Do you mention if a DPS in your group isn't putting out much damage?

I mean, there are new players that are playing that could easily pull aggro from a guardian. I don't think it's really cool to call them out considering most people including you and I were probably in the same boat at one time also...

HOWEVER... then there are just the elitist DPS players who don't want to even try to manage aggro and you see them blowing up mobs and pulling extra adds, and those should be booted.

Gotta figure out which one it is though

(did i do this right?)

I don't say anything, but sometimes I've left groups because something "suddenly came up" when in reality the combined DPS in a nek2 group is 4.5k

I've never encountered someone who does more DPS and snaps aggro more than I do?Does that happen to other people frequently?
If the dps'ers are doing less dps than the healer, or I'm constantly snapping aggro from the tank, it doesn't really bother me. I'm doing my job, the tank should do his. I'll be damned if I have to put evade in my rotation. I'm there to pump and put the casuals in my backpack.

Still, most tanks are terrible when they're put in my company, mostly with Not pulling enough / not holding aggro on the two mobs at a time they're pulling.
Or, the healer having so little healing the tank dies / group wipes when I tell them I need more tenacity. Often times, I'll pull aggro and keep dumping on purpose because they can't keep taking hits like I can.

Playing DPS is not a free pass to be bad, or to be held back at the pace of the tank. I want 8 targets at a time. I'm there to pump numbers, so that I can avoid being called out. I've never been scrutinized for my performance. However, people who choose to show up under-geared to underperform are the rude players, because it's wasting my time taking a dungeon slow. Fail to plan, plan to fail.

And before anyone comes in with "You're not a new player, though?". If a new DPS player takes a few minutes and reads all of their abilities they probably won't out DPS me, but they should be out dpsing the healer. IF you have to be told to read your tooltips, I don't want you in my group anyways

If they keep ganking aggro off the tank that happens sometimes. Tanks don't have all the fun aggro abilities without having AA, and if the group isn't built to include some threat transfer classes, it can be hard to maintain aggro.
On the other hand if there's someone in group constantly pulling additional mobs the tank did not pull, I will just kind of 'forget' to heal them and hope they get the point.

I think if you're doing more DPS than the tank then you deserve to get called out. This is a cooperative game, and if you're doing too much DPS then that just makes everyone else look bad, and you're depriving people of the opportunity to experience the Shattered lands content to its fullest. Sometimes you just need to slow down and smell the roses

any dps class that can potentially do "too much dps" has enough dehate to keep aggro off. Don't just blame dps for dpsing, tanks have a role too. hell 80% of pug tanks ive been with dont even know mobs have a frontal, or mobs hitting you from behind is no bueno. that said some mobs do mem-wipe and people dont realize, so pick your battles with that one.

I also suspect a lot of tanks don't understand how ripostes work. The last point is mostly a thing in N2. Are there any other dungeon trash/bosses (in T5) that memwipe/blur? I can't think of any offhand, but maybe there is.

Yes, you say something to them, because they are getting you wiped. Aggro management is everybody's job. The DPS needs to WAIT until the tank has both hit and taunted the mob.

The DPS should direct target the mob so you can see how much aggro you have, and use whatever methods of de-aggro you have available to you if your aggro starts getting up around the 50% mark. On TLE, you won't have all the deaggro tools that a Live player will, but you can use attacks that don't hit as hard for a bit. Or stop hitting the mob at all.

If the mob comes and eats your face, that's generally not the tank's fault, it's the DPS fault for failing to dump aggro.

My current main is a warlock, and all those ticking DOTs doing nox damage can really add up. Once you get deaggros through the AA lines, you use them as part of your regular spell rotation. If you can get adorns (generally for your hands) that do negative hate gain, do that. If your coercer can put Peaceful Link on you, ask for it.

If you have a bozo DPS who keeps overnuking and then lying dead on the floor, remind them that dead does zero DPS.

If you gank aggro in raids, you are likely to cause the raid mob to spin and frontal not just you, but the whole rest of the raid, which makes the other 23 people very cranky. Learn aggro control early.

i've never had issues with ripping aggro in a group where everyone is focusing fire on the same mob / targeting through the tank, even with insane DPS. maybe your tank just isn't pressing the taunt buttons? or is accidentally in offensive stance?

Why are you quoting a post from a completely different thread with a totally contrary topic?

My hot take on this.

This isn't a competitive game by nature. It's a PVE co- op game. You can personally turn it into a competition but keep that to yourself and knowing you have great DPS. Don't force any kind of toxic "tank better" mentality on your teammates. Especially strangers, Good chance you'll be the one kicked from the group if it's a pug honestly. Sometimes it's not a pug and sometimes several of them could be friends and then you just tried to "out" one of their lesser talented friends etc. You don't know.

We don't know why someone could have such high DPS, maybe they just have really good gear, Maybe they have another sort of stat bonus. Maybe they are the best at their class. Maybe they have nothing IRL. You could shut down someone's fun fast and set a bad group mood.

It's a recipe for disaster when you point out high ACT parses of someone. Tread extremely lightly on that road. FFXIV bans this behavior for a reason, Because it can indeed breed casual toxic atmospheres. Hopefully more MMORPG's adopt this. Which I think they are. Your intentions might seem pure and wanting to help the group. But you also said it was for competition. So. That's an entirely different mood.

THE only time you should ever mention a parse or ACT, is if it's a raid and if you're not passing DPS checks on something in specific then you can kind of politely start going over DPS and what needs to be improved on to pass a raid check.

There is no situation that calls for ACT or parses or calling people out on too much DPS etc. Outside of Raid specific DPS checks.
Which it doesn't sound like you're talking about raids since, Raid leaders would handle this anyways and you wouldn't be posting here.

I know it can be frustrating people aren't "as good" as you but their just there for enjoyment too man.
I've seen people get kicked out often from dungeon groups, because they would bring up a parse and the conversations would take a bad turn, then our groups would get lop sided. Seen tanks and healers get kicked mostly for bringing up DPS parses ironically. Leaving groups messed up for both sides. I've never been called out or kicked but It still effects me when our group gets all messed up and people leave or get kicked.

It's cringe just like this entire post I'm making.

ACT Parses are for personal use to help gauge your own performance and help identify and spot critical DPS checks so raids can find where to improve on.

Other post's here are saying " Yeah kick them if their DPS is too high" in a nut shell. Up to you if you wanna be that rude guy everyone on the server avoids for groups. /shrug.

Would rather have a fun group then no group yeah?

Or just make your own group, advertise you're looking for average DPS players and avoid the whole situation.

I'd disagree. DPS should be doing more damage than the tank since damage isn't the primary job of the tank. The problem is pulling agro while you're doing it which is more down to lousy timing, bad targeting or positioning and not using the deagro abilities you may have correctly. I've known plenty of DPS that can pile on the damage without pulling agro off a tank. Of course it does help of your tank knows where his taunt buttons are. I've known plenty of those that don't too!

Players contributing too much are taking advantage of everyone else in the group... People like this need to be called out. How aggressively you call them out can be based on a number of factors, but allowing them to continue to take advantage of people should not be an option.

Edit: To reiterate, from the perspective of a healer or tank; if those 2 roles gave the same attention as an elitist DPS, the party wouldn't work. DPS classes should be putting in the same or less effort as the tank or healer; otherwise they are probably selfish, greedy people in game and irl, and deserve to be called out. If you're going into Nektropos 2, Icy Dig or a a raid wearing level 50 raid gear and all master spells because you took the time to gear your character properly, without a care... and now expect other people to speed through dungeons at lightning pace... you are a horrible person and you deserve to be told so.

In FFXIV they will ban you for toxic behavior if you're using parses to include others. My feeling on the matter is that if you're the kind of person who cares about parses, you should build your group around that fact so that you're not shanghaiing others who care about that. As 1/6th of the group, you've got just as much right to decide how the group will function as the mega parser. If you're PUGing it, you get what you get so don't throw a fit. If you're building your group, then you should be a little more picky. And eventually, if you're likeable enough, you may form a group of friends with whom you know will always be "off."

Otherwise, you're at the mercy of the world.

If they're in your guild, you talk to them; if not, you don't say anything unless they are noticeably actively pressing buttons.

I have seen people level 50 in full raid gear in CT trying to find groups and in PUG groups. At some point, it's just selfish to join a group like that. Sure, maybe the first few days the people that flew to 50 would do that in their attempts to show off or whatever, but we're over a month in and most people at this point are alts looking for an easy zonewide parse to show off.

Ultimately if it's an XP group and it's not entertaining or slow enough for your tastes, politely leave. Getting sour about it or tearing people down just spreads the misery and gives you a bad reputation. If you aren't having fun, don't play. If you want to be helpful, then talk to people privately and be prepared for a positive or negative response to your advice.

what an absolutely nutty take. that's like saying as a healer you should only barely keep people alive, if you instead keep everyone's health greened then you're showing off and you need to stop healing so much or you're being toxic. if someone in your group is excelling at their class role, that's a good thing, it's a positive contribution to the overall group. if you're so insecure that you feel the need to kick someone from your group for being "too good" then you're the one who's being toxic. imagine thinking putting in more effort and helping people clear stuff faster and more efficiently is being "greedy".

i do agree that simply being really good doesn't permit you to act elitist/rude towards "average" players in a PUG environment, but c'mon now. taking the opposite extreme position is just as absurd. it's group content, come get your quest updates and loot, and quit worrying about how good or bad the DPS is performing if the mobs are dying.

You're right Beneeto. I assume this thread is mostly sarcasm. Like Mountbatten's comment: "Players contributing too much are taking advantage of everyone else in the group... People like this need to be called out." We need some good humor now and then, and this thread has delivered.

I hate when I'm playing my dirge and I continuously pull aggro off of the tank Shadowknight. I even put the hate buff on him but like.. idk. I know we're a tier 1 DPS and all it's just like, tank better I guess? I don't know. I feel like i shouldn't tone down my Dirge damage just because you can't hold aggro. /shrug

guess i got baited then, but i've seen some pretty terrible ideas presented in earnest on these forums, so who knows

Do as much DPS as you can and use your de-aggros when you need it. ALWAYS do max DPS that you can do, every thing flows better but if you are getting killed because of it, find a new group.[/quote]