The watcher situation on deathtoll( and I can only assume how bad it might be on stormhold) is sad. Everywhere I go, there is a few level 1 grey cons standing around waiting for something to spawn. ( basically someone who wants to keep their fame/kdr makes a level 1 toon to scout a named, or a contested) All guilds on deathtoll do this ( including my own) and to be honest it makes this game look cheap. I think it would be best for the game if higher tier zones had level requirements. That way if someone wanted to check a spawn, they would have to do it on a character that was within level range of the zone and would have to be willing to be in open world to find out if their spawn was up. The whole idea of watching a spawn can be part of the pvp experience if we did something like this. Every time I go to CT, I see 2-3 level 1 toons all facing venekors spot. Every time I go to Permafrost, or EF I see the same at raid spots there. What incentive to pvp is there in a contested loot based system, when all we need to do is have a level 1 parked at every contested mob!? This isnt conducive to open world pvp at all. Giving these zones a level requirement would pretty much force a guilds members to be the watchers. It would force guilds to have to be out and about more, instead of this coward level 1 proxy madness. We know from the past, if there is a method to avoid pvp, the players will use it. This is something that can be changed, that will in result force more pvp to happen. EDIT: I am mostly speaking for PVP here, but if the same is true for PVE, please speak up in this thread so others can understand the situation there.
Absolutely /agree...but I wished they would use an alternate solution of making toons that are X below a zones range to become carnage flagged. Combine that with, when you die your screen is blacked out except for the revive window, at least after a certain amount of time...to prevent dead spies. I think if you can get a spy somewhere, you should be able to spy...the problem is that spies should also be able to be killed, and when dead, they should be useless.
I was just going to add something about people scouting after death/as corpses!. I think that after being dead your screen should go black.
A lot of the zones did used to have a level requirement. I believe EL and Zek you could only get into at 28 if you had done the access quest, or you got auto-access at 30 or 32 (don't remember exactly). Tradeskill level counted for that. I think Feerrott, Lavastorm and Everfrost were 38 for the access quest and 40/42 for auto-access via levels. Honestly? I kinda hoped that'd come back with the TLE servers. It would've solved your problems on the PvP servers (while allowing harvesters to get access to the zones if they've been crafting) and given back the classic feel.
I think this is a great idea for a pvp server. If you haven't done the access, you can't go. This encourages grouping, which discourages ganking. For those that are low level adventurer and high level crafter - there could maybe be an alternative access quest that also means you need to have crafted to that level to go there, too. No level 1's in high level zones. I agree - that's cheap.
it is cheap, and I dont think there is any plans to change this form of play. I want everyone reading this thread that likes pvp to think about how much more fun it would be if you had to actually scout on a higher level toon instead of parking these scoutbots in the zone. IT would allow contested to be available more often because it would be harder to scout giving smaller, and newer guilds a chance at contesting it. Please support this thread in hopes of some change.
[Deathtoll] This is another example of folks purposefully using mechanics in an unintended fashion to circumvent PvP. I don't understand why people wanted to play here, but they do everything in their power to avoid PvP. Harvesting on low level toons, poop socking, effin with faction, requesting more guards in cities, etc. Could the screen go black when you die? Could the end tier zones be unlimited PvP range? Minimum level requirements?
Deathtoll has many problems. I am new to Deathtoll and I already see too many safety features. Having DLW and Frostfang as city PvP was a huge letdown. Aswell as ruins and caves. They shouldn't be city PvP! It ruins low lvl PvP. On topic : Yes to min lvl requirements in zones higher then T3!
I agree, i think its BS. I get that you need to hide and gear up and have ways to strengthen your toon, but I think alot of the things people do to avoid pvp is crossing the line. If all you do is avoid pvp untill you have an absolute win on your hands, you shouldnt be playing on deathtoll. I dont even mind poop socking, if someone is willing to sit on a mob forever they should get it. They just shouldnt be able to poop sock it with a level 1 non attackable toon. The great thing about deathtoll is there could be a remedy for poop socking or people trying to lock down a camp. that remedy is and should always be pvp. But this level 1 watcher nonsense negates that opportunity for fair play. I dont know what they could do to obscure the view of a player untill they revived, maybe there is something that is possible because I think it would be a great idea for pvp. I am pretty sure they can make zones with no level range as well. Which will partially solve the problem. I think the level requirement will disourage people from putting watchers, but some will level toons up and park them still. After that we would need FFA pvp, that way any watcher can be taken down. I am glad to see that this problem has some weight to it, please keep this thread alive by discussing it and posting your opinions on it, and hopefully a GM/dev will pop in and talk with us about it.
This is a great idea. If not for classic, then for DoF and beyond. Make these zones have level requirements, at least on Deathtoll. It would surely benefit the contested aspect of the game.
[Deathtoll - all my opinions are about PvP. I do not know anything about the mechanics of PvE except that PvE is != PvP in any way) Even with the unlimited PvP idea the player could still sit there dead, move the revive window outta the way, and watch the spawn. Their screen would need to be obscured in some way. Suggested Fixes Unlimited PvP range in the end tier zones. (then set to 8 level when xPacs are voted in) Obscure the view of a dead player.
This is an issue we've had on the pvp servers since launch of pvp. We always used to joke that the devs should implement the /towel feature, basically it can be used on anyone who is dead, it would just black out their screen and combat logs (basically the same thing that ardur said). Then of course allow no pvp range limit in max level zones so that lvl 1s cant just roll around as they please. Lastly I really like the idea of an anti zerg mechanic where every time you die your respawn timer exponentially increases. Which ofc will reset after you stop zerging something. Obviously none of this will ever be added but you know, a brotha can dream cant he?
What ever happened to the "classic".. "nostalgia" ... everyone was hollering for that and now we want to change that too???.. Little toons could go wherever , with the exception of maybe certain raid zones that had level restriction.. but overland zones.. NEVER. Leave that alone. I hope DBG keeps the original spirit of the game and not start listening to people whine about the little stuff. Who cares if people "spy". Always been there.
because its more than spying. Its a way for every guild to keep watch on contested mobs, so if you dont know about it (which some guilds possibly dont) You wont get the mob. Also it pretty much makes it so only those people with the watchers contest the mobs. If people couldnt park watchers on a contested mob, and had to bring their level appropriate character to scout the mob, there would be a higher chance of PVP happening. There would be a larger amount of contesting for these mobs on PVE as well. Just because something bad has always been a part of something, doesnt mean it must continue. Might I add there was a time where people thought the same about slavery, and women voting. Thats the way it was so no one did anything about it for so long until logic caught up with them.
OK. But it still seems like its just part of the PVP world. Sabotage. The risks of being on a PVP server.
Yeah, I agree with OP. Also, the teleport to Splitpaw needs be removed from the game. It allows fast travel, which is stupid. If someone wants to get to a dungeon, they need to travel there in the world, which allows for more people in the world and potential PvP.
