New Guild Halls...too expensive

Discussion in 'General Gameplay Discussion' started by Vunder, Jun 14, 2016.

  1. starbuck Member

    Correct and the pricing speaks to how desperate for funds DBG is. This is a 12 year old game and as one of the original Beta testers for it the price gouging that they are doing is just sad. I love the game but there is just a point where they cross the line. Smed wouldn't have gone this far. This and the fact that they are shutting down LoN speaks to the eventual fate of the franchise. This time they might not recover if they don't do some major damage control.
    Belenos, Prissetta, Ishuna and 4 others like this.
  2. Arielle Nightshade Well-Known Member


    Instead of putting lipstick on the pig, fix the pig, is my thought.

    If you don't have any data to discern your player base, get some. Use it. Instead of flailing around trying this thing or that thing hoping that this time you got the golden ticket and the player base will shell out a ton of money, get some serious data to learn what that is. Or if you don't have the budget for that - ask. Ask seriously, not a faux poll thoughtlessly designed that leaves you even more confused than when you first published it.

    It feels to me like decisions are made with the idea that the player base is all 18-30 year old males, with a small contingent of old ladies that decorate houses. The old house-decorating ladies don't care what the raid zones look like, either. The males don't care what the content is as long as it's scantily clad and has breasts. I can think of absolutely no other reason for the total disdain we often feel from the DBG staff.
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  3. moters New Member

    If they really want to make money on this game instead of overpriced guild halls etc. Make people want to play the game add content improve the game make starting the game fun etc. People will spend plenty if it is fun and support the game by buying stuff and subbing etc. How many want to support a game with a $ 400 fluff item? Not as many I would bet.
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  4. Griffon Lady Well-Known Member


    Erm... a diamond tiara has diamonds on it.... o.0 You know those are rare, right? And that a GH is just instantly copied when another is bought? (also, you can't copy paste a diamond, you have to dig for them or make zirconium.)
    Here, I'm helping you. Price Gouging nothing there about "essential/necessary goods". If you are going to add your own "fixes" to definitions, you kind of weaken your position. There is an emphasis on "during states of emergency", but not necessarily items that are needed. It's only illegal when it's a necessity or essential. No one here is accusing DBG of doing anything illegal, just unethical.

    So you see no correlations between huge prices deterring people from wanting to join the game? You haven't noticed the declining population? Or maybe you missed the bout of games being closed (EQN never got to see the light of day), or all the layoffs? Or that SOE (re-named DBG) was bought by a company that specialises in investments, not in technology or entertainment?
    Do you see any correlations between raising the price to $400 on something copy pasted and what the owners of the company will want more of? Particularly when an equivalent item was previously selling for about $14.00?
    Will this game survive if it's pricing is done on a purely profit-to-rescources used business model? Not bloody likely mate. It'll be down to a handful of whales, then they'll migrate and the game will join the rest of SOE's offspring in the graveyard.



    There are still guild halls available for the plat and status we get in game. FTP players can even get them for nothing more than time spent. If you want something a bit fancier, you can buy a prestige home for $14.00 (a bit less, but I forgot the exact change XD)
    They are trying out whale items,that's all. I just hope they listen and do not continue making insanely high prices. It's like the broker. There is always someone that has an item that costs 1000 plat when the average price is 1plat. No logical reason, just optimistic (or attempting to keep people from buying it so they can see it from another account by searching that character's shop out. I myself have max priced items as a "showcase" in a themed house).

    The biggest problem with this gimmick is how people will use the tickets as ways to buy plat. I have no problem with people paying into the game for in-game currency, but the end result will be "sold" $400 items, which will appear to the owners of the company as a great new way to make money. Nothing more than that.
    Items have been re-priced in the past (research reducers), so what will stop them from raising prices on everything else? Every one that plays MUST be rich, right? Since people are buying an item that brings in $400? They could have gotten the same result making DBC brokered and never having produced a $400 guild hall, but the tickets sole purpose will be one of two grossly overpriced items, so those items will have the false positive that push the idea of over priced items being a "good" idea.

    Well, the owners of DBG are. Unfortunately, they can dismantle the company and sell it for parts if they feel like it, I'm guessing. Why it's such a tremendous worry that the false positive on $400 digital items could be so disasterous. They can pressure DBG to do it more. And if copypasted $400 items allow them to do some layoffs and make even more profit, that's what they'll do. /..\

    Rich kids think that is earning. >.> Sad, isn't it? Like how a certain "self made" man got a "small" loan of a million dollars. It's a matter of perspective. If some people have the perspective that money is that stuff they have an unlimited supply of, they won't side with people who don't want everything to start getting expensive. (I have a sneaking suspicion those type of people actually want to starve out the poor players so they have their own private online country club. Maybe they have a severe case of affluenza?)
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  5. Griffon Lady Well-Known Member

    They do. ^_^ They are working on an expansion right now, and since their time is consumed there, they made a "Race to Trakanon" ... which every one that posts has something negative to say about. o.0
    They aren't even selling XP potions there... an actual level playing field for the race. After charging $350 or $400 for the new guild halls, I was extremely (and pleasantly!) surprised that they did not make it remotely pay to win. 0.o Most admirable thing I've seen in my years of gaming, market wise. (Well, maybe next to FF14 re-making their game and going to the trouble of "keeping" all the progress the people who stuck out the first version had gotten. I'd love to see EQ2 re-done so it utilises the graphics card more than the CPU, but wayyy too much resources would be required.)

    The complaining about eeeeevery thing is what weakens our chances of being heard on the point of the price of these new guild halls. People complain about free stuff like it's a red hot poker in their bumm. (remember how upset people were that one NOTD, when the Devs sent us free items in the mail and people were upset they weren't unlimited charges? /shakes head) But then something like these guild halls happen and we're already not being taken seriously.

    If those people saved their "ammunition" for battles more like this, maybe they'd be more likely to listen. /..\

    I agree. Bring in more money by making the game more alluring, not with huge price tags that scare potential players away.
    (Anyone notice that Second Life's population died off when the stories of people paying IRL amount prices on in-game realestate? o.0 Funny, that... the only time you even hear about Second Life these days is when people are telling on-line gaming shock and horror stories. XD)
  6. Arielle Nightshade Well-Known Member

    Your post is very thoughtful and well said, but this remark stuck out.

    Why do I have to save ammunition to battle the people that work on a hobby/product I use? Why am I not a treasured resource and why aren't they doing everything they can to make me delighted that my money is well spent? Not me individually, 'me' generically...a player. Why is my input (overall) looked at as worthless?

    We've all seen that the Customer is NOT always right. I'm not remotely asking for that climate. I have tried to fight for at least reason, but have been criticized and most recently enjoyed a 7 day vacation for being critical.

    If you look at my posts, I have a long history of being twinkly, friendly and helpful. I have absolutely no problem sharing tricks or information I have about the classes I play and have only hoped to be useful. I only started getting negative when this game became very difficult to play due to what I, as a player, feel were really bad decisions. But I'm not going to do it a whole lot more. If people like me stop posting 'negativity', you will be left with either no feedback, or the very false 'everything is JUST FINE'.

    I don't want anyone to jump when I say jump, but you have to admit this is ridiculous.
    Belenos, Merriel, Prissetta and 8 others like this.
  7. Xantarr New Member

    Can we please just get one thing straight, namely that charging $400 for a guild hall has nothing to do with "greed"? If they end up losing players or not selling very many guild halls due to the price tag it's very likely that they would lose money compared to charging a lower price. Higher price does not mean they make more money. So it's not "greedy," it's just a price point that's too high.
    Belenos, suka and Griffon Lady like this.
  8. Torvaldr Well-Known Member

    My kingdom for an 'awesome' button.

    Seriously the last two posts you made in this thread hit the nail on the head. And I do remember you being friendly. I had a different forum name under the old forums, but about 8 years ago or so you helped a baby fae warden get his feet on the ground. I have never forgotten that.

    Unfortunately I think an honest healthy discussion between players is unlikely because, as a community, I think we're fractured and fragmented and not united. Between the staff and the players is unlikely because after the acquisition the environment for open communication seems stifled. More thoughts on that will be left unsaid.
    starbuck, Merriel, suka and 3 others like this.
  9. Griffon Lady Well-Known Member


    I'm not saying it's worthless at all, and it realllllly irritates me when people put words in my mouth in an attempt to start something. Feel free to private message me.

    Now, to give an example of what I was saying, imagine you are in a crowd. If everyone is loudly complaining about the free water bottles that were handed to them, how will anyone hear you say you need to go to the bathroom? (AKA, if everyone is complaining that free items aren't unlimited charges, the temporary event server is bad bad bad, everything should be free, how is DBG going to not tune us out when we're telling them that $400 for something almost identical to a $14.00 houseing instance (or any future crazy prices) is a terrible idea?

    Incentives to subscribe. Good stuff!
    Veteran rewards were good. Nothing game breaking, pretty good variety regarding usefulness to different playstyles. (although cutting the one-per-character down to one-per-account ruffled my feathers a fair bit when it came to the Colony island house.)
    $14 for a house instance and $20 for a flying mount were fairly reasonable.
    Free stuff is AWESOME!!! (add up all the expansions, Dungeon maker, Adventure Packs, etc... that they literally GIVE away now!)
    And people complain about all that, and a loooooooot more.

    But then, from out of left field.... $400 for a house that has guild amenities.... and the potential of more similarly priced items down the road.... this warrants the outcry, but it might not hold the weight that it should. :\ (although, the threads that are more legit like the crazy pricing this thread is about do seem to hit 20+pages pretty fast, as opposed to threads about issues that are a bit more egocentric dying down pretty quick.)
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  10. starbuck Member

    Yeah they company completely changed for the worse when John left. The Gawker issue didn't help matters either.
    suka likes this.
  11. suka Well-Known Member

    ok my only problem with all of the arguments presented is this - i have played other games, i have seen other markets. the things that attract me to games are housing, crafting and gameplay. the things that keep me in a game is continuing change and adventure and having fun.

    at no time, when considering a game, do i ever consider their marketplace. if, after joining, i find their marketplace is full of fluff items way beyond my means, i simply don't buy.

    there is no way i would buy any house for $40, or a guild hall for $400, or even a mount for more than $10. but my income is limited and i don't begrudge those that can and do make those purchases. I just figure i am not their target market.

    when i am looking at a market, i look for cheap potions and vault space, and unlocks that will benefit me. house items and fluff come later when i am more invested in a game and i feel it fits my character, or my house, or i can make a bit of plat off it by putting it on the broker or auction or whatever the game has.

    so the argument that the guild hall price would in some way deter new players from trying the game doesn't hold water with me. people don't get attracted to a game for its marketplace. they also don't stick around for the marketplace.

    there are some games that i quit because everything i actually needed to enjoy the game was sold on the marketplace. the items weren't expensive, but every time i turned around something else i needed to progress in the game was a marketplace item. i am thankful we don't have that in this game. nothing on the marketplace is an absolute necessity.

    yes there are potions and other things that are helpful to us on the marketplace, but they are not an absolute necessity.
    Meneltel likes this.
  12. Tekka Well-Known Member



    I don't disagree with this, in general.

    I would note, however, that while there might not be items that are a necessity on the marketplace, there are a few things that many players regard as necessary that require a subscription in this game that don't require one in some others. And what was once a feature (all game content available to f2p players via expansion or dlc) is no longer the case as of the last game update.

    While a new player might not be looking to buy a house, or a guild hall, or anything at all from the marketplace, if they're giving the game a good go the savvy ones will have a look. And that kind of price tag might be one of the factors that causes them to look elsewhere.
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  13. suka Well-Known Member

    if that kind of price tag were on potions and things that some players would consider almost a necessity, then all i can say is that is one of the things people here are most concerned with. they are worried that the rising price levels might begin to extend to those items - consumables and service items.

    most other things are fluff and not what anyone needs. it is expected that there will be a few things that are on the high dollar end. that is in all games.

    however to say marketplace prices determine if a person stays or goes or even joins, that is not quite right and doesn't hold water.

    the concern that this is a trend that may extend to other items which players do want to buy like summon tokens and potions is a valid one and is the main thing people who are concerned with the price increases are worried about. i do notice the limitations put on those and that they have increased in price as other similar items have been put in the marketplace.

    the concern that all players don't have access to the marketplace is also valid. in most games, it is the microtransactions on the marketplace made by f2p members that drive the financial aspects of the game. limiting this to only all access members will be very detrimental to those aspects.

    it is stuff like that- the limiting of things to members only that bother me. even limiting the newest update to members only is not very inspiring. after all, if someone buys the expansion, they should have access to all of its updates.

    but then that is my view on it. it used to be in this company that we got what we paid for. now we are beginning to feel that we get less than we paid for and the exchange in value is beginning to shift and fall short on the weighing of the scales.
  14. Tekka Well-Known Member



    Oh no. Maybe I didn't express it clearly - marketplace prices won't likely determine if a person plays or not. What I mean is that if a game has a marketplace, the pricing and structure (as well as the cost of the currency) gives them an idea of where the game is, and the likely direction the company is taking it. The prices themselves might not ever be a factor, but the marketplace is one of the things that leaves an impression - good or bad.
  15. Castegyre Well-Known Member

    People don't really talk about this game outside of a few select places on the internet from what I've seen, and often when it is brought up it's as an afterthought or a footnote attached to EQ or SOE. EQ2 seems to be long overlooked by the masses. It's no surprise, really, the market is bloated and growing bigger all the time. I'm not going to bother checking, but I suspect it could be safely stated that there are more MMOs coming out this year than existed when this game was new. People aren't looking for a game that is a dozen years old and been poorly managed for the bulk of them when they have so many other new and shiny options out there to choose from.

    Cash shop and f2p models are a hot button topic, though. Wherever you look from reddit to 4chan to youtube to fan sights to places like MMORPG and on, you will find people dissecting the monetization of different games. In some cases, different games, developers, and publishers are vilified for these practices. While an individual might not check every item in the cash shop before deciding to try a game, if enough people notice practices like these guild halls and go screaming from the hill tops about their opinions of it, EQ2 might show up on more people's radar again. There's already a lot of animosity towards DB for things like the way people perceive H1Z1 and Next being handled. If people look further at some of the other practices going on like the new servers, LoN loot, etc, the game might get more attention than it wants. Not in a good way.
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  16. Griffon Lady Well-Known Member

    Those items might get their prices raised too if they think we like the idea of a $400 guild hall. :\
    Without people subscribing, higher prices will happen. FTP People do get all updates related to the expansion.
    There aren't many perks to being a subscriber, so there aren't many subscribers. Less need to subscribe = fewer subscribers = more of a scramble to get money out of people other ways, and in larger quantities of money for less work by the looks of things.
    In a perfect world, everything would be free. (unless it's the game Perfect world. there everything is gamble real money for gear that can explode and leave you with nothing.)
    I'm not saying "make subscriptions a must", but taking more perks away from subs isn't the way to go either. But 100s of dollars for a copy pasted zone is ridiculous.
    Belenos, Prissetta and Mizgamer62 like this.
  17. Praaji Member

    I read on MassivelyOP the other day people are paying up to $10,000 for ships in Star Citizen and it hasn't released yet. Welcome to the future of mmo gaming.
  18. Avahlynn Well-Known Member

    Massively ...Over Priced?
  19. Cyrrena Well-Known Member

    In 1999, people used to buy keeps and castles in UO for more than $2000, if they want it and have the money they will buy.

    Cyrrena
    suka likes this.
  20. starbuck Member

    Thats because Chris Roberts is a trusted developer and we gladly support him and Star Citizen. Even John Smedley has given support and that was before he left daybreak and before there even was a Daybreak it was still SOE. I backed SC before H1Z1 was even announced and have no regrets.