All the other tanks - warriors have temp avoidance buffs with out it so it makes no sens that they should be punished for having it.
4. The berserkers health is by far lowest of any class in the game. For me thats a joke since we are tank no? Add 10% max health somewhere pls.
5. The berserkers Singel target CA:s are lowest of all tank classes and need a boost. Other tanks get it so why not a berserkers.
6. Change Focus berserk that adds combat skill to berserk into something els like add str/agi and reuse speed. The class utility is worst of all tanks so they really do need a boost there. Or add a tiny damage proc to berserk.
7. Focus controlled rage need to be boosted... 5% block chance on a temp buff is just silly imo.
8. Change wall of force into a all damage stone skin. Berserks have a hard time to survive aoe:s and death touches so its badly needed.
9.Remove the power drain on Adrenaline. Befor when the buff was damage reduction it might have been needed but now you cant use it since you put power drain on 50% of the raid encounters. Its not amazing so there is no need for the power drain anymore.
10. Lower the reuse on unyielding will. The reuse on it is just to long.
11. Stunning roar need to have the casting speed cut in half if not more.

I have alot of ideas but that is a start and would make berserks good tanks again.

Netty wrote:

Ment adrenaline aye. And i have 100% hate gain raid buff and dps still rip the mobs off like it was nothing. The hate vs other tanks is like night and day. Thats why its badly needed with a transfer. You need a perfect set up for a berserk so yes the hate siphon is needed. Singel target CA:s is a big part of our singel target dps. A zerk with a shield should be able to parse just as well as a brawler/crusader with a shield/dstance.
Hp on berserk no... It need to be on all the time... we are tanks and we have the lowest HP of all classes.

If you're the same Netty on Splitpaw, I can see why you have aggro problems... the Strength line would add 30% to your taunts which is a big boost. You also seem to neglect a few other threat generating AAs that when combined, would add a lot of aggro generation. I don't have Strength either, but I'm not in the positions of losing aggro due to the content and players I currently run with. I do have a backup spec with it however... just in case. If that's not you, then pay no attention to this reply. If it is, give some thought to a respec. You do have to build your character for the job you want!

Uh I should also add that you seem to have a few important abilities at Apprentice level and Insolence is only journeyman...

Kaberu wrote:

I dont play the toon as main anymore and yes thats the toon. I have been tanking since 2005 and know that taunts does kinda much nothing for you. If you try and parse them out you see what i mean. And what do you run on your tank? Heroics? This is fixes for raiding on berserks. Nothing els. Heroics and solo is fine. The str line is a waste once you have the CC to counter the rest. Taunts are junk and always will be. And if you took your time to check that out you would know what i was talking about. Just check act what a taunt other that Insolens does for you. Yes i havent bothered to buy the new masters on him yet as i dont play him much at all atm. The rest is mastered and the upgrades are kinda meh anyway and would do nothing for the class.

You don't think it's a little weird to complain about aggro generation while also saying taunts are worthless? Also, doesn't the taunt bonus from the Strength line also boost our taunt procs from other abilities? A boost that big to all seems to make a big difference overall. Looking at some of the raid Berserkers on my server seems to indicate that the Strength line is indeed a good choice... the few I checked out all have full points in the taunt/hate AA. That's not to say we don't need help or tweaking but you definitely seem to be in a non-optimal AA build... at least since I last checked. While raiding might be your focus, it's a bit weird to focus on berserkers when your own doesn't seem to be raid ready itself. Aside from that and as I noted, you generally seem to have good ideas!

Kaberu wrote:

As i said befor you claim that taunts does something for you parse them out and you will see that they dont. The new tiers master will do abit not much tho so thats why i havent got them yet since i have 100% of the rest master the old tier is just fine for now. If you want to i buy them and rewrite the thread since nothing will change. My zerk is not raid rdy? Well maybe not for this expack but he was back in dov. Fully mastered with a mix of HM and EM and drunder gear. I have started to bid home some new raid loot for him aswell as you can see. Dont mistake me for someone that is new on the class or on tanking over all pls. I have been raid tanking both HC and causal in the past and know if some class is weaker than the other. Just check the taunt boost up. i have parsed them all and its doesent matter when mobs hit so hard so you have to wear a shield and you have dps classes pumping out 500k-1mil dps. Then your 30% boost in taunts will do nothing even if it effects temp procs and so on. The only taunt that does something for us atm is Insolens since it proc when the mob hit you. And even that is miles behind to even compensate for the huge numbers dps classes are pumping out atm. With the right group im sitting at 100% hate gain but it doesent help much when dps is as high as they are.
I dont want to focus on grouping and soloing since that is side tracking for the problem this class has. Solo and grouping they are fine. And dont need anything. So why fix something that is not broken? I can tell you right away that mine is more raid rdy than your zerk. You dont really need the new tiers master if you have the old masters. Its only 2 lvls. Sure they help it you want to optimize your toon but its not like its life or death if you dont get them. As i said im happy to buy them all and rewrite the thread if you wish.

Admittedly, some of the problem with the DPS classes is that several of them refuse (or completely overlook) building any sort of hate reduction. I'm guessing this is why bards and chanters have become a necessary requirement to many groups and raids disproportionate to other classes. I have a feeling that if guild leaders started docking points from aggro thieves that the hate reduction stocks would shoot way up in value.

Netty wrote:

It's no wonder you have aggro problems, you need to be around 100% hate mod raid buffed + threat transfers. I have 44 hate mod self buffed which puts me around 96 raid buffed if I remember... Also use your taunts w t f...
This totally belongs on the general fighter board.

Malevolencexx@Nagafen wrote:

Ppl like you are the reason this class dont get fixed. I have 100% hate gain raid buffed + hate transfer. DWing hate is mostly NP but i as soon as a shield goes on hate turns to sh*t. If you dont see this then you need better dps. Only reason to use them is if you have a coecer with the myth buff on and nothing els is up. I will only say it one time more. Im not new to this class or to tanking at all. CHECK YOUR ACT WHAT YOUR TAUNTS DO FOR YOU BEFOR YOU SPREAD BS ABOUT HOW GOOD THEY ARE. And read the post befor replying... With out a optimal set up the berserk class is lacking alot in hate and defens.

And who said that i dident use the taunts? I never said i dident i said they are junk and increas them with 30% its still junk.

It still seems like the issue is that, at least with the raid Berserkers I've checked out on EQ2U, they seem to use the Strength line for boosted taunts. So currently it looks like the one with an issue with taunts is the one that didn't take the Strength line. Can you at least see where we are coming from? There is no doubt that we need help with sword & board aggro however. We really do seem to take a huge dip compared to other tanks. Removing the timer on Reversal would seem to do a lot... at least reduce it a bunch!

Kaberu wrote:

Again do you use act? And what raiding berserk are you talking about? Think there is like 1 on splitpawn that still raid anything worth doing with a zerk. The rest is gone. Going fully defensiv with out a perfect set up built around the berserk and its not poss. Since we dont have the tools to Main tank (harder continent) we arnt in the main tank group. Im only gona say this one more time the 30% taunt increas is nothing. Check it out. Start using act and see how much they put out for you in TPS. The only taunt that works well is Insolens. And sword and board aggro is all im talking about. Using the Dstance on a zerk has been junk since forever since we dont get any striketough on AA or anything we need to reforge for it. Doing the SS raids works.. But when it comes to HM drunder and so on your hit rate will take a huge hit. All other tanks have something to balance this out. The only reason some ppl spec the str line is to get the hate gain increas.
Brawlers can still DW so they have a alot better damage out put than a defensiv berserk. Crusaders well they do more dps aswell with sword and board and have hate tools that is awsome. Even guards have a hate transfer not to talk about better hit rates. Some of these changes do aply to guards aswell so thats why this thread is in the general fighter discussion section.

I won't comment on raid issues as my zerker is only just 90, but I have wondered recently why a similarly geared guardian, crusader or brawler often seems to have more HP than zerkers. I know HP isn't the be all and end all, but I've rarely seen a zerker with more than 60kHP yet I've seen monks and SKs with 70kHP.

Of the raid guilds I can remember off hand (not home to log in and look), and only looking at geared Berserkers (50k-ish+ in HPs) there is: Gethigh of Dark Paradox, Toemax of Disruption, Killingtime and Macownya of Tempest and I can't really remember other raid guild names that still raid or even exist (like Strike)... but they all have 10 points to boost taunts by that 30% you say is useless. Even most if not all of the undergeared Berserkers in those guilds have that STR AA line. While I'm sure some Berserkers raid without it, there must be something to it when it comes to raiding... that's all I'm saying.

Kaberu wrote:

Under geared as they need the CC. I have plenty CC for what im doing atm. I find it funny that you call me under geared yet you call ppl raiders that have alot worse gear or kinda much the same i have on mine? Im tiered of you now so i will just let this thread die out as all the other threads that has been put out about doing something for this class. You still havent awnsered my question. Have ytou checked how much taunts does for you in tps? No you havent and there for you still got no idea what you are talking about. I have been playing tank since 2005 im not new to this.

Netty wrote:

Taunts account for 20% of my threat dude; my 3 main taunts 14%. It all adds up. But clearly my guild's dps classes suck balls, and your character setup is titz. Just taking a wild stab in the dark here, but you haven't CHECKED YOUR ACT BEFORE YOU SPREAD BS ABOUT HOW BAD THEY ARE have you? Also, lol at using old teir CAs. Come on dude, really?

Not saying zerks don't need help, but keep in mind... any boosts they make to the warrior tree buffs guards also.




P.S. - dstance sword & board.

Well... I guess the proof is in the pudding... er, parse.

But I think Netty made the mistake of looking at too small a sample. If you look at any single ability, it often looks useless on it's own. Combine that with every other ability and look at the whole, then the parts start to make sense.

Malevolencexx@Nagafen wrote:

And you really think those small numbers matters if your dps is pumping out x5 the damage you do? The normal taunts suck end of story. Those numbers are nothing. And the changes to hate is for berserks <--------- Where did i say guards needed a boost in hate? They need more damage when wearing a shield and thats what they get when you aply my ideas over. You just keep making a fool out of yourself pls.