Bruiser Class Specific Achievements

Discussion in 'Bruiser' started by ARCHIVED-Raidi Sovin'faile, Nov 3, 2006.

  1. ARCHIVED-Raidi Sovin'faile Guest

    Here's a rundown of the new Bruiser AA's coming in EoF.

    How the new AA's work

    Your AA points are all in one big pool (up to 100). You can spend them in either AA tree, but only up to 50 each. Nothing has really changed on the Brawler AAs.

    The Bruiser AA's are mostly capped at 5 ranks each. End abilities are also capped at 5 ranks, or require 5 points spent to get the ability. The requirements are a bit more lax compared to the Brawler ones, as you can criss cross from one "line" to another to qualify for abilities. End abilities just have a "requires X points in" the line it's based on to qualify.

    So basically, the only real strict rule for "line" requirements is to get the end ability. If you don't need it, you can go all over the place.

    Bruiser Tree


    Ability Specifics
    The following are the specifics on each ability in the above tree. Color coded for each section, most abilities are pretty obvious which are which (go by the icons). If confuse at all, I start from the top down, and go left to right, and stay within each line. I've listed the requirements for each ability as well, basically it's 3 points in any ability that has a line coming down to it.

    I've added screenshots of the abilities that aren't just modifications of ones we already have.

    Also, it appears that the "Enhance" names change along with the latest version of the line you have. So at 70, Enhance Impose will actually be Enhance Oppress. Nice since it'll lower confusiong as to what ability it's enhancing. The names below are based on a level 1 character viewing them.

    Information listed in red are recent changes.
    Latest update: 11-27 (sorry, been a while before I noticed these changes)


    Enhance: Ignore Agony
    Each rank increase heal amount by 2%. (Max 10%)
    Requirements: None
    Enhance: Tenacious Will
    Improves reuse by 6 seconds per rank. (Max 30 seconds)
    Requirements: 3 points in Enhance: Ignore Agony

    Enhance: Vigorous Spirit
    Increases duration by 10 seconds per rank. (Max 50 seconds)
    Requirements: 3 points in either Enhance: Ignore Agony, or Enhance: Intervene

    Enhance: Hardened Skin
    Increases the mitigation by 5% per rank. (Max 25%)
    Requirements: 3 points in Enhance: Tenacious Will

    Enhance: Stone Deaf
    Improves reuse by 3 seconds per rank. (Max 15 seconds)
    Requirements: 3 points in either Enhance: Vigorous Spirit, or Enhance: Intercept

    Enhance: Close Mind
    Improves reuse by 5 seconds per rank. (Max 25 seconds)
    Requirements: 3 points in either Enhance: Hardened Skin, or Enhance: Stone Deaf
    Retribution of Stone
    Requirements: 20 points spent in any of the Conditioning abilities. Costs 1 point.


    Enhance: Intervene
    Improve reuse by 5 seconds per rank. (Max 15 seconds)
    Max 3 ranks.
    Requirements: None

    Enhance: Intercept
    Improve reuse by 5 seconds per rank. (Max 15 seconds)
    Max 3 ranks.
    Requirements: 2 points in Enhance: Intervene
    Enhance: Intercede
    Improve reuse by 5 seconds per rank. (Max 15 seconds)
    Max 3 ranks.
    Requirements: 2 points in Enhance: Intercept
    Soak Hit[IMG]
    Requirements: 9 points in Sacrifice abilities. Costs 1 point.
    Enhance: Impose
    Improves reuse by 1 second per rank. (Max 5 seconds)
    Requirements: None
    Enhance: Taunt
    Improves reuse by 0.7 seconds per rank. (Max 3.5 seconds)
    Requirements: 3 points in either Enhance: Intervene, or Enhance: Impose
    Enhance: Feign Death
    Improves reuse by 0.5 seconds per rank. (Max 2.5 seconds)
    Requirements: 3 points in Enhance: Taunt, or Enhance: Shoulder Charge
    Alternate: Shiftiness
    Each point increases de-threat amount. (Max 490).
    Requirements: 3 points in either Enhance: Intercept, or Enhance: Feign Death
    Enhance: Rescue
    Increases threat position by 1 per rank. (Max 3 positions)
    This ability costs 2 points per rank (6 total to max).
    Requirements: 3 points in either Alternate: Shiftiness, or Enhance: Haymaker
    Requirements: 20 points spent in any of the Attention abilities. Costs 1 point.

    Enhance: Stamp
    Improves damage by 5% per rank. (Max 25%)
    Requirements: None
    Enhance: Shoulder Charge
    Improves damage by 5% per rank. (Max 25%)
    Requirements: 3 points in either Enhance: Impose, or Enhance: Stamp

    Enhance: Intimidate
    Improves duration by 1 second per rank. (Max 5 seconds)
    Requirements: 3 points in Enhance: Stamp

    Enhance: Haymaker
    Improves damage by 5% per rank. (Max 25%)
    Requirements: 3 points in either Enhance: Feign Death, or Enhance: Shoulder Charge

    Enhance: Sucker Punch
    Improves damage by 5% per rank. (Max 25%)
    Requirements: 3 points in Enhance: Intimidate

    Enhance: Knockout Combination
    Improves damage by 5% per rank. (Max 25%)
    Requirements: 3 poitns in either Enhance: Haymaker, or Enhance: Sucker Punch

    Requirements: 20 points spent in any of the Knockouts abilities. Costs 1 point.

    There's some neat options, nothing too spectacular. I was at first taken aback by the detaunts, but honestly... every other tank got at best 2-3 abilities that could help directly with aggro, so we aren't being dumped on here compared to the rest. And now it'll be nice to have the DPS option available... I guess. Seems kinda like they gave up on us being real tanks.

    Anyways, here's a few build ideas I've been thinking on:
    Going by latest Info (11/27).

    DPS Build Knockouts: Stamp (5), Shoulder Charge (5), Intimidate (3), Haymaker (5), Sucker Punch (5), Knockout Combination (5), Drag (1)Attention: Impose (5), Taunt (5), Feign Death (5), Shiftiness (5), Evade (1) Unfortunately you must put points into the two Taunts to get the final evade ability. This will help with normal group play if you need to double as offtank or even full tank, while still maintaining full DPS build for raids. Brawler AA's: Either Str/Sta/Int 4, 4, 8, or Sta/Wis/Int 4, 4, 8.

    Tank Build Conditioning: Ignore Agony (5), Tenacious Will (3), Vigorous Spirit (5), Hardened Skin (5), Stone Deaf (4), Retribution of Stone (1)Attention: Impose (5), Taunt (5), Rescue (6)Knockouts: Shoulder Charge (3), Haymaker (3), Knockout Combination (5) This would give you the biggest increase to the mitigation abilities, as well as the "stoneskin on riposte". The three taunt increases are obvious enough, and the extra damage would help with aggro too, especially KC. Brawler AA's: In this case, having a higher riposte helps proc that stoneskin. So Strength 4, 4, 8, 8 and Intelligence 4, 4, 4, 5, 8 would emphasize the parrying and riposte bonuses, as well as Intelligence's mitigation boost.Oh... and it's been stated that 20% of parries are ripostes... so increasing parry is key here too.

    Offtanking Build Sacrifice: Intervene (3), Intercept (3), Intercede (3), Soak Hit (1)Attention: Taunt (4), Shiftiness (5), Rescue (6), Feign Death (5), Evade (1)Knockouts: Stamp (3), Shoulder Charge (3), Haymaker (3), Knockout Combination (5)Conditioning: Ignore Agony (5) This would give you Soak Hit's bonus, and the detaunts (cuz you aren't normally tanking). Rescue for when playing the tank or part of a memwipe situation, Feign Death and Taunt just to get Evade really, although they may help in keeping you versatile. Ignore Agony so you heal a bit better when you take that hit. Damage abilities because that's what you'll be doing mostly, when not taking the hit.Timers just aren't as important if you are only offtank, so Vigorous Spirit increases aren't exactly necessary, and the reuse benefit on Stone Deaf/Close Mind won't help enough. Brawler AA's: Really, not a bit deal what AA's are chosen here, as you aren't really being the tank. Since you'll have detaunts, a full DPS build would be fine.

    VersatileConditioning: Ignore Agony (4)Sacrifice: Intervene (3), Intercept (3), Intercede (3), Soak Hit (1)Attention: Impose (5), Taunt (5), Shiftiness (5)Knockouts: Stamp (3), Shoulder Charge (3), Intimidate (3), Haymaker (3), Sucker Punch (3), Knockout Combination (5), Drag (1)This build will give you a nice mix of all aspects, so you'll get a benefit no matter what role you are trying to fill. Taunts will greatly help group tanking, along with the increased self heal. The entire offtanking line is available (which, if used right, can help tanking). Then you have DPS and Shiftiness for when you want to full out DPS (raid viable).Brawler AA's: Most any will fit in this instance. Probably best to have a mix of DPS and tanking, so going down the Int line for crits/parry, and then either Wisdom or Strength (depending on if you use weapons or not) to get the bonus damage and either ripostes or health.

    That's all. There you go folks.

    - Updated the requirements for the Sacrifice line. Each one requires 3 points in the previous one. It is by far, the most restrictive line... basically if you want any of the abilities down that line you have to go for the whole dang thing. It doesn't allow cross catching like the others do.
    - Added that names change based on your level.
    - Updated Evade info, was going by old info.
    - 11/04, Updated info in red. Basically a general increase in values for damage increase, reduction in reuse, and some durations increases. Also, mitigation and heal %s are increased. I guess they are basically ramping it up to be more worthwhile.
    - 11/10, Updated info in red. Change in point requirements for final abilities. Now require 20 points in the line, but only costs 1 for max benefit. This means you spend 1 extra point than before, but 4 of them are in the actual line.
    Also, Sacrifice line requirements were reduced DRASTICALLY, basically going from 20 points cost for the whole line, to 10 point cost. This line can now be tacked on to most builds that aren't completely focused in two lines. Now if only they would make the first two abilities something worthewhile... at least it's only a loss of 6 points.
    - 11/12, Very minor update. They tweaked the Sacrifice line again, now it requires spending points in the whole line (can't proceed from cross lines), but only requires 2 points in the previous ability. So you only need to spend 4 points to get the 3rd ability, and putting 5 points into it will get you the final.
    They seem to be trying to be as nice as possible with that line without giving us actual 3 seperate increases to all three abilities. Honestly, I can't see it being overpowered if it were that way, and I can definately see people NOT going down that line ever, even WITH changing it. Oh well...
    - 11/12, Another minor update done midday. Tweaked Sacrifice line once more, max 3 ranks in each ability. So big fat 15s reduction in reuse. Soooo you will have to max out the entire line, although it still only costs 10 points in total.
    Also, the AA tree now has a better look, indicating more clearly which abilities open which.
    Oh, and it now says 20% chance to proc for Retribution of Stone. I dunno...
    - 11/27, Late update, sorry. Not sure when this was changed, maybe during the flurry of updates after the expansion came out? Anyways, the reduction on reuse for Taunt was increased to 0.7s per rank... so in the end you can have a Taunt every 4.5s.
    Also, Evade and Drag were changed slightly. Evade had it's range of dethreat made smaller... lower max, but higher minimum. Drag was simplified greatly.. basically it supposedly lets you pull the mob with you, and forces it to target you for 5s. At a recast of 1m30s it's not the be-all, but it'll be nice for offtanking that's for sure.

    Message Edited by Raidi Sovin'faile on 11-27-2006 09:26 PM
  2. ARCHIVED-ganjookie Guest

    very nice work!

    I sent in a sticky request
  3. ARCHIVED-podium829 Guest

    omg, they're giving us deaagros??? lol
  4. ARCHIVED-Gungo Guest

    5 ignore agony (45%), 5 vigourous spirit (3min50sec dur), 5 stone deaf (1min45sec recst), 5 retribution of stone (stoneskin proc)
    5 stomp, 5 shoulder charge, 5 haymaker, 5 knockout combination, 5 knockout (0.5 sec to every stun)
    5 impose (group aoe taunt)
    This allows me to be a good mix focusing on bruiser weaknesses (aoe taunt) and i dont waste any points on stuff i rarely if ever use. I dont have a problem w detaunt if i need to loose agro i either turn off rumble or fake death.
  5. ARCHIVED-Devaster Guest

    The last suggestion is probably what I am going with since I still remain str AA line. I don't really want the decreased or increased timers because to me they won't make enough of a difference to care. The heal, dps line, and taunt are what are important to me.

    I have a question about the riposte. Do bruisers also naturally riposte or do we need the AA or some sort of proc to riposte? Once I get two 59+ rating fabled dw's i plan on going sta/wis/int. Would that rule out the new stoneskin AA entirely?
  6. ARCHIVED-eyes007 Guest

    I second the sticky man well done!
    This is great because I don't have to articulate this to my guild with my deep heavy brooklyn accent :)
    For those that weren't in beta, be aware we have had changes to our tanking stats that might seem a bit disheartening, a loss in mit and avoidance but it doesn't seem to have changed much (haven't had a chance to raid tank - still old habits die hard hehe) and the mobs I've tanked solo are consistant to to how I tanked them before (albeit slightly harder). this will be in due of the brusier AA abilities, they've "dropped our stats" (my opinion) so that the AA abilities don't push us over godly status (every class), so it isn't a nerf as such, but it's still painful to see.
    We still hold our own I think, I'm not displeased, the lack of closed instance raiding zones however....
  7. ARCHIVED-Nocifer Deathblade Guest

    I don't understand this? I see non-T7 CAs like Haymaker, shoulder charge, etc etc for EOF AA. I am using T7 CA's. Will those T7 CA's be enhanced by EOF AA line as well? Are The names Haymaker, shoulder charge, etc are just beginning of the CA lines and upgrable no matter what level you are even beyond 70 so EOF AA can work forever?
  8. ARCHIVED-Sanamien Guest

    The real description on them says that they upgrade these spells and their replacements iirc. So, yes it works on all arts from a line...
  9. ARCHIVED-Nocifer Deathblade Guest

    Good to hear that! So EOF AA will always be useful no matter what level you are even years ahead of this EOF.. Good move.. I would scream if EOF AA is tied to certain specific CAs that I'm seeing that would only get obsolete when level cap increases..
  10. ARCHIVED-Nocifer Deathblade Guest

    I saw that KO lines used to have 10% to damage increase but now it's 25%. Is that true now? If true then it is awesome.. Plus is Mezz duration increaser AA got removed? I was excited about that cuz I use Mezz all the time when I solo and was able to handle lvl 67-68 heroics in SoS just fine with mezz ability.. Making mezz longer will make things easier for me to solo..
    Nm, saw Intimidate as original for mezz which will add up to 5 seconds which is cool that will bring mezz 50% longer over 10 secs increased to 15 seconds..
    Message Edited by Nocifer Deathblade on 11-06-2006 11:05 AM
  11. ARCHIVED-TheSummoned Guest

    Been thinking about my AA setup and came up with:

    Ignore Agony 5, Tenacious Will 5, Hardened Skin 5, Close Mind 5, Retribution of Stone (5)

    Impose 5, Taunt 5

    Stamp 5, Shoulder Charge 5, Haymaker 5

    Starter: 1
    Str line:

    or Int line:

    Well, the Str line gives you a straight chance are reposting your opponent and with the increased parry from the intelligence line together with the end ability would proc the stoneskin quite often giving me a good defensive setup. If things go haywire for some reason or another, I can pop on the improved hardened skin and can still taunt with the single taunt which now has a reduced recast.
    If I'm called to DPS, then I can do that too. I'm sure with adorments, there has to be some that make unarmed fighting more potent.

    I lose quite a bit of stats, hit points and power using this setup.

    In the end I'll have to see how this thing pans out.
    Message Edited by TheSummoned on 11-06-2006 06:15 PM
  12. ARCHIVED-Devaster Guest

    i can see the bonus to decreasing the timer on the encounter taunt but not the 8second single target taunt. i think the increased duration of mez would prove more useful than the reduced reuse of the single target taunt.
    Message Edited by Devaster on 11-06-2006 09:37 AM
  13. ARCHIVED-Pimpsxx Guest

    I think some of the aas are ok so far but i think there will be more tweaking on others before realease......
  14. ARCHIVED-Gungo Guest

    The first tweak already happened. All the damage arts are now 5% per rank, mezz is 1 sec per rank heal is 2% per rank. hardened skin is 5% per rank, group taunt is 3secs per rank, single taunt is 0.5 secs per rank.
    Btw i tried a similar set up to yours except instea dof Will and hardened skin the spirit and stone deaf. I even reset my AA's in kos for the same set up. BUT the stone skin was not procing as much enough to encourage me to loose the defenses i would get from the hand of destruction/marrs fist/wurmslayer combo as well as the extra damage from combat arts and the stamina line i alreayd have. It didnt proc as much as i had expected. Although that may be to a problem i see with proc buffs on beta.
    BTw there was a short period on beta barehanded fighting was quad attacking. Doing insane dps it was very nice.
  15. ARCHIVED-Raidi Sovin'faile Guest

    I think the problem is that even though it says "proc 1.8 times per minute", it's basing off ripostes.. which aren't happening that frequently. So the percentage chance might be "adequate" for a 5-9% chance... but when ripostes are like 20% of all parries? How often are we parrying, let alone riposting?
    Hell... even if it was "procs on ALL ripostes" it's just not going to happen often enough to replace a Dirge's buff. It's infrequent enough to warrant dropping it in favor of other bonuses.. and to only grab if you have points in Conditioning anyways, and have a spare 5 points to spend.
  16. ARCHIVED-MrMartin Guest

    LOL, they are turning Bruisers in to scouts!? :D
  17. ARCHIVED-PhozFate Guest

    I've played with ability in beta and its far from great. Even dragorn in full fabled respec'd STR for extra repost rate also agreed it took a few minutes to get it to proc I was really hoping they made this ability a little better. As a tanking bruiser I'd have no problem spending more points on this ability if they increased its usefulness.
  18. ARCHIVED-wesblueeyes Guest

    I dont think they did a bad job at all really, the new AA lines are so diversified that you can pretty much spec in so many ways that you find what works best for you. I know I am going for the increased dmg on knockouts, increased healing and taunts just all sounds nice. Of course I also noticed a lot of raid gear got the nerf in EoF when I was messing around with beta. It also seems that the avoidance is going to be even harder to get up now.
  19. ARCHIVED-fy2006 Guest

    group taunt AA is -3sec per rank now?
    That's huge, 20-3*5 = 5 sec recast time ???

    As for those +5% damage CA, I am not too optimistic about it.
    • The spell variables for Adept III, Master I, and Master II spells and combat arts have been lowered to conform to the new combat mechanics, mob difficulty, and philosophy of diminishing returns.
    So probably we will have to spend AA to get back what we currently have.

    Message Edited by fy2006 on 11-07-2006 07:20 AM
  20. ARCHIVED-BigRed1 Guest

    Can you have Rumble and Shiftiness up at the same time?
    I generally run with rumble up all the time except on a few raid mobs. I pull agro here and there but nothing over the top. My thinking here is that I would hate to go to a DPS mode and loose the dmg proc off of Rumble. Not sure what % of our dps this dmg proc makes up 1-3% maybe<just guessing>, however if I am going to spend points to be dps I want every last % of dmg I can get. We most likely will need it to stackup to scouts as viable raid dps.

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