Devs: - Bug report - Class defining abilities broken recently

Discussion in 'Fighters' started by Kahling, Jun 21, 2018.

  1. Ingerimm Well-Known Member

    @Gninja, @Caith, @Kander,

    It's not about our cures sometimes working.

    You take us away from our class defining abilities, which we have been using for about 14 years and to which we have become accustomed. To have these abilities only to the waste does not bring us anything.

    Why should we still use this abilities, if only rarely does it still have a function? You can not rely on their function anymore, you just do not look at every trashmob or named which level they have and then calculate a tactic if you can use your tank cures or not.

    It also affects even more things that do not work anymore.

    In the paladin class, for example, the self destun, self destifle, self deroot, self detargetlock, self dedaze and the following 20 seconds immunization (Aura of the Crusader) does not work anymore. Just as our cure, which actually especially too works even under control effects. These things exist exactly for what they serve and not just to look good.

    Tomorrow, there will be a few new instances and I will anticipate a little here and say that our "tank classes cure skills" will not work there either.
    • "Why do we have to do a self destun …", if you can use it, but it has no effect?
    • "Why do we do a fear immune" if it does not work?
    • "Why do we use our cures" if we can use them but have no effect?
    Of course, some tank classes do not have these things, but they have other advantages as described earlier in this posting.

    What do we get as compensation, because you're taking our only class-defining benefits that we have over those classes that do not have those abilities? So our classes then have in comparison only disadvantages and no benefits and that is purely in terms of game technology absolutely no sense sorry.

    That would be the same as saying to the guardians and berserks, but your stoneskins or aggro snaps and so on, now only work in low-level content and not high-level content, so the healers can heal and ward you. And the enchanter can control your aggro and so on.
    Meneltel and Earar like this.
  2. Dude Well-Known Member

    I guess we know what's going to happen to guardians and berserkers now. :confused:
    Zeddicious and Agarth like this.
  3. Hellfiren Well-Known Member

    At Mermut nope this issuse apeard again and again, beccause of missdone Mechanics on the mobs, A FIGHTER is A FIGHTER if offens or defense dostent matter anyway, the question which is ask by the MOBS is asked is "looks for the MOST Hated and thats allways me if i play Tank.

    And Hate or Aggro is no source which depends on Deff or Offens Stance, surly you will do more DPS if offensive and more aggro will be the result but that dont explains the Oneshots.

    SO this should be undone or fixe and forever.
  4. Rebelde Active Member

    Sadest thing, in SoH SOLO you can't cure yourself with any of your two AAs, because the nameds are 118. DEPRESSING. That two AAs seems that break the game or something or they will cure 120 levels, instead all the changes they have to do to in mobs to fix that...
    Mindsway, Zeddicious and Meneltel like this.
  5. Ingerimm Well-Known Member


    Probably the same as always, a few powerful power boots ...
    "Sarcasm on"
    for these oh so weak and underpowered guards and berserkers.
    "Sarcassm off"
    but we will see it.
    Meneltel likes this.
  6. Ingerimm Well-Known Member

    Probably the same as always, a few powerful power boots boosts ...

    "sarcasm on"

    for these oh so weak and underpowered guardians and berserkers.

    "sarcassm off"

    but we will see it.
  7. Earar Well-Known Member

    well the force aggro don't work anymore in raid ,??

    or stuff like drag, already some class definign abilities that don't work .. or terrestrial coffin root that doesn't work on named (so what's the point of having a root ?? so scrpt doesn't break .. so just remove root and increase damage ...)
  8. Ingerimm Well-Known Member


    No, everything with the old, on both the guardians and berserkers. It was just a retrospective comparison of how it works in the end for classes as shadowknights and paladins.

    I think my English is too bad to go into details here and I would miss out on a translator swallowing or misinterpreting parts.

    The fact is that I do not like it the way it is implemented at the moment. It starts when you can not use your defensive specials because you are stifled or stuned, you could normally help yourself with e.g. "Aura of the Crusader" or "Zealous Smite" in the most cases of crusaders and not have to wait for an external cure. Now this possibility seems to be completely eliminated.

    This is basically important because our specials sometimes only last 1 to 4 seconds (very short durations). You can not etch these forever precast as with other classes but must use this point exactly, with the wait for an external cure, this is probably hardly reliable usable.

    But there are so many details that are to be considered here between the different classes, which I do not understand, that are easily grasped here without really considering the consequences for the affected classes.

    One way of compensating would be to convert our defensive specials all to the extent that they are applicable under all control effects.
    Because then super fast cures would be a little less important. Although it would continue to diminish group support, one would at least survive as a tank.
  9. Droll Active Member

    All of this is just a case of "creating their own problems".

    I've been here since TSO. Back then, my zerk could be T1 DPS, in AoE fights. But... that's about all I was good for. Then SF happened and "crit chance" replaced select crit chance. Now the zerk could be T1 dps, and out heal healers, on certain encounters. A good time to be a zerk. The next few xpacs were just an all around good time.

    Then ToV added +HP% to gear in huge amounts. I instantly saw that was going to be a problem, as all our heals are HP% based. No healer could keep up, on any fight, with my HPS. It was fun to /flex at them and show off... but it was so wrong. "You are now just a cure bot, hit the cure button button monkey!" Oh wait never mind... ToV gave me a self cure too... hahah you are worthless Healers! Well, at least you can heal the other group members... at least there is that.

    So, with a problem they created, they needed to 'nerf' our heals. Put our heals on a "can only cast x times per second" type of timer, which then defeated the entire idea of the class. Zerks were about tanking unlimited numbers of weak mobs. Now we cant do that. Now zerks have no role. We dont DPS, we dont heal, we dont do anything... why would anyone want a zerk?

    "Guess we better add a fighter script to make sure people take a tank into a group."
    So now groups spend an hour or more looking to fill groups with a class nobody wants to play because they dont do anything. Dont cure, dont heal, dont dps, dont even tank well, as my warlock is a better tank than anything else I got, and I have all the fighters. So what do you do to fix that issue? Not fix fighters, but nerf one of the wards.

    /facepalm.
  10. Ingerimm Well-Known Member

    The other problem that arises except the loss of class identity is just like this:

    Brackish Vaults: Realm of the Triumvirate [Raid]
    • Eurold's Freezing Rain spell should now be cast at level 117, allowing non-priest cures to affect it.
    Because the problem is, which is not described on the mob and the effect itself, whether you can cure now or not.

    Of course you can expensive test it, but you would have to remember that for every single effect and for every single mob / encounter.

    I am 100% sure that this only leads to the fact, that no one uses his cure, except the healers.

    Furthermore, the paladin cure "cure spells", for example, is also an AoE taunt when effects are cured, and this function is also taken from the paladin. Because the taunt is triggered only when effects are cured.

    It is really not a good idea to make effects of non-healing classes only sporadically curable.

    If abilities do not work reliably, nobody uses them anymore, which I think is completely understandable.

    In addition, most of the effects of non-healers are cureable, which can trigger fail conditions. See for example the noxious effect, at the endmobs in SoH [Heroic] and [Herd Mode]. The meaning behind it unfortunately does not open to me.

    Besides, there does not seem to be any plan for compensating for the loss of our abilities.

    As mentioned more often in this posting, crusaders now have only disadvantages compared to the other tank classes in comparison.

    There are quite a few mobs where it is very hard to tank this for flawless with the paladin, as the damage dealt by far exceeds the tank's HP, where only stone skins and 100% damage blocks help. It should be the same on the shadowknight.

    Without aggro snaps, this will be even harder and the crusader will not have any.

    A good example of this is: "Master P'tasa" in the SoH [Raid], which kills me regularly as a paladin with excessive damage, no matter whether my damage reductions are active or not, here only help stone skins.

    And against aggro wipe every few seconds you can do nothing without aggro snaps.

    Pressing intercept once every fifteen seconds, to protect the none tanks at the memwipe, does not help either, and it kills you if you're unlucky, as the damage is much too high without stone skins, which the mob hands out.
    Earar likes this.
  11. Earar Well-Known Member

    well, don't make things more complicated than they are.

    people will see mob lvl 118 - cure lvl 117 --> doesn't work.

    We can't have some lvl 118 mobs were cure works and some mobs where cure doesn't. We need consistancy, not having a list and check every fight .. "Oh yes this mob I can cure - Oh no this mob I cannot ..."
  12. Kahling Member

    Hi Gninja,

    I created this thread because two of the Paladin's cures only cure 117 levels, which means it cures nothing in expert zones and the mobs you have mentioned thus far. It doesn't need fixing at a mob level really just at the spell level, when you have pot cures that cure 124 levels on a 7.5 second timer its a shame when class defining abilities no longer work from an update with expert content.

    Paladin cure - Cure Spells - Cures all bar trauma 117 levels - Needs to be higher and my feeling is should be 124 levels same as a pot.
    Shared Paladin and SK group cure on a long timer - Zealous Smite cures 117 levels. Same needs to be 124.


    Thanks
  13. Hellfiren Well-Known Member

    Dear Deffs

    I am Playing 3 Kinds or Tanks so far so good,

    But now i get more angry about the issuses that Warriors are constantly one shoted in Expert Instances if Boss askes for Tank.
    The Questen in Screen is " Looks for the most hated " thats me always aggro on 100%.
    I got on shoted after saw the message in chat dosent matter Deff or Off stance on, how could that happen if i am well Geared and Raid T2 Ready on Both Warriors Guardian and Berserker and no, Healer wasnt asleep !!!
    It happens always and its not fun anymore to play with those mirrccle issuses coming out of nowere.

    On my Shaddowkight whos in Offstance always i dont have this isusse only on the Warriors and all own the Requierments to go Raid Tier 2 HP / Miti / Block / Resis / Avoidance all fine but got oneshot everytime ????

    Please fix that fast and for ever we had those mistakes in the past and its not funny anymore.
  14. Ingerimm Well-Known Member

    This can not be like you say. Except for Chrol something would have changed on the "tank buster" again.

    The tank buster in the expert zones comes every 40 seconds and is announced with 2 emote texts. Once 5 seconds before and once at the initial hit.

    These are percent based MaxHP damage. There are 4 hits over 4 seconds, 1 initial hit and 3 hits when phasing out. Ergo 2 stone skins for berserkers and guardians, to block the damage on itself. No other tank classes than guardians and berserkes can do that at all 40 seconds.

    Other tank classes can do little about it, because the damage is not reducible and not mitigatable. Thus, damage reductions does not work, just a 100% damage blocks and stone skins.

    Fact is that the damage is the same for each class depending on the MaxHP. And the most effective remedy is stone skins. It is thought that the healers should heal against it. Guk zones are normally not designed for 1 healer groups. Maybe you should start here.

    If the damage hits are hundreds of millions (xxx.xxx.xxx) of HP or more, there would be a resolved bug back agian and Chrol would have to look again. If that is not the case, you need to adjust your style of play, guardians and berserkers are the classes that have the easiest in Guk.
  15. Ingerimm Well-Known Member

    As far as this is concerned, the boss encounter in guk expert and frenzied have, so far as I recall, a requirement of 695 resolve. I'm not sure if anything has changed here since the release.

    So Raid T3, maybe your problem is here.
    Dude likes this.