Well was taking a look at how much arrows are really costing me and what i found was quite unreal and kinda upset me. I usually work nights so the nights i do have off i usually raid so i dont really have alot of time to make any extra cash except for little masters that take forever to sell, so i go through arrows like mad. I carry a 16 slot quiver which is about 1580 arrows, and i dont have a fabled arrow summoning bow and i have yet been able to afford or loot the reclaimed m1 yet . As every ranger knows this only take about the good part of an hour and a half or so into a raid night to go through, so they dont last long at all. So if u take the adamantine arrows from vendors they are like 6 silver an arrow 6 x 99 = 594 silver which in return is about 6 gold so 6 x 16 = 96 gold [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] thats almost a plat to get about 2 hours worth of raiding along with struggling to to get top 5 or so on the dps charts.... and this is all excluding poisons...to my knowledge there is no other class that has to spend so much just to function properly. This is slowly eating away at my will to play knowing that im in a round about circle with making a lil money and spending all of it on arrows so i can raid the next day. I know there have been numerous posts on this subject but by now something should have been done because it truley is getting ridiculous. As a ranger using bows as our PRIMARY form of damage dealing i would think there would be a way to get arrows cheaper than other classes or at least get something like unlimited arrows aa, or make more arrow summoning bows or raise the reclaimed skill to maybe a stack a summon and change the recast time or SOMETHING. So anywho just wanted to get that out from my well kept to self...if anyone else has any comments or anything that would be cool. Have a great Day Hehaheha 70th Ranger of Ascension Butcherblock
Yah, I end up hunting with tin arrows and saving all my reclaimed ones for raid/group useage. Way way way to costly otherwise I was invited on a RAID by my brother the other night and refused, when he asked me why I explained about how much it would cost me to come along and he just couldn't quite believe it. The whole reclaimed line needs to have it's numbers upped significantly.
I think we are our own worst enemy here. Some of us have been raiding pretty regular for over a year and have been complaining about this for over a year. At the same time, many of us who don't raid regularly, continue to state that there isn't a problem with arrow usage. So we now have a solution with the EoF AA tree. We can put AA points into a skill that will double our reclaimed arrow output. The only problem is that the people who would benefit from this is the raiders. But, no raider in his/her right mind is going to choose more free arrows over a skill that will increase their DPS. We should have been more specific when we asked for a fix on arrow consumption.
Maybe, but even without raiding I go through way more arrows than I can get for free, plus even the doubling via EoF AA wont fix the problem for a Raiding Ranger.
Its a pretty good idea to put aa points into the Backup quiver. Even if you raid. Since after do poisions let say 15 and put about 20 in Multishot since i dunt think u wana put em in Steam of arrows. There isnt really others left. Maybe focusing but to get to that you have to waste points into defensive stance or traping. Which also doesnt help dps.... So might as well put em in Backup quiver since more T7 arrows = more dps.
Yes in my opinion this is our bigges issue. Yea alot bigger than the DPS issue going around. In the end it is possible for a ranger to be within reach of an assasin and I don't even want to go into this. Arrows Arrows Arrows. yea it is not unusual to spend about 2k arrows on a raid, and I even find I spend about 1k arrows on a normal heroic instance (of course this depends). to make this a bit clearer, for a ranger to be able to support his/her raiding with makeshift arrows he/she would have to spend adept 1 - 9 hours and 30 minutes = 2000 arrows adept 3 - 7 hours and 20 minutes = 2000 arrows Master 1 - 5 hours and 30 minutes =2000 arrows the numbers are ca. but even with a master we are talking over 5 hours of no adventuring just doing nothing but using your reclaimed skill to be able to do a raid, or hunt for 1 day. This is extreme and is very unfair. No other classes have this kind of arrow usage, no other class is dependant on arrows to function, no other class need to spend over 50% of their gametime gathering arrows. Also if you get the AAs for it you can halve those times, and that helps alot, but as earlier said most rangers will have a hard time leaving a dps benefiting ability to get more arrows. This in effect nerf our class in other areas as well. It means we make less money, we get less xp, we have less chance of getting masters or loot that can benefit us. Cause all of these other things involve spending time on it, time we have to spend gathering arrows. And you can claim that we should buy them, then we spend money and money = time to add to this money = time using arrows. In other words having ends meet is hard then too. This is a balance issue that affects all rangers, not just raiders, pvpers, groupers, or soloers. And to add to the whole issue is the space it takes. It is not unusal for a ranger to keep 2-3 quivers or backpacks full of arrows on them at all times. Which in effect means we fill up our inventory quicker and in effect can lead to less loot or more time spent on going to vendor/broker which in effect means less money. And don't come with the "we should be glad quivers exist, we used to have to equip every 99 arrows" I was here when this was the reality and yea that sucked, but this ain't all that good either. 1 Quivers should have more slots, more slots than 32 slot boxes, after all there is only one type of items that go into them. 2 arrow summoning line should give more arrows, ALOT more arrows the only workaround that currently exist is having one of the 2 DT bows, which then gives you Ichor/Bazkul - 1 hour and 50 minutes = 2000 arrows the only problem is that both these bows drop from mobs in a raid zone that is very hard. Now I am not saying every ranger should have t8 ammo, but I really think all rangers should be able to support their own usage without having to spend countless arrows or multiple plats. As I allready said IMO this is the biggest issue with rangers atm, screw all the dps complaining, fact is if you work hard enough and find out how to use your class to the fullest you can do better than most. And yea I still think there is a big lack in bows in this game, and to think there are more shield models than there are bow models is kind of disturbing, (as of now there are only 4 differnet bow models, if you count shortbow, and 2 of them are very new and only on fabled bows). I am not saying the model of the bow is a make or break, but it just shows us even more how we have a lower priority than most. Or at least it feels that way. Sorry didn't mean to rant at the end there, but I couldn't help myself. My 2 copper
The first time I realized my arrows cost over a plat I sat in front of the merchant and wept like a little girl, but she wouldn't go down on the price.
I think ignoring the focus line is a bad move for a raiding raider but each to their own Even without Ichor to summon I doubt I would have placed any points in the summon ability. Mirdo.
/bump, Come on SOE fix this! having an issue with getting arrows is one of the dumbest things ever in this game, completely pointless and serves no purpose other than to make the Ranger gaming more frustrating!
Yeah, if there were an endless arrow quiver I would buy it even if it was 10plat. Why? Because that would probably save me about 30plat between now and 70 and god forbid I ever decide to raid.
I mean this cost would be PERFECTLY acceptable if different arrows made significant differences in DPS, or if we were back up at T1 dps (before any raiders say they are T1 dps, an afk wizard can usually equal a ranger sweating in effort throwing poisons and arrows with wanton abandon) But there's no flipp'n reason to have us have LIMITED ammo and still not a terrorfying source of DPS.
LOL Try running HoF, and then Obelisk or Crypt in the afternoon, then raid that night. You might make it through the night, but you'll be out of luck the next day. Unless you were carrying 6 bags + 1 quiver full of nothing but arrows, you can't function the next day without spending 5 or 6 plat on arrows from the vendor. It's incredibly frustrating.
What bugs me is that, finally after raiding hundreds of times I got the ichorstrand bow that summons ammo. It does 99 every 5 minutes so it's a big saver of money. Too bad he bow itself is terrible. I still use the Grizzfazzle's as my bow with the ichor ammo. I assume it'll be hundreds of more hours before I have a good damage bow. Anyhow ina non raid situation you'll see me using only caress of the banshee poison off the vendor for da cheap. I don't break out the good stuff (Grandmaster;s all 3 until a raid)So what bothers me is that as a class which seems to offer little else than dps to a Raid group has to spend mega bucks and get super rare fabled drops just to compete. All this so i can maybe get in the top 7 on the parse behind the 2k dps Necros Conjs and Assassins and the slightly lower Wizzies and Warlocks. Don't want to seem as if I am just whining. I really love the play style of the Ranger. I am just sad. seriously. I feel i have mastered the toon for it's top potential. I used to always top the dps rankings. I'm continuosly experimenting with ways to increase my dps..but I see myself fall farther and farther behind. I feel so worthless ina raid. Maybe they'll let me surveil pull a mob :-/ approx. 50 gold on poisons or trying to cajole a guildie to make some for free and then I am mediocre. So basically I play my Fury at raids and break out the ranger for fun in groups occasionally. Message Edited by Sannavekk on 12-15-2006 11:12 AM
I tend to raid about two or three nights a week. When I'm not raiding, I'm almost always dinking around solo with quests. I almost never group. A lot of the time, I'm just screwing around and doing nothing productive. Plenty of time to summon arrows, yeah? I am still running low, unless I literally sit online all freaking day and hit the summon button every time it comes up. When I have to buy arrows to make up for a shortage it makes me ill. I'm not exactly made of money, and poisons alone are killing my bank account. I agree with what was said above. IF I could do awesome DPS and come even close to outmatching, say, oh, SUMMONERS, I wouldn't complain nearly so much. Lately I've been farming on alts almost solely because I'm hurting that much for money. Half a plat or more for poisons, a plat or more for arrows, every single night I wanna raid, and all of that and I'm routinely outdone in damage by summoners, wizards, assassins, and sometimes brigands. And not by a little either...when I'm happy to break 1200, the necro hits 2k+ routinely. It's very, very irking to break the bank just trying to keep a place on the rankings, and to still be so incredibly outdone in every single field, from DPS to utility, by classes that often don't have to pay for anything but food and drink. I really love playing my ranger. I've got a huge range of alts and not one of them appeals to me as much as she does. But man, is it ever frustrating at the exact same time.
i did a small group last night and by the end i was down 900 arrows. maybe 1 hour worth of play. i have the 62 M1 summon spell. the solution is not more arrows per summon. i already sacrifice 1 bag slot with a quiver and i dont want to lose more loot space for more arrows. they should eliminate arrow consumption on CAs and should only use arrows on auto attack.
Bongo makes an extremely good point, for many reasons. First off this would counter the issue with inventory space somewhat. Second off this would counter the extreme usage of arrows somewhat. And why the heck are we paying 6s or time to do one arrow attack, that is not affected by the arrow what so ever. yea you can look at it the logical way, how can we shoot an arrow we don't have. But if to loose some sense of realism is what we need to do then by god loose it. Having to carry 10k arrows around isn't overly realistic either. However with just auto attack (in pure numbers) you still use around 120-150 arrows per 10min, which is alot more than any (again excluding the DT bows) summon spell can summon. Yea this would cut down the timesink ALOT, only having to carry around arrows for auto-attack makes a ton of a difference, but I still say give us a bit more on the summon spells and slightly bigger quivers. The reason is I don't want to see something be half fixed, however I would take the "CAs no longer require arrows" with arms wide open, and a crying heart for gods sake. There is one problem in all of this, and that is the woodworkers, but then again the crafted arrows are worthless, because vendor arrows are still cheaper. I don't know how they should fix woodworking in that sens, but then again they might not. They allready have totems and that is enough consumables isn't it? the bottomline is something needs to be done, it simply is not fair as I have showed with numbers on my previous post. I think I am leaning against bongo's solution atm, because it fixes so much with such a little change. Kinda make things simpler instead of complicating it (like my solution earlier).
Arrow consumption is the biggest issue for rangers in game atm. RabbitFly's post is really informative. Gives you a very good breakdown of time:supply. The new AA Enhance: Backup quiver is a very nice AA. With 5 points, you can cut down your time by 50%. The question is, how many would be prepared to do it, at the cost of some dps. Well, i guess that depends on how much of a raider you are, your own arrow supply problems .. and the funds you have. I'd recommend getting this for any raider having issues with arrow supply. Its a temporary fix until you can get 1 of the DT bows. At M1, reclaimed arrows and 5 points into Enchanced: Backup Quiver (60 arrows @ 5mins) will put you closer to the lvl of of a DT bows (99 arrows @ 5mins). You can always /respec your AA once you get a DT bow. Some reminders, just keep spamming arrow supply, each time its up. Even when your quiver is full, keep spamming it. Store some in your bank or house vault. Go with the biggest size quiver you can get. There's no restrictions on your characters level as to which quiver you can get. Dont have to buy adamantine arrows all the time. There's other tier arrows (not just cheap tin, at half the cost of adamantine) available to buy/use for soloing/grouping. Buying a stack of adamantine is equivalent to getting 1 adept1 loot. Making money is very easy from vendor loot from general play, whether your soloing or grouping. Don't complain about arrow supply, if all you do is come online for raids. You need to put some effort into working on other areas of the game, which is a good opportunity to build up your arrow supply/funds. Keep pushing your guild to raid DT. Hard to know for sure if they have increased drop rate on bows, but in my experience, we had Bazkul drop for 4 weeks straight, leading up to EoF release. We havent been back since, but going in again today. (6x bazkul, 3x ichorstrand, 2x recurved heartsinger, 1x dragonhorn recurve, 0 sarnak/corruption is our guilds experience during KoS) The issue for arrow supply, only applies to raiding rangers. Casual players need not worry. (DPS in another topic and i'd prefer if it wasnt referred to in this thread. There's countless threads on DPS. For the record, DPS is no longer an issue in EoF for rangers ... period.)
How about sony adding a system to the game that makes other classes like tanks and primary melee casters having to sharpen their weapon every now and then and mend their shield maybe then other classes realize that being a ranger that has to fork out alot of plat on just maintaining your normal dmg would make them react. I mean a tank that has to haul around 24 different shield just to play a couple of hours would probably be a nice lessons for other players. and not to meantion assassin and other duel wielders would have to run around with atleast 48 different weapons now that would be something to laugh about.
You're wrong, arrow supply is a concern for everyone, I have only ever raided once and have arrow issues, and why the hell should I have to hunt to pay for my dps, no other class does, if you're that happy about it then please send me some plat.
Actually, i'm right. Arrow problem is only a concern for raiding rangers. Nuladen, If your having problems with arrow supply, your just being lazy. Crafting, harvesting, questing, exploring, all give enough downtime to build up your arrow supply. Soloing, grouping will eat away at your supply, but not enough that you can't easily replenish. mmmm, "social welfare" comfortable for you?
