Let's talk Beta, Communication and

Discussion in 'Test Server Forum' started by Kazooooooooooo, Feb 10, 2019.

  1. Kazooooooooooo Active Member

    Hey guys, creating this thread for a number of reasons. The first being so I can compile and maintain a list of things that need to be fixed. Second, I'd like to discuss our communication with the dev's or lack there of and finally I want to briefly discuss the vision of the server and maybe anything else that pops into my head.

    BETA

    So now that Beta has been live for about a week I think it's time we discuss glaring issues that are going to affect the population and in turn the longevity of the server. DBG going into beta has done a lot of things well but there are some overlying issues that we need to address and hopefully(fingers crossed on this one) we can get some Dev posts and really begin a proper discussion, involving both sides.

    The two largest and most demanding issues are XP gain and itemization. Crafting and PvE are essential to a lasting and possibly growing server. Currently PvE XP and Crafting XP are both way too low. Leveling should not feel like a chore. The PvP XP increase is awesome, but due to the lack of interest in other aspects of the game all players are being forced to only PvP to progress their characters in an MMORPG, a game driven by character progression. This mistake was made on OG Nagafen when they began to separate gear. Separating the two means separating two player bases until they quit.
    Ideal fix- Nerf PvP xp a bit more, increase PvE xp and crafting XP.

    Loot needs to be overhauled. Quest lines in most zones need some loving so they are upgrades and open instance dungeons need the same. One could argue loot drops need to be increased across the board. Due to only having primary stats any class can essentially use the same gear and are going to be fighting over it, especially jewelry, to compensate loot drops should be increased but only slightly.

    With these two changes in place, XP & Loot revamp, we would have a solid core that I believe could genuinely maintain a population.

    Developer Communication

    This one really irks me. We need some Dev communication the forums and this isn't about killing DBG for communication or game play issues in the past but rather looking towards the future and how the communication between players and devs is not only important but necessary.

    Currently there is very little to no communication. Patches are made at night that tell us that changes were made but not what the changes were. This needs to be corrected. An important thing to note here is the numbers being changed are irrelevant to us but we need to know how they're being changed. Is this spell being buffed, nerfed, adjusted? However the biggest issue involving communication currently is that we as players do not know your vision for BETA or the eventual event server. We know the team is small and some idealistic changes may be out of reach as well.

    Talk to us and this is mostly directed towards the devs(Looking at you Kander). What is your vision for the server? I'm a large proponent of EQ2 being a PvE game with PvP enabled. Do you feel the same? Some changes and issues feel like they're just something that exists on beta for the ease of testing. For example Knubbed's respawn timer is far too low. I've been informed its close to 30 minutes when all x2's need to be on a 1-3 respawn and x4s on a 3-5. Or is spawn time drastically shortened for beta? So many questions and no answers... yet!

    There are of course a number of class issues, faction issues with guild and trading but all of them pale in comparison to what I've briefly discussed here. I'd love to hear everyone's thoughts or concerns on the matter as well as any other issues you might have in hopes facilitating a productive conversation instead of just killing DBG and getting nowhere.
  2. Freddie_Mercury Member

    lol nerf PVP xp, spoken like a true PVE'r... this is the first time in a decade I have seen this many people out PVP'ng... and its because its not an endless grind to level up by doing so..

    You want to go kill mice in a cave and level up, fine by me... is it too low? I don't effing know... I came to PVP not kill 14 different species of rats and birds for a quest... been there done that for many countless hours/days/months/years.... if you say it is really bad... I don't disagree... but there is no need to nerf PVP xp because you feel that PVE xp is too low...
  3. Fleshdecay Well-Known Member

    Nah, you missed the point. Typical for a casual who isn't too familiar with pvp. If it's pvp only and there is no reward for pvp only besides just exp, then you have 30's running around in level 10 gear who can't go out and actually play the game because even con mobs will dumpster them. Sure I had fun too, running around solo and finding a lot of pvp but it wasn't everywhere, its the same 3 or 4 lowbie zones. Natural pvp is best, where there is incentive to pve in order to progress your character and pvp follows.
  4. Kazooooooooooo Active Member

    I'm as hardcore as they come I promise you. I played on venekor when PvP launched with KoS and I switched to Nagafen during EoF. I was 2nd on the leaderboard for kills on DT, I ******* love this game. You shouldn't have to quest but the gear should be rewarding enough for the casual solo player. Currently there is no progression from having no gear to grinding upper level open dungeons. There should be some type of progression. I'm advocating to nerf PvP slightly down a couple of percent but buff XP from quests, mobs etc. You want to have players to kill don't you? Well that means you need enemies. To have enemies they need have to have something to do like progressing their characters? How do you progress a character? Through levels and gear! If you're missing those two things people are going to sit in Q harbor or just remake t2 characters over and over because its the only pvp you'll get.

    Next please.
  5. Gankednshanked Active Member

    Agree with just about everything in the OP.

    Just a side thought on the remaking characters issue - that will not occur on live. I'm sure not going to pay an additional $15/m to play alts, and that's per alt. I'm willing to bet 99% of the players here will only be playing 1 character, and people will slowly but surely reach end-game for each expac on that character.
    Uwkete-of-Crushbone likes this.
  6. Kazooooooooooo Active Member

    Bump cause I think this is important :)
    Uwkete-of-Crushbone likes this.
  7. Ozyr New Member

    As do I. Any official word on the direction/vision would do wonders for me. I'm just sitting here deciding if this is going to be something to sub over or not get involved. These are critical questions.

    Thanks for making the post. It's needed.
    Uwkete-of-Crushbone likes this.
  8. Kazooooooooooo Active Member

    Hey, I appreciate that! Thanks! I've heard that Kander said they will be working on itemization from contesteds. I'm not sure if that means max level raid mobs or all contested nameds. Why this information is being posted in the revolving door that is discord and not here is beyond me. Please tell your friends and other players to check forums and leave feedback! It's important!

    Have a nice day! :)
    Uwkete-of-Crushbone likes this.
  9. Zenji Well-Known Member


    I think the communication between Devs and Players has been better this Beta then I have seen in many years.

    I agree an overview of what the Dev team wants to see from the server would go a long way.
    Uwkete-of-Crushbone likes this.
  10. Davito Active Member

    Something to note, is that the threads are read (for the most part) by the devs. But I think Caith said it best in discord yesterday. Would you rather him be responding to stuff like this and one off requests, or have him working to make the server better? He is one dude working on all of it. Him and Kander respond to the official discord as much as possible and are pretty transparent there.

    Not saying more responses wouldn't be nice, but just feedbacking issues and providing solutions with real data into a concise post will net you far far more than a post like this. Noone at DBG will read that entire post and respond to all of your questions. It isn't worth their time since all of this has been said to them 500 times over.

    Edit: Additionally, literally everything in the OP has been fixed or addressed in the last few days.
  11. Uwkete-of-Crushbone Well-Known Member

    Would it help to have an entirely separate sub-forum for the new Nagafen? The way Test has its own, Norrathian Homeshow has its own, etc. That way, no one will have to do much hunting among the Test posts, either player or dev, in order to quickly find what they're looking for. :)

    Though I don't recommend burying it way down at the bottom of the forums list; that would send the wrong kind of message. :(

    Uwk
    Breanna likes this.
  12. Kazooooooooooo Active Member

    Believe it or not we have a community manager whos job it is to manage the community and keep us informed as to what changes, thought processes are happening. Where the **** she is in all this? The communication issue falls on every single one of them. Compile a list of changes you're making and paste it directly onto the forums is all we're asking. A general direction of where they want to go would be even better.
  13. Siren Well-Known Member

    I wonder how Daybreak would feel if only those who use Discord were informed enough about Nagafen to pay for it after launch.

    Not to mention that many players here claim they have been instantly perma-banned with an iron fist for even the most innocuous questions there.

    How many potential subscribers to Nagafen does that really leave?

    .
    Uwkete-of-Crushbone and Kheldar like this.
  14. Zenji Well-Known Member


    They post the basic information and changes about the server here on the forums. If you want more information you go to discord. Stop acting like using Discord to get more information is a unorthodox. Lots of developers for many different gaming companies communicate more on Discord then on the forums.

    I wonder how lazy the players are that can't be bothered to hop on discord to get information. It takes less time to hop on Discord then it does to post on the forums complaining about the Devs sharing info on Discord instead of the forums.

    Yes the banning on the official discord does seem to happen too easily and too often.
  15. Siren Well-Known Member


    From what people say, their IPs are instantly banned, too. It's not like they can roll new accounts and get back in there. Even if players from these forums haven't been over there yet, why would they bother, with moderation like that? Players' time is worth something, too.
  16. Schmetterling Well-Known Member

    I have a Discord account and go there to read up on things
    Zenji , what if I say are the Devs to lazy to post things on the Forum ? the sight created for this purpose ?
    I don't think so because I have seen them work closely with people on the Forum , they do read this posts here
    and they post their updates on Discord :confused:.Maybe that's why they don't want people to ask questions on discord
    but getting banned for doing so:eek: hmm weird.
    Anyway isn't there an official threat for the Nagafen Beta already on this forum ?
    Uwkete-of-Crushbone likes this.
  17. Zenji Well-Known Member


    I have personally been banned from the discord 4-5 times, none have been "IP bans". I make a new account and go back. So no, they are not dishing out IP bans for no reason.

    I agreed they are heavy handed with bans there. What I don't agree with is people thinking that all communication must go through the forums, that is ridiculous. No gaming company does, they use social media, discord, twitch, youtube, etc. Not all information from those other sources gets duplicated to the forums. This has been happening for years, get over it.
    Davito likes this.
  18. Zenji Well-Known Member


    IF you feel the need to get every morsel of information available, then you need to go seek it out. Not everything is going to go through the forums. This is not just a DBG thing, everyone does it.

    They do not ban just because someone asked a question, it is because of the context of the question. I agree they are quick to ban and I have personally been banned there more than once. Yes some information overlaps from posts on the forums and said on discord, no one is arguing that.

    No Nagafen forum yet. They are probably waiting to see if the server will make it out of Beta before giving it a Forum section.
  19. Schmetterling Well-Known Member

    the tread is in the test forum correct , but it was started by Caith and it's called "Nagafen PvP Beta"
    All I know is , that the Devs do read the forum posts and ok they do respond to us .
    I guess the information you can get on Discord is of different nature than what you can find on the forum.
    On Discord you can find new stuff and things that will come toa server near you, wile on the forums we can discuss things and Devs work with use here too on how improve on things we already have.
  20. Kazooooooooooo Active Member

    You misunderstood. The goal is to have the devs post a list of their changes on the forums like they do now but accurately indicating whether its been a nerf or buff. The other portion is revolving the overall direction of Nagafen 2.0 and a conversation like that can not be held on discord. Official things should never only be posted in discord and I don't think I need to be explained why. Did you know we have a community manager whose job it is to manage the community? Cause I sure as heck considering since she's never once engaged with us here. I'd kill to have that gig since doing nothing seems to be the #1 requirement and lord knows I'm absolutely phenomenal at that. I wonder if they even know there is currently a PvP beta going on