Zephyr Named Need to be TONED DOWN

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Geko, May 21, 2019.

  1. BadPallyGuildLeader Augur

    I'm kind of wondered something here.... when people mention 9000 AC...you basically adding the mitigation number and the evasion number together? So like 6700/3000 from the inventory screen would be 10,000?

    I know magelo is something really crazy old school 27k ish plus AC for high end tanks, etc.
  2. BadPallyGuildLeader Augur

    I don't think casuals have those items and I think it's not melee spike damage that are killing them as much as the player not having a clue on how to deal with spell damage (plus the aforementioned "crutch" that slow belts afforded before the nerf)
  3. Conq Augur

    Not adding, just looking at the first number - i.e. 6700 in your example.
  4. Allayna Augur

    Tash item came out in Kunark, malo item 3 years ago, slow item in 2013, snare item is tradeable, so /baz or go back to velious, wouldn't expect casuals to be able to kill a level 50 mob....the cripple item is the only one from a raid and the raid is 6 years old.
  5. Mintalie Augur

    Other than promised, are there other heals that should be blocked to help mercs function better?
  6. Cicelee Augur

    I am going to create a thread asking for a boost to bard double and triple attack, but what I will really mean to say is to nerf monks. Because I apparently have the power!!!
  7. Allayna Augur

    I typically block hots and words, but one of my stuns is a hot and I can group heal...so I don’t want them spamming that slow stuff. I make them into spam heal only bots.

    And I have to remember to unblock some things for raids, hotkeys help.
  8. BadPallyGuildLeader Augur

    It's not a matter of "can kill" versus game knowledge of "Where to get." Plus it's more the mindset of "hey my belt does this for me"...or so they think.
  9. Conq Augur

    I've heard of people blocking cures from mercs, because they said the merc would cure before healing which resulted in rezing... But that's just heresay on my part since I don't use mercs. I just know when I group with my cleric and the tank has stuff blocked that I'm casting, I find another tank.
  10. Geko Journeyman

    Not really understanding why you would think that is funny ... a fully raid geared monk with 30k+ AA out tanking a group geared warrior with 15KAA? Is that so hard to believe?

    I wouldn't even say the game has the steep of a hill to climb ... I just cant remember any expansions prior to COTF where T2 fully geared warriors with current augs in almost every slot couldn't tank the T1 group named mobs without struggling? (when I say current augs I mean conflag + with several of the 70 and 80AC augs.)

    Played since 2000 (2002 on the warrior) and this is the first time I have ever gotten wrecked by group named like this ...

    With all that said - I believe if i move the shaman over to a secondary box and multibind + spam heal i can probably tank them.
  11. Peltier Lorekeeper

    Multiple things I've noticed since the thread started.

    1. Healer mercs both set the same stance - not smart. (same heals casted same time no overlap is why)
    2. Not properly utilizing the shaman's incredible healing abilities to their fullest ..
    3. A grp geared Hero'ed up toon with 15k AA I have a 110 war, and just maxing out their mitigation AA's alone would push that 15k upwards of 20k really fast ..
    4. You mentioned you played since 2000, Have you always played in new content with under AA'ed toon's?

    The fault lay with the player on this, not the content. It seem's you in a huge rush to try to do your own thing tried to side step TONS of work you STILL have left on that warrior.

    But rather then accept fault for not being ready for the content you want to box in. You would rather openly admit its too hard an the dev's need to tone it down rather then actually go put work in on your warrior alt that he NEEDS to be able to handle new content an live.

    This thread is why people ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS say "Play bedda" "Learn your class" an other such things. Because this CLEARLY is one of THOSE times.

    Hope you put the work in required for your warrior alt. Once they get all their required AA for tanking they are BEASTMODE!
  12. Belexes Augur

    I have an SK in the 6500 to 6900 AC range depending on buffs and tribute/trophies and I have no issues. I do have a good number of AAs. He is around 290k Hitpoints. I duo with a rogue and two healer mercs.

    I block the promised line of heal spells and the elixirs. I put one merc on reactive and another on balanced.

    The key is get them dead quick and that is what the rogue is for. :D
    Peltier likes this.
  13. Thrillho Augur

    You made it seem like the warrior and monk were a bit closer together in terms of gear / AAs.

    Clearly you understand the advantage that AAs bring. Why would you expect a severely under-AAed warrior to be suitable in current content? I don't know what the AA count for warriors is, but I would wager you're less than half of what the max is. You're not current with RoS, EoK, and probably not even TBM. If content should be adjusted, it should be done so from an evaluation of a character a bit more current. Do the Stratos named need to be adjusted? Maybe. Should they be dropped to such an amount so a tank from two expansions prior can tank it safely? Maybe not.

    Monks can perform quite well against named in multiple zones. Some take considerable effort, but it can be done. Outperforming a warrior for tanking? Not a chance.
    Belexes likes this.
  14. Geko Journeyman

    To answer Thrillho's and Petler's post:

    Yes, to show how under AA'd the characters have always been ...Total Spent is only 6131AA.
    Most of those spends went into Tanking AA (have Combat Stability / Combat Agility / Armor of Wisdom / Physical Enhancement / Shield Block ) All maxed.

    This however is the first expansion (mind you I didnt play RoS expansion ) that I have run into where I could not 3/4 box the T1 zones including named.

    My point was never to say my warrior is amazing ... my point was ... this is a Tier 1 zone. ANY tanking character that has /autogranted and gotten the highest bazaar gear (for the expansion in question - Conflag in this case) should be able to walk into a T1 zone and group / kill named to better themselves. I am not trying to run into the highest zone in the new expansion and kill it. I am literally wearing gear better than anything that drops in Zephyr ... I have better augs than drop in Zephry (Or I have the best ones that do drop such as Dour Blue and Jetsam) - I should be able to start bettering myself at the ground level ( tier 1 zones ) - I should in no way be forced to go backward 3 expansions to start moving forward.

    During POP you could do PoJustice with Group gear. During Gates you could do Natimbi with bazaar gear ... During Omens you could do WoS with bazaar gear. During DoDH I was doing the 68.1 / 69.x / 70.x DoDH spell missions for upgrades ... with bazaar gear... During TBS I was getting my solteris zone in ring with bazaar gear... skipping ahead ... durring HoT I farmed myself the best augs with .... bazaar gear / group gear ....... During ROF I was in Shards Landing with group gear.... All while slightly under AA'd ( never having max tanking passive AA like I do now )

    I am sure if all of you think back to your experiences with the expansions I listed above ... you will remember .... you were doing the tier 1 content without having max AA.

    My point was always ... Tier 1 is a starting place. Not the proving grounds.
  15. Vaeeldar Augur

    Ok I would love to see a group geared tank, particularly not a war (since some discs increase AC). I've got grouped geared sk/pal both with 40k+ aa so max and when I say group gear i mean every gmm/tbl group item at t3 + ros/eok rares (haven't finished tbl rares yet though). I've killed every TBL named so have no issue boxing it but even those chars hit 7700ac on the high side without bard song. my Raid gear warrior in full TBL raid gear maxes out at 9800 ac.

    SO somebody please explain to me how an sk/pal is hitting 9k ac in group?
  16. Allayna Augur

    My guess is they’re adding the ac/avoidance values together.
  17. Thrillho Augur

    It's Tier 1 and should be more introductory than anything else, I agree. But just because it's Tier 1 doesn't mean there shouldn't be a skill floor / AA floor / gear floor to be met before you're viable in it. That's not to say "you cannot do X until you do Y," that is to say "those who have done X still have a challenge in Y."

    If you're running at 90% each expansion, it will eventually catch up to you. 90% of 90% is 81%. Add another level, you're at 73%. It just gets worse and worse the less you do for each expansion.

    Earlier expansions are still viable. I regularly see people in EoK and RoS grinding out xp, gear/augs, and achievements. Playing in these expansions shouldn't be viewed as a punishment or an inadequacy.

    If you're not able to do tier 1 of current content, is it a fair assumption to say you haven't completed the higher tiered content in previous expansions? That content is still available for you to do, and although it may not be "new", it would still be new to you.

    There are going to be outliers on each end. There are players who can solo named, or even take on multiple named at the same time. Then there are players who can't handle a single named. Just as you wouldn't expect the devs to cater to someone who can handle 2 named at once, it's not reasonable to accommodate someone who gets flattened by 1. The bulk of the players should ideally land somewhere in the middle - named still providing a challenge, but are still fun to encounter.
  18. Geko Journeyman

    I can actually agree with some of what you are saying here ... but after 20 years we need to redefine the 90x90x90x90. especially considering this trend really didnt start until COTF. This game used to be more about surviving long drawn out fights (I remember grping the Mshas in Qvic and fighting them for 1.5 hours straight ) ... and has turned into .... can you take a 50k hit over and over and over. (It seems like Sony might have had their thought process a little more inline here.)

    I am not sure which server you are on ... but here on Tunare .... no 1 is ever in Zephyr grouping ... I think there is a reason for it. I think possibly it is just a little too hard for what the reward is.
  19. Natal Augur

    My point is that he doesn't need that extra AC, it is mostly fluff. It has a small effect, but not enough to make a significant difference in his survivability. Getting his AC to 9000 is not going to help him with his underlying problem. His issue has more to do with spell damage. Like I said, I am a raid tank, and buffed my AC is normally around 7.4k. I do fine and can tank everything in the game. Popping my AC spells does not really add much. What does matter is using the damage mitigation abilities of various descriptions at the appropriate time, staggering them out to ensure that incoming damage doesn't jump later in the fight due to everything having been used. So, technique and strategy. And as I said before, the big killer on nameds is not melee damage, it is spell damage spikes. Your AC means nothing for that.

    A better question would be what his spell/dot/melee mitigation percentages are (a group player should be able to get all three to at least 38% fairly easily if they are properly geared). And how many hp he has.
  20. Natal Augur

    You can change the type of spells they cast by setting them to efficient/balanced/reactive.

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