Bleed through...from the post in the beta forums, some clarification please

Discussion in 'Priests' started by Loke, Oct 16, 2018.

  1. Kioske Well-Known Member

    Matter of fact, with the zone wide det in heroics, all heals are kind of a joke. Instead of creating all these new mechanics that change the way heals work, why not just change the tool tip numbers on heals to reflect what is actually going to be used as a heal?

    For instance: Ward says "Will ward for 1.2 million" instead of changing a mechanic and adding bleedthrough and all those things, just make Ward "Will ward for 300k" and stop over complicating things?
    Heal says "Will heal for 800k" Instead of adding a zone det that lowers the amount of heals recieved, just make Heal say "will heal for 200k".

    Seems simpler and easier to control, also much easier for players to understand what it is their character is actually doing in the game. Just my two cents.
    Lateana likes this.
  2. Torquem Active Member

    In the state of healing mechanics now, I see few options for shammies:

    1-gear up and adapt: rather difficult when more and more groups on Thurgadin ask for "2 heals, please no shaman" or "2 heals, pref not shaman".

    2-reroll. I would consider it if I had made enough ethereal coins to buy eth run for a alt. (don't tell me to join another server and back, that would mean giving money to DBG because they ruined my main gameplay)

    3-quit.
    Songwind, Lateana and Kioske like this.
  3. Lateana Older than Dirt, Playing EQII since 2004

    I a seriously thinking of going back to solo play and skipping the whole heroics/raid thing now :(
    Songwind likes this.
  4. Quigly Active Member

    Been able to solo heal all the t1 heroics thus far, but it is not easy, and deaths are not uncommon. I will at times be outhealed by a beastlord now :(

    As a defiler, I bring next to no utility to the group. It's a pretty sorry state to be in. bleedthrough is tuned too high.
  5. Chellema New Member

    I finally gave in and paid to upgrade Carrion Warding to Ancient and that made a huge difference from the Master level it was sitting at. I hate healing now I have to say. The game is pure stress. I too am considering not raiding this expac and just returning to having fun building houses and crafting. I am so sad I spent all that time and energy maxing out all my ascensions when I barely get to cast one at all. Very discouraged right now.
  6. Golum Active Member

    Lets start flipping tables. What they have done with this bleedthru is horrible. What a pathetic implementation. Roll this crap back...
  7. Mermut Well-Known Member

    Unfortunately no amount of reasoned positions or detailed numbers were sufficient to convince the devs to change their decision about making healing a blackbox this expansion. None of the reasons for the decisions have been shared with us.

    The phrase that comes to mind is 'they're giving out information on a need to know basis' and they don't seem to feel healers have a 'need to know' anything about how healing mechanics work this expac.
    Songwind, Meneltel and Sigrdrifa like this.
  8. Bonki New Member

    Mystic here and very dissatisfied with the changes.
    I have chosen this class years ago cause I like the playstyle of shamans and I like WARDING my group. I remember back in the days we said if you have to heal as shaman you are a bad shaman.
    Now I feel like a crippled druid, I still have slow casts and recast on my wards/heals, but I HAVE TO CAST fast or my group dies.
    On incoming like every other shaman I'm casting my group ward, but on the first hit my whole groups HP is going to yellow and when I look at my remaining HP on the ward nothing got warded..
    Ye, it's OK solo healing groups and I'm also fine with getting outhealed by druids but pls I just want my wards to ward at least.
    My highest HPS only coming ftom Totemic Protection which used to be an emergency spell...
    If you leave the mechanic like that give us more options, atm I only have to cast 3 spells: groupware, group heal, Totemic.
  9. Sigrdrifa EQ2 Wiki Author

    I'm about to suggest all shaman get mushroom hats and turn off our personal torches.
  10. Clintsat Well-Known Member

    Mystics heal fine this expac. You now have to use all of your heal tools to keep your group alive, welcome to what all the other priest types have had to do for the past three years. It is going to make you a better player. You will be needed in T2 heroics and actually play well with other priests now.

    While I was skeptical in beta, i actually like the heal changes and the challenge has been engaging. I agree we should know more about the heal debuffs and the guk strong debuff is a pain but overall, it is better for the majority of priests.
    Revanu likes this.
  11. quisling Well-Known Member

    Hmm. Jury is still out for me. As a templar, I feel like im back in in KOS healing. Not saying thats bad, but its kind of a different kind of mindset.
  12. knine Well-Known Member

    Sure we have group heal, channeling, heal pet (lol), single heals, and 5 different types of wards now wasted...soul shackle, then pointless to cast other wards as they don't stack.. can it be done yet.. but there is little to no time to dps for now.. and don't bother asking me to try and chain ascensions for the combos lol.. welcome to other priests types?? you mean that thing that's been in their description since the start of the game lol...so to fix 5 other healers you make 2 doable but still near useless, refer to my first sentence before you start smashing the statement.. yes I have solo healed zones, but with doing little to nothing else lol :) its back to where they wanted the game in the first place, 2 healers per group...
    Songwind, Bonki and Mermut like this.
  13. Clintsat Well-Known Member

    They fixed five other healer types by taking the two that were faceroll easy for years and made them a tiny bit tougher...

    I play a fury...I have three single target direct heals, those have been useless for ages, just the way the game works. Ideally, heal balance could be achieved by slowing the pace of damage down but they dont seem to want to go in that direction. This is better than the past few expacs, I'll take it.
    Febrith likes this.
  14. Mermut Well-Known Member

    I've played a warden since I started, just before Shadow Odyssey and just added a defiler turned mystic last expac. Both healers play very differently than last expac and I've never had to spam heal the way I am on the warden in 'easy' heroic zones on the warden.
    Hard? Sometimes. Doable? Most time. Fun? Rarely.
  15. Dead Alt Account Well-Known Member

    Just be grateful you don't play an Inquisitor. That class is still total garbage.
  16. knine Well-Known Member

    and you have best healer rune in the game for years.. turn on your dps and leave it.. raid wide cures..groups cures.. lol each class had their own.. problem is.. when dps was boosted.. everyone wanted to only take solo heals to maximize dps, burn through scripts and so they took the healer with the mechanic that worked first..i would've rather them make a reverse dps check.. ie don't dps too much or you blow up, then you have to follow scripts.. now people will still try to roll dps and look for solo heals.. and man all those heals that are able to stack hots and reactives.. wait for it.. will get those invites.. shaman will still get theirs and the good ones will always have a group.. but those mediocre ones will not and will get the boot lol.. its the flavor of the expac and a HORRIBLE banaid placed on the game by the DEVS.. yes they have their hands full.. but yes they've created the monsters from everything they placed in game.
    Bonki likes this.
  17. Golum Active Member

    ...and a second time...

    Lets start flipping tables. What they have done with this bleedthru is horrible. What a pathetic implementation. Roll this crap back...

    A healing reduction of > 2/3...come on...
    Meneltel and Sigrdrifa like this.
  18. Quigly Active Member

    The biggest issue with defilers now is that they are no longer great healers and their only "utility" with the nerf to maelstrom power regen is the prestige that gives the group a small damage proc and wards bane :(
  19. Clintsat Well-Known Member

    Defilers are still great healers.
  20. Quigly Active Member

    That is just flat out false. While I agree that healing mechanics needed to be adjusted to bring balance, the current solution is not balanced. The pendulum has shifted drastically from shaman > all to druid > all.

    Maybe if you see the list of abilities that are now redundant and thus useless it'll start to make sense.
    - The entire left side of defiler prestige line is completely useless as it centers around a ward
    - TSO endline Spirit Aegis useless
    - Phantasmal barrier prestige ability useless
    - Deathward useless
    - Spiritual Circle useless
    - AA Spiritual Leadership useless
    - AA Aura of Warding useless
    - Ancient Shroud now only useful for the heal attached to it
    - Bane of Warding useless
    - Both emergency heals are wards and thus useless
    - Ward attached to group buff useless

    So that leaves me 6 staples which are left all of which are inferior now to direct healing/heal over time.
    - Soul shackle, the set it and forget it regenerating ward
    - Carrion warding which is really just a group heal now and a buffer when soul shackle is down
    - Wild accretion our group heal
    - Nightmares group HoT which can't quite be maintained full time and doesn't tick as often as i'd like
    - Maelstrom group HoT which also has long downtime
    - Totemic Protection

    So I have just enough abilities to get the group by so far in t1 (jury is out on t2) However, I bring no utility to the group.

    Nerfing heal potency and raising HP pools was a great start. Bleedthrough isn't necessarily even terrible if it weren't so heavy handed. Nothing should 100% bleedthrough a ward. There shouldn't be a mechanic that just completely ignores one classes primary means of functionality as is the case with the "Guk Strong" type buffs that are now commonplace.

    So that is my gripe.

    Here is what I'd like to see:

    Anything with 100% bleedthrough should be removed or significantly lowered.
    Add bleedthrough reduction to class debuffs or to healer "healing stance"
    Continue to adjust the value of heals/wards relative to HP pool so we can actually use the abilities we have access to.
    Songwind and Pengana like this.