create a ranger on beta and see for yourself. i can just say that its true. no poison, no procs, no stream. so yes, we are lower tier 3 now ! Message Edited by Memory01 on 02-15-200602:49 PM
I have a Ranger on beta. DPS is not "probably reduced by half." Not sure where else to go with this...
you got a parser ? tell me if ya get over 500 dps with ya lil ranger (except for hitting sniper shot on solo mobs) i got a lv 70 ranger, fully aa, fully master1 t6+t7, fully legendary/fabled t7 and i cant break the 650 dps in any case. since thats unrealistic situation you can expect dmg to be below 500 with a casual amount of masters and aa.
Since when were parsers actually accurate and dependable, in any situation? (Not trying to get into some kind of flame thread here, just calling the shots as I see them.) Since anything can be changed, maybe if you /feeback that stuff to the devs they will have you replicate the numbers for them and adjust. Or if they don't do anything, fine...I don't have the full uber Ranger on beta and I'm not the devs. I just don't see the sky is falling I guess. My two coppers' worth. Best of luck to ya in there :smileyhappy: Message Edited by KnightOfTheWord on 02-15-200603:00 PM
im using 2 different ones. and if you want to discredit parsers, visit their developers, i for myself found them true and working just fine. if you would play a ranger on beta actually you would notice by the first solo mob you try to kill what our dps is at, even when estimating you should clearly see it, but i guess some people just dont want so see.
OK lets cut to the chase here exactly how bad is it in terms of gameplay. With my lvl 60 Ranger I can take down a white con ^^^ heroic (1 mob not grps). Wizards can do the same as well, we're both tier 1 so no complaining please forum trolls. So whats the situation on Beta atm? How is our solo ability? Are we getting destroyed in terms of DPS by other classes?
parsers are useful in so much as car dynos are useful ... for comparisons only.. the actual numbers mean little.. but if you had 900 before and cant break 500 now.. then it can measure that.
thats what im talking about actually. in terms of soloability: if you use everything you got like snipers, trap, triple, precise, etc... you wont take down an even con heroic +++ at all. you would need some minutes of kiting at least, mostly that doesnt work either since even crappy dmg also breaks our snares. the most impressive thing ive done is created a new ranger, buffed to 60, bought all adept1, bought all handcrafted. then engaged a lv 57 solo mob and had to start kiting (i didnt use snipers)
alright then. i was in a raid taking down a contested lv 74 before the critical prof nerf patch that hit us. i was doing around 2k dps for over 5 min. shortly after servers went down and got patched. then i was in a raid going to vyemms and parsed 660 dps.
At the risk of being hanged, I am posting here. I play a Wizard. Recently, my brother came back to EQ2, and he rolled a Ranger. He started a month or so ago and the race was on to get him to 60 before the expansion hit. While getting him to 60 I've learned a lot about the ranger class. While rangers are (were?) awesome DPS, they lost any advantage they had once the mob got on to them. Rangers can't cast bow abilities at point blank like casters can cast spells point blank, and while chain armor helps a little, a ranger is always in offensive stance and thus their defensive abilities are always gimped. Ranger's also have 0 group buffs, the only way they can increase a raid's DPS is by doing it themselves, or by debuffing the mob. And off the top of my head I only remember a heat debuff and a defense debuff. I'm basically reiterating what every ranger has said here, that Ranger's offer very little utility to the group other than their DPS. I don't consider out of combat abilities as real utility, because it doesn't help you win a fight (ie, evac, pathfinding, tracking, etc). Personally, the change to proc's isn't an unexpected one to me. As a wizard, I was actually hoping to take advantage of the way they worked in the near future. DoF introduced 4 spell proc items that I know about (two of which are primary hand weapons). So simply from 3 DoF items I could eventually get 3 spell proc items. I would only imagine that more of these types of items would be added with KoS. I was looking forward to the day when I had 5 or so spell procs from items, dynamism, and the troubadour buff all making my procs proc like crazy like a ranger. It would have been a sight to see for sure! Imagine a wizard proc'ing 3 or 4 proc's every time they cast a spell; it would do insane things to wizard dps. I knew though that this mechanic was bound to be fixed, because there is no way that SOE would let a wizard do that kind of extra damage simply by getting 4-5 specific items. I discussed with my brother the other day about our comparative DPS. I told him that I didn't think Rangers needed a nerf, but I told him about my spell proc plans for the future. I told him what SOE would probably do. I also told him that if SOE did indeed fix proc's (I swear SOE was ease dropping in on our TeamSpeak server, because they did the two exact fixes I said they would probably do eventually) then they would have to boost the Ranger combat art damage to keep them inline with the tiers. Now as far as tiers go, prior to this change I didn't understand them. I didn't know if they were still the intention or what. I didn't know who was doing the right amount of damage or who was doing the wrong amount of damage. I also didn't know if indirect damage (like a Wizard's Icebound Gift group spell proc or a troubadour group spell proc) was factored into these tiers. I still don't know these things, but I have some guesses now. I think SOE believes that Sorcerer's DPS is where it should be. The changes to the proc's bring Rangers more inline with Sorcerer's. However, Ranger's Combat Arts will probably need a little boost still (I say probably because I'm not in beta and thus haven't seen the parses yet). Ranger's should still be able to parse #1. If that is not happening ever, then they need a boost in their Combat Art damage. The reason Rangers perceive this as being nerfed down several tiers is because they are comparing it to classes that are not at their correct position for their tier. If you feel bitter, feel free to call for a nerf of those classes, as it will happen regardless of whether or not you cry for it. I've addressed everything about this change except the change itself. A lot of people don't understand what this change does to poisons for all scouts classes. By using the skill's cast time to determine the chance to proc, and by limiting the chance to proc to only 1 time for a Combat Art, they are making the proc rate for all rogue and predator classes equal (ie, after 10min of fighting, all of them should have proc'd their poisons roughly the same number of times). You may or may not be aware that Ranger's went through poisons a great deal faster than any other scout class because they were proc'ing far more often. SOE's vision of the Ranger class is a scout that uses bows and arrows; it is not their vision that Rangers are the "poison class" of the four scout classes that can use poison. Poisons should and will benefit all four of the poison using scout classes equally after this update. This is balance. If this change creates an over-all imbalance in the DPS tiers due to weak Combat Art damage, then the Combat Arts will need to be improved. Yes it sucks that your class is being changed in such a dramatic way. Yes it sucks that SOE didn't pick up on this problem a long time ago when every player learned how to take advantage of it, and every player had already accepted it as how the thing was supposed to work. Voice your concerns by all means. Post constructive criticism and fight for your right to be equal in damage with Assassins, Warlocks, and Wizards. Or just play the game and have fun. But if you're like me, and I think you are, then you feel passionately about your class and enjoy playing this game. So stick around, give feedback, and make sure your fellow Rangers don't get left out in the cold. Finally, if you need a bright side to look at, think of it this way. You won't go through as many poisons, thus saving you money. Your damage won't rely on poison use as much, so your damage won't go down as much if you don't use poisons. You're combat arts will probably receive a boost in damage. And finally, you still have the best hate-reduction skills in the entire game. You're friendly neighborhood wizard, Dehah Club Fu
/speachless Friendly Wizard indeed! If they boost our CAs, I could probably live with this change. Stun poisons will still take a hit, but I wouldn't feel the same dread I've had all day.
I fully agree and appreciate this post. It summarizes the differences between wiz/war and rangers and just reflects what has been posted in those ranger boards so far.
2 years after the release of a game and they decide to ruin a class. This type of nerf should of been done in early debugging stages not after there are many people that are 60 and used to playing a class. As I have said before rangers may cast major damage but they also cost more coin to support and do have to be at a distance to cause this type of damage. I have a feeling that if there is this big of a change to the ranger class they are going to have enough room to merge even more servers together. This is not a situation where dedicated players need to feel punished for picking a powerful class. Sony needs to be carefull!!!.... havent they been watching their competitors S"ig"il Games and P"la"y.net???
Let's see what happens, and if it as bad as this looks, we FIGHT. I don't need to be super-DPS, but dammit, we're not here for eye candy, WE ARE A DPS CLASS. I'm sure as HELL not going to take this lying down. We know something really bad is going to happen, and our damage is going to take a huge hit. It's not like SOE is going to completely scrap this idea - it will make it to live, in some form, and our damage - the primary purpose behind our class - is going to suffer. They say they want us to be Tier 1 DPS. I'm wondering how the hell they intend for us remain there.
Dude start swinging now!!! Or your gonna get knocked the [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] out in the first round!
