Come on Guys, it's obvious Lockeye is able to observe some really uber rangers. We all just suck and should just Learn2 Play. Message Edited by ChaosUndivided on 07-28-2006 07:00 PM
LOL, Conjurers, Necromancers, Swashbuckler's and Brigands absolutely obliterate Ranger DPS all the time. If youre not seeing this in your data then you need to fix your data collection tools because theyre a bit broken. Brig damage is pretty good and Swash damage is astronomical by comparison. I'm talking raid equipped toons here, in both raid and group situations. My ranger can still do some amazing stuff, i can still solo heroics with my ranger (though with much greater effort than before). However my ranger does not come anywhere close to a swash or brig in terms of raw damage yet offers a group very little in exchange for it. Even assassins get apply poison and aggro transfer, a luxury that rangers do not receive. Yeah rangers get what? Two debuffs? Name a class that doesnt get at least 2 debuffs of some kind though.
Lockeye if there is anything i want you to read its this. A ranger will only get the top dps or average dps on a raid if the other members on that raid who are summoners and rogues arent at least doing average dps. This means that they are doing less than what they could be doing. If you assume that a top ww guild is going to have every member be able to fill out their class role to a point then you can assume that any information gained from them will be very near to accurate. I want damage i want dps Meow Mix Meow Mix please deliver.
I would gladly post parses of our rangers, like I post parses of myself, except my guild got rid of all our rangers when we realized they couldn't do the dps of a rogue or summoner, and didn't have the utility either. I'm not sure if I'm in a top guild or not though...
Do you notice in the first post he says first hand expierence in raiding, grouping, and soloing he said everything was fine. However in the second post, it was raw data. Is it me or is he contradicting himself? 1st thing: since when are devs allowed to raid? I was fairly certian they weren't allowed in guilds ( incidents with npu accused of having a gm ? ) Which guild are you giving an unfair advantage to in killing with? obviously it must have players that do not know how to optimize their class in it if a ranger is always going to have potential to be #1. Or was your first hand raid encounters off pick up nonsense with people not knowing [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] they're doing. 2nd thing: When you analize this "raw data" what are you doing? looking at the dps from performing CA's, or looking at the dmg numbers on the CA's...they're two completely different things... 3rd thing: ask the majority of high end raiding guilds... NONE OF THEM will ever say a ranger would straight up out dps a conjurer ever ever ever ever ever ( on some occasions they may, but not 100% like your saying a ranger has the potential to) 4th thing: If rangers and assassins are so equal as you state, how come many rangers are betraying to assassins, and hardly anyone has ever heard of an assassin betraying to a ranger? Don't give me that playstyle bull[expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] excuse either. 5th thing: If you, lockeye, think every ranger sucks and thats why their not desired in raids, not because something is unbalanced. Please tell me I suck, and ban me from the forums right now, please
Here is something else you may not want to hear. If you rangers are constantly getting out dps'd by that many classes, you plain suck. I am sick and tired of rangers whining into oblivion until you get classes nerfed. OMG, please stop with the whining. This board is sick and pathetic. If you guys want to learn how to be on top of your parses please shoot me a tell in game, I will hook you up with some good rangers who know how to play there class, in game instead of on the boards whining about it. Be good boys and girls.... I'll be back in a little bit to check on ya and change your diapers and put you down for a nap. Oh and as an FYI...... The DPS in our guild is constantly like this... in the top 4 in no particular order because it is extremely situational. Conjurors/Necros......Rangers......Berserkers......and Wizards/Warlocks. Our bruiser pulls and sets traps alot so is dead during fights a ton, so I do not have any proof to tell you about there DPS. Message Edited by Badd Boy on 07-28-2006 10:17 PM
In the high end raiding world, here are the DPS tiers; Conjurer Assassin Rogues/Necro Bruisers Wizard/Warlock/RANGER Monks
Just because people you play with suck, that make your ranger look good, doesn't mean a class on the high end is fine. k thx
Or your Sorcs suck. You also don't have any assassins do you? Or how about Rogues? They should be up there as well. What about Illusionists? They can dish out DPS too, but obviously you don't have a very DPS-oriented one. I mean either the people in your guild aren't the greatest at the game, or wait, that's obviously it. Message Edited by Pinski on 07-28-2006 10:25 PM
Yes, I said berserkers. AE fights, berserkers own. Most T7 raids are AE. Can I outdps a berserker. Yes and I do most of the time. I am telling you how it comes up. If you dont like it fine. Our raid averages about 13k-15k dps sometimes more sometimes less. If that is not in line with you guys that it's not. It is what I see "first hand" since you guys like to use that term. Stand back and look at the classes that have been nerfed. You rangers were nerfed, I understand. I feel your pain. What I don't like is always browsing class boards and seeing the whining. You don't like your class, betray. One more thing, berserkers are on parse a ton. Not all the time....but a ton. I talk to our rangers all the time and ask them what is going on....they say the same exact thing..I stay away from our class boards because they whine too much. Shoot a tell to our ranger and talk to him. I don't wanna mention there names on here but you can look at our guild page and see it. You think I am full of crap..fine. I don't have to prove a thing to you guys. Obviously Lockeye is seeing it for himself.
Heh, we do have one. He is in recruit status and does not raid as much with us atm. Our Assassin changed servers some time ago. I can't speak for assassins, so I did not throw them in.
Badd Boy that is the problem though. Why are you proud that your Berserkers on top? The Devs have specifically stated that they are not supposed to be T1 dps. Now we have the dev saying again that we as rangers are full of it, and our parsings are way out of wack... hmm.. LOTS of contradicting information going on... and on second thought.. I'm done... this is beyond belief Message Edited by Peston on 07-28-2006 07:37 PM
Why should we bother any longer. It's obvious SOE doesn't really care, or their data is just plain WRONG and you choose to hide behide it without checking a wider sampling. Seriosuly, how about you follow a high end raiding guild around for a few nights and see the parses.. Oh wait most of those guilds don't have a Ranger(s) anymore. Why is that? Can't be because their DPS is lower then other classes, some of which are suppose to be LOWER DPS then the Rangers but they bring alot more utility and MORE DPS to the raid.
Lockeye, Let's see your raw data. Let's see how it stacks up against all the parses here. It's one thing to say you have the data, it's quite another to share said data.
I don't see anyone here looking to get a class nerfed, especially because that is exactly what happened to us. I see a lot of people with good points that are posting good information to get US boosted to where we should be. That's how most have tried to be around here, constructive and informative. The only one whining here is you about the feedback that people are giving.
