Adept 1 and Adept3 spells do SAME Damage/Effects

Discussion in 'Warlock' started by ARCHIVED-Ranvier, Mar 12, 2005.

  1. ARCHIVED-Ranvier Guest

    I am a level 50 Warlock of Triton on Permafrost and I have noticed this "bug" or what have you for a while now. No idea if others have noticed this or not. ALL my spells (minus invis) are either Adept 3 or Master 1 (with 2 Trait Adept 2's). My Adept 3 spells do the SAME damage as Adept 1 versions of it. I have a friend who is also a level 50 warlock named Zoldark and he and I pretty much do the same dmg (he has adept 1).

    I would like to see this fixed when situation permits because its sad that Master 1 and Adept 3 owners do the same dmg as Adept 1 owners heh. Not sure if this is a problem with other classes too or just Warlocks but I have observed this and bringing it to light.
  2. ARCHIVED-Xintar Guest

    Is this on ALL spells or just on the last set of spells that you currently use? Remember that the level cap will increase and as always your spells will increase in effectiveness as you level past 50. But if this is an issue on all spells, it should be addressed.
  3. ARCHIVED-Splatterpunk28 Guest

    Hmmm. Can you give us Adept I vs Adept III vs Master I spell descriptions that confirm this?
    Or is this parsed information? There's so many explanations why you might parse the same damage that it's going to be hard to get devs to even look into this without hard numbers. If it's not in the spell description that there's an obvious issue, then the only thing people are going to be able to look at are parsings that show maybe higher versions getting higher resists or that the average hit is the same as the lower versions. I highly suggest Statalyzer to compare spell dmg,hit,miss, etc:
    http://www.thescoutssanctuary.com/viewtopic.php?t=3017
    Give us more information.
  4. ARCHIVED-Ranvier Guest

    Its on all spells...and not just damage spells but buffs as well. And its just not spells that con yellow or higher but blue/white con spells too...ones we have reached mastery skill. I observed this about damage spell when me and a friend lvl 50 warlock were grouping together and we were doing 10-20 dps near each other...he has Adept 1's and I have higher.

    I will try and put a parsing thing together again. And as far as buffs are concerned...if a Warlock with Adept 1 Aspect of Darkness for instance posts a pic of the spell exam I will post pic of my Adept 3 of the same spell and you will see them as being identical =P
  5. ARCHIVED-Splatterpunk28 Guest

    There's a huge difference in saying the SAME damage and then 10-20dps difference.
    Let's look at a mastered spell closesly:
    Dark Distortion Adept I vs Adept III
    -Inflicts 535-803 vs 590-886 (9.68% increase)
    -Increase power of caster by 42 vs 48 (12.5% increase)
    So, like it's been said as standard in other posts...the difference is about 10% from Adept I - Adept III.
    Since you are 50, and I've seen in many posts that the average dps is between 175-200 from warlocks at that level, then a 10-20dps difference from someone using all adept I's and someone using all adept III's, sounds right on target.
    I don't see a problem. If you were expecting there to be a bigger difference, I'd suggest posting in Spells, Abilities and Combar Arts section as it's not a class issue.
  6. ARCHIVED-Ranvier Guest

  7. ARCHIVED-Alfred75 Guest

    The bugs begin with the mid level spells onwards. The lower level ones seemed to work e.g. Steal Breath Master does 100+ damage when mastered, Invite Void Master 1 has better conversion than Adept 1 version.

    There are many issues with the higher level spells. Upgrade spells do not scale, or do not scale properly.

    Example Dark Pact: At Adept 1 or Adept 3, you see no differences in resists or int or str (the spell is blue or green to me).

    Example: Bony Grasp: Comparing Adept 1 and Master 1, you find that there is no difference in AOE range, spell duration or recast time.

    Fix these bugs please. It really irritates and it does not create any character differentiation.
  8. ARCHIVED-Splatterpunk28 Guest

    There are posts on other threads that a 50warlock said 400+dps is only on grey mobs...and you are doing that on raids? Hmmm....

    I'm just trying to be helpful. If you want devs to look at it, give more information. Which spells are there no difference in Adept I vs Adept III? Because it obviously is not on all of them, just looking at the numbers I've seen, there's a 10% jump on all of the ones I've upgraded. I'm not 50, and not many are...so if you're going to say there's a problem, give specifics.
  9. ARCHIVED-WaachBack Guest

    Its possible, I have hit close to 400 dps before, the above poster also has his lvl 50 aeo dot spell which gives a big boost to our dps.
  10. ARCHIVED-Solan Swiftfist Guest

    I went from Adept I to Adept III of Nil distortion and there was a change in damage. About 200 more on average. I am 49 now and noticed that on inspection, the max spell damage has not increased since level 47 or so. Reason I say this is maybe each spell has a max damage. Adept III will let you get that max damage faster than adept I. At 50, maybe all spells 42 and below (just a guess) will hit max damage regardless of level of adepts. Maybe spells 47 plus still make a difference with adepts.

    I think I confussed myself here so I am sure you guys are too :smileywink:
  11. ARCHIVED-WaachBack Guest

    It just a matter of when the spell is mastered. I believe Nil Distortion is mastered at lvl 47? If so, that is why dont see any more added damage.
  12. ARCHIVED-Alfred75 Guest

    What is your max damage per tick for Steal Breath Adept 1? I do 100+ damage per tick for Master 1 (spell is more than mastered). Would like to know max damage per tick for Steal Breath Adept 1 (mastered) so I can know if Master 1/Adept 3 allows earlier mastery of spells, or it increases the damage/debufss/effects.

    As it is, Dark Pact Adept 1 and Adept 3 gives no difference in stats. Bony Grasp gives no difference in duration/cast times/recast times.
  13. ARCHIVED-Splatterpunk28 Guest

    Spell description for Adept I Steal Breath (yes, I have it mastered):
    79power, Inflicts 55-67dmg on target, decreases health of target 50-61 every 4 seconds, decreases AC vs disease/poison by 477-711.
  14. ARCHIVED-Thyriel Guest

    Hmm ill have adept3 of Nil Distortion and compared to a guildmate which is same level warlock but has app4 ill do my "normal" hits what his highest are, my max damge is around 250 to 300 higher then his. I would say thats definitly a good increase.
  15. ARCHIVED-Kreuz2 Guest

    When you first get a spell it is at Apprentice 1. The spell will cast as if you are 1 level lower then you actually are. Hence you get Nil Distortion at level 37 and you cast it on a level 37 mob without upgrading. The damage done to the mob will be calculated as if you were level 36 (and the mob is con yellow). If you raise it to App2 it will raise the power cost of the spell and the range of damage and cast it as your current level.

    App3 = Current Level +1, +raise of power cost and damage range
    App4 = Current Level +2, " "
    Adept 1 = Current Level +3, " "
    Adept 3 = Current Level +5, " "
    Master 1 = Current Level +6, " "

    So if you were lucky enough to get Nil Distortion Master 1 at level 37 and you attacked a level 37 mob the resist probablity and damage done to the mob would be calculated as if you were level 43 (and hence nuking a low con green mob). Which means, raising spell level decreases chances of resist and has a greater chance of doing max damage with an added power cost.


    Check High Magic Damage of players on the various servers. (Expand it to top 100).

    Look for people with 2105 or 2106 as a high magic hit. Those are Level 50 Warlocks with Nil Distortion Adept3. The ones slightly below that are Warlocks with Adept 3 but they arent level 50 or just became level 50 and havent used the spell enough to get the max potential.


    Sorry, I misread the article on Adept level the first time when I wrote this.

    Message Edited by Kreuz2 on 03-16-2005 12:17 PM
  16. ARCHIVED-Splatterpunk28 Guest

    Well, even if this information is correct, what does that change? Are you saying that soe intentionally made SOME spells that don't increase damage and instead the bonus for mastering the spell is the decrease in resist rates? It might explain spells that are offensive and have no damage associated with them (bony grasp?) But, otherwise...this doesn't change the fact that most spells do scale damage wise. If there are spells that do not, I want to know about it.
    Message Edited by Splatterpunk28 on 03-16-2005 12:07 PM
  17. ARCHIVED-JonasBlackmore Guest

    Spells, like gear, have a damage / effect cap. I.E. once you get to a certain level the spell will not improve any more beyond that point. This matters because: If you have a spell that has a level cap of 47 and you are 50. Having that at Adept 3 vs Apprentice 3 makes no difference. The spell capped at level 47, so you're casting it at level 55 vs 51 doesn't matter, as they are both above the cap level of 47.

    *edit*
    I'm not sure that spells have a damage / effect cap, that is purely an assumption. Just explaining why the above would matter.
    Message Edited by JonasBlackmore on 03-16-2005 03:37 PM
  18. ARCHIVED-Tanatus Guest

    ppl are you nuts?
    rank and tier of spell have nothing to do with + or - lvl - thats' total bull

    if you take your very grey DD at Apprentice 1 and upgrade it to the master 1 you will see 250% sharp increase of damage
    if you take your very orange DD at Apprentice 1 and upgrade it to the master 1 you see SAME 250% increase of damage

    In other words no matter how you slice it or dice 2.5XApp 1 damage = Master 1 damage

    True to be told that certain upgrades give very little improvement most [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ty are
    App 1 to App 2 = 10%
    App 3 to App 4 = 5% or none
    Adp 1 to Adp 3 = 10%

    Best upgrade you see once you raid tier of spell

    App 4 into Adp 1 = +20% (or App 3 into Adp 1 = +25%)
    and Adp 3 to Mst 1 = +22.5%
  19. ARCHIVED-Splatterpunk28 Guest

    That's pretty much what I thought. The OP was saying spells have the SAME damage/effects. I kept waiting for detailed information (and how difficult is it to copy down spell description numbers?) Anyway, I guess there's no problem.
    So moving on...
  20. ARCHIVED-Alfred75 Guest

    There is a difference. Take an Appren spell and cast a pet; then take an adept spell and cast a pet. See what the pet cons to you.