An Open Dialogue Regarding Forum Moderation

A system like this:
https://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/index.php?threads/feature-request-site.559560/
might help them not to miss something, alas that thread itself was overlooked.

This rationale is something we can understand and respect instead of 'no, won't happen.'

No one has actually told me that I have insulted them. I've been told that what I've said could be considered insulting, but that's it. I'm not sure why you would bring this up at this point other than to bait me. Whatever the reason, I'll give you a pass.

This is going to get technical, but since RadarX asked... Also I apologize for anyone who's head explodes after reading this.

Security Concerns

• Out-of-the-box, the XenForo forum software we're using allows custom avatars via Gravatar.com, a third party avatar hosting service, or through direct upload from your PC.
• Rather than repeatedly hitting Gravatar.com, XenForo periodically grabs the avatar image and stores it locally. In a roundabout way, you are uploading a file to SOE/DBG's server by using Gravatar.com.
• In the extremely unlikely event that Gravatar.com were hacked, there is a slight chance that someone could upload malformed image files to SOE/DBG servers. Very old unpatched browsers would serve these intentionally broken image files as malware.
• As for uploading your own avatar image, a forum user would directly upload an image file to SOE/DBG's forum server and that file would reside on their servers, to be served to users.
• This presents the equivalent security risk of any site that allows image uploads such as Photobucket, Flickr, Yahoo, or Imgur.
• I'll add that the XenForo software could be modified to use remotely-linked avatars. You would paste the link to your off-site avatar in a field somewhere, and the file would STAY on your own server, having no interaction with SOE/DBG's servers.

My Response:

• Forums have been allowing the upload of custom avatar images for over 15 years. Security breaches through an image upload have been rare and quickly patched through browser updates, Windows patches, and web server software updates. It's not significantly less secure than allowing the embedding of off-site images into forum posts or signatures, both of which are allowed.

Inappropriate Content Concerns

• Brasse (I realize she's not here to defend herself) expressed a concern that images of an abusive or illegal nature could be uploaded, leaving SOE liable.

My Response:

• An avatar image is very small, typically 100 x 100px.
• These forums allow the remote embedding of very large signature images (500 x unlimited). Despite being a target five times larger, to my knowledge, inappropriate signatures have not been a significant problem on SOE/DBG's forums. RadarX can correct me on that one.
• Signature images are remotely linked, meaning that SOE/DBG has no control over them. A trickster could setup a signature image that looks completely different based on whether the viewer is in San Diego, France, Taiwan, on a specific browser, on a specific OS, etc. I could make something that displays a rude message to the world, but something innocuous to DBG employees.
• The Communications Decency Act protects business and website owners from user-uploaded content that violates laws provided that the image is removed quickly after notification is provided.

TL;DR

• Custom avatars are relatively safe, relatively small, and provide a rather small target for abuse, whereas custom signatures are five times larger and people haven't abused them enough to warrant their removal.

And yes I did this same level of explanation in the SOE Community Council and in private chats with Community folks in 2012 when the new forums launched.

So wait they ask you to explain the concerns but your explanation shows there really is nothing to be concerned about.
So a player community member has more knowledge then the representative of the DBG team.
I rather see a solution then you should become a member of the DBG team.

I wish I could like this post a million times.

If people can post obnoxiously long signatures (sometimes so long, they are longer than their posts) and use annoying gifs, then I'm not sure I really empathize with the reason behind no custom avatars.

So, yeah, these forums aren't tolerable because we don;t have custom avatars.

Your sarcasm is noted. Now who's trolling?

It's simply pointing out a pattern with SoE/DBG. Promises are made, yet a large portion of them are not kept. We're kept in the dark as to the reasons why (and remember, we're dealing with a transparent company here....) and then when the reality finally comes to light, it's at the very least a poorly thought out reason. Feldon pointed out why no custom avatars when we can have custom sigs that are a lot bigger, more obnoxious, and have the potential of the very same security risk as custom avatars.

You might want to take off your white knight helm for a moment and look at the bigger picture and the reoccurring patterns here.

Edit: And a PS - If someone like me, who doesn't understand a lot of the stuff Feldon talks about because it is not my field of expertise, can understand what he wrote above, digest it, and see the absurdity of it, then surely everyone else (including DBG) can as well.

Congratulations you boiled down 18 pages of feedback to custom avatars.

So you accuse others of trolling and posting nonsense and yet this appears to be the real you.
You can not grasp one example of the DBG team and RadarX specifically giving false information.
It is that trend that has brought us to this point.

I don't believe I asked him to explain the concerns. I believe i said I had to check and make sure it was ok to discuss concerns and that he probably knew what they were. I'm aware of what they are and he did list at least one concern I know of.

What you are doing right now Nick is borderline trolling.

Folks let's dial back the back and forth please and remember the reason we are here which is to yell at me not each other.

No you clearly said he could make sstatments detailing your concerns meaning DBG.

He did make the very accurate statements detailing the Inaccurate concerns you and the DBG team Have.
My response to that is accurate that he seems more knowledgeable and should be a part of the DBG team since he clearly would be able to resolve the community concerns and issues in a constructive way.

We are after all looking for Solutions here.
Make someone with that knowledge part of the team is one solution.

That is not trolling in any way shape or form that is Open Transparent discussion about the issue and In one persons Opinion One solution that should be looked into.

Someone with that knowledge, doesn't work in my department and if Feldon wants to work in our Operations area I absolutely encourage him to apply.

Once again, I know what you are doing and I'm asking you to stop.

Stop Having an open and transparent discussion?
I thought that was what the thread was about.

Seriously I do not know what you Think i am doing other then participating in an open discussion on a forum that I am a rightful member of. You may be reading between the lines and making an assumption but I will express my opinion and I have not made any insults or derogatory comments so every thing I said fits within the guidelines.
Please feel free to PM me if you are reading something else into it and we can discuss it in private.

Yup, I cracked. The fact that people are caught up arguing about avatars at this point is kind of silly. Especially if RadarX is not the guy who is in charge of this kinda stuff.

Transparency is a buzzword that is about 95% meaningless. Trust me, I work for the government and they latch on to buzzwords like this and continue to filter the data they normally would. So yeah, we aren't going to be updated nearly as well or often as the team is going to be able to keep up with things. Yeah, it sucks that we don;t get the real skinny on things and when we do it isn't always right. But is it a conspiracy? I doubt it.

I need my white knight helmet to protect me from all of the drama llamas flailing about.

What he wrote above is pretty much what anyone should know about the intertubes and it's inner workings.

I boiled down the last 10 posts or whatever it was into something that was much easier to digest.

No, thank you.

kono

Yeah, we civil servants (especially the geologists) are very conniving people and should not be trusted under any circumstances.

Ok, all attacking aside and no more snarky remarks, here is what I would like to see.
1. Forget it, taken care of, the MODs are gone. (Sorry, sorry, couldn't help myself)
2. If I get banned, there needs to be a way for me to log on without access to the forums yet be able to read my messages that tell me exactly why I've been banned. Not sure I would need a way to PM you directly, although that would be a way for us to challenge an lose our challenge to our ban.
3. It being just you and one other person doing the moderation kind of takes away the feeling that some bans where based on a MODs arbitrary mood that day.
4. I never see a day that a new idea is posted by DBG that isn't going to be challenged by some members. If you don't remember the fights over SC, LoN, heck pick any topic, and I remember nearly all of them. I also earned a ban of some length on nearly all of them. That will continue because we too care about the game, and over the years the silence by SoE/DBG only added fuel to the flames.