I don't want to be nerfed, Im sick of every mmorg game the nerf bat always has to swing. Gaurds upgrade all your taunts to adpets, as you get higher, you will get more hate generating items. I do not want bloodlust nerfed in anyway except a lowering of aggro that it generates. It is my primary way of dealing damage at lvl 23 Now, when i zerk in any form or fassion i end up taking a lot of damage and my base ac is around 1100 without shield white cons take me to half health, i simply just can not take very much damage. If i am MT which i generally don't want to do, but do end up doing sometimes I eat up a healers manna, thus slowing down the group, therefore I typically have to go shield sword and full defensive, as an assistant I want to go full offensive, but i usually pull the aggro from the MT I feel lthis is the ONLY thing that needs adjusted, is our hate generation on bloodlust. Now here is somthing else, beserkers and gaurds are Tanks, we both stem from the same line, we are offensive, but take more damage, you do less damge but take more hits...its plain and simple. I also have troulbe pulling a mob off a healer, the same way you do, it often takes 4 taunts to get it, and sometimes it doesn't. So, I simply have to switch my target and kill the one i couldn't get back before it kills my healer or caster then return to the other mobs i still have aggro on. we all have problems but you have to learn how to play your class. Drop me down to medium armor is crazy, we stem from the same branch in the warrior line. Again learn how to play your class, gaurds don't need to be spamming mangle and wound and all that other stuff, your job is to use reg hits, maybe a kick now and then, start the HO chians, and every other move should be a taunt, or a group buff, this keeps hate. LEARN HOW TO PLAY YOUR CLASS AND LEAVE US ALONE! the ideal imo for a group is gaurd at mt and zerker as assistant, cause sometimes i'll save your butt, by pulling some aggro off you, In that role im here to 'assist' you, and also help keep you alive, and assist the scouts with some medium damgage i can output. I also know when to turn on bloodlust, which is about half way through the fight, even if i pull em with bloodlust, it keeps your health from getting to low and i can start putting the mob down faster. teamwork, upgrade to adepts, and no one is uber, ...the fight is not just click and go...you have to think, plan, have tactics, and clerics need to watch both of us..we are both hate generating tanks PERIOD. So please, leave us alone, only gripe about bloodlusts usual ability to pull to much hate.
Yeah you just got 23 and lust and you are telling all the guardian's to learn how to play. You are ignoring the incredible rediculous aggro generated by bloodlust and obviously haven't encountered the issue. Thanks for trying. At level 29 this problem is very pronounced. I don't think a nerf is needed AT ALL. Nerfs are bad. Guardians just need a way to be able to group with you. NO I CANT FRIGGIN TAKE AGGRO OFF YOU WHEN YOU ARE BLOODLUSTED. Its not an issue of gear, skills, or play style. I have all Adept/App3. I have all high con gear. I have played MT a long time and know how to make best use of my abilities. The SECOND you guys hit Bloodlust you are screwing all my work up. You are going to aggro the mob no matter how much I spam my taunts. I can keep aggro on an even level dps - scout/wizard with maybe a taunt every so often. Spamming them endlessly til I'm OOP doesn't do anything with a zerker even 4 or 5 levels below me. Bloodlust is horribly broke or my taunt ability is. But whatever, as a level 23 zerker you know a lot... sigh
----------------------- And the fix for the uber aggro generated by bloodlust. heh. But I think that's agreed upon that it's not a nerf but a fix on both sides of this? ----------------------- I think this is really the crux of the problem. Its not that Bers need to be nerfed rather that Guardians agro capability needs to be raised to offset. IMHO the Guadian/defensive to Bers/Offensive is out of balance. A Guardian *should* if going full out be able top match agro with a Bers going full out. Currently its not even close. This doesnt seem particularly fair as SoE stated that all tanks will be able to tank equally well, I see the choice of Guardian/Bers as one that should be equally beneficial. Its not. This hurts me as a Bers in that I have to **** my DPS in order to let a Guardian to tank (which I almost always do as I would rather deploy my DPS and be ready as a second tank). Guardian agro capabilities are nowhere near enough in the mid 20s to compensate (perhaps this changes later in the game). I'd prefer to see Guardians get a skill that offsets bloodlust (which works as I envisioned Bers to be...lots of dps for the reduced damage taking capability when Bers) rather than see my class nerfed. --------------------------- When using the Guardian as MT the Berserker can take the role of Offtank should something go wrong with his aggro ability, bur he needs to cut back on using his specials ----------------------------- Sir its is more than "cut back"; you can not use bloodlust at all as a SA or in some cases dual wield. Heck sometimes I cant use bloodrage...basically I need to have a DPS lobotomy in some circumstances while SA. What is the point of being a Bers if you cant do DPS while being a SA? BTW its not just Guardians, SK agro output is out of whack too. Message Edited by CherobylJoe on 12-08-2004 01:05 PM
I would think as a Berserker grouped with Guardian would want the guard to tank, so the Berserker can attack from the weakest point on the mob, the back side. Maximize DPS, while the Guard maximizes Damage mitigation. One thing I always try to do is keep mobs back sides exposed for melee attacks, regardless if I am grouped with a scout or not. I could be wrong here, I would be interested to see what other Berserkers think. Just think if a guard COULD hold agro over a Zerking Berserker, how much DPS would improve over all for the group in general. If SOE can find a way to un handcuff the Berserker while in Zerk mode (with guard in group) I think it would resolve most of the issues on both sides. I could be wrong but this is my perception.
guardians cant have it all,bloodlust is 1 of the reasons i hardly NEVER loose aggro,if a group goes for a berserker it should have its pros aswell,we take more dmg but hold aggro better,thats a risk a group leader has 2 make when forming a group.
Wow Dartan , seems like you couldnt say anything after you were shown various list of skills guardians have over berserkers in tanking? Berserkers will get nerfed , Cmon now yall , former eq1 players you know how SoE is when a certain class whines so much about another.... that other class gets nerfed Berserkers are my #1 love..... they screwed us over in eq1, now that we are a great class to play in eq2, people already want to **** us... Genghiz Destrus, 66 Berserker FV server eq1 ( retired) Strykr Destrusticus 26 Berserker AB server eq2
I'm not speaking for my class here, and I haven't experienced first hand a whole lot issues on the zerker vs. guardian front. However, from the experience I do have, the aggro of a zerker is well and beyond that of a guardian several levels apart. Tanking with wizards, healers, and such I can hold aggro well, unless I'm laggy for whatever reason, then I might have a quick lapse, and someone might get hit once or twice. Tanking with a zerker, I am forced to spam taunts and buffs alot more often due to the hate and aggro they create. It's said, "you're just a zerker buff, do your job" If that's the case, then there's something wrong. Guardian = Dmg mitigation + low DPS Zerker = Lower dmg mitigation + higher DPS Our guard lines aren't anywhere adequate enough (haven't logged in since today's patch) we seem to take 10% of the damage a party member would take otherwise. With that in mind, a better group would drop that guardian, and pick up a scout or a wizard to provide harder hitting dps. All I'm saying is that the aggro issues are probably the biggest reason that berserkers eclipse guardians in the role of tanking. I'm not crying for nerfs. Bring the hate increasing skills in line between the two classes.
I do not belive a "Nerf" is needed however there seems to be a couple things that should be addressed. 1) Zerkers should not be able to ware the Forged <Whatever Material> vanguard armor as they can now. It says under Zerkers that we don't get vnaguard. 2) Guardians need a higher damage mitiagation, some self buffs to help would be great. 3) Zerkers need a higher damage bonus to weapons then guardians. Right now form what I have seen a guardian and Zerker do the same damage per swing. 4) Guardians should get a HP bonus above what they are getting now. It should be more like in EQ1, Zerkers deal out insane damage but they are not your main tank. Just my $0.02
There are actually six. That only the warrior branch is intended to be tanks is a misconception by players.
It should be more like in EQ1 If you want to play EQ1, go play EQ1. The complaint you have isn't even that the game is unbalanced--your complaint is that the game IS balanced, and that the other tank classes are able to tank equally well when you think you deserve an unfair edge. For the last time, Berserkers are not a "DPS class"; we are tanks just like Guardians.
