Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by IblisTheMage, Jul 3, 2018.
I say it all the time. "gee, this golem could stand to have 11 million MORE hit points."
No I don't.
Mob density is never tuned to allow for mobs to have double hit points. It puts you up against the clock to get past them even moreso than it does with half the hp. If you need to get past ten mobs with high hitpoints before repop, our dev team is not going to cut out half the mobs, they're just going to scale everything's hp up and leave the basepop the same. It's lazy tuning that they've done repeatedly in the past.
Why not just ban all third part software like [Unmentioned 3rd Party Software] and so on and this diskusjon goes away. Real groups do not mind moving to new mobs. But boxers would like to stay put and just burn down the same mobs all over. They want mobs that live and fill their box army with loot and xp without moving.
Lets make the new expansion end zone like VT, I'm sure everyone will love the trash clears.
Developers already did this. The player base hated it. The drunk giants have way too many hitpoints. Everyone avoided them as much as possible and no one wanted to kill them.
In seb revamp the golems were normally avoided when killing. People would use invisibility to get past them and just kill the 4 rooms and the 1 roamer.
Every time the dev's take a population of the zone, and make it into more hitpoints... The player base avoids those mobs like the plauge.
So what people are saying is that they didn't like killing thifling focusers!?
Forget necromancers being able to get DoTs to sink in, most cannot even get debuffs in without the mob dying the second they land. People are complaining that so and so class is OP, but reality the content isn’t up to snuff
As an SK, I can heal myself through most content in RoS so my healer doesn't have anything to do. Should we tune mob DPS up so my healer has something to do? No. Just because one group of players can things more quickly or efficiently does not mean that we need to negatively impact everyone else just to give them something more to do.
We do have this concept but don't always follow through. We set up base NPC values for "Normal" mobs, High HP mobs, and "swarm" mobs. We use "swarm" mobs the least (where we expect you to deal with a group at once... sometimes linked agro, sometimes just close together)
We have more of a tendency to use the high HP mobs but don't always manage it. (it looks like it was only on the Sathir's Tomb golems and super sarnak in RoS)
It’s all about content design and the implementation of it. The fact that a shaman can’t even land a couple spells debuffs (and utilize them) with a group of 4 in T2 RoS is kind of a problem. Now I’m not asking for nerfs nor taking content away from others.
There should be more swarm type mobs. Say you got 1 big hp mob and 3-4 smaller ones following it around that are all aggro linked.
There should be more diversity and logic to monster design. For example, a rat shouldn't have as much health or damage as a bear, much less a giant. Monster type shouldn't just be a skin.
As for the game being too fast, though, I don't think it is. It actually feels less fast than it was five years ago.
Every time I run across a Golem/Giant In other words a high hitpoint mob. I say one thing. Why in the world did they create this crap? Can we avoid killing this crap?
I don't know how many times I take golems and use a druid snare and fade. Just to not worry about them for 11 minutes. High hitpoint mobs suck.
The rude, so called foul mouth poster (the board censors actual cursing) is actually more intelligent than the person critiquing said poster's personality. Why? The critic is also the OP, who launched what has to be the most superfluous thread in quite a while. Seriously, man. Other than yourself and a few other misguided souls, it's pretty much agreed that mob HP is fine how it is. As others have said, there is no conceivable time anyone would want a trash mob to take twice as long to kill. No one misses timesink.
True, my use of that term was less elegant. I struggle a bit with finding the right words in english. Rude was probably a sufficient characteristic, although I wanted to mention that is was pervasive in the post. Foul mouth is what my Netflix-english could muster, I was thinking of Captain America saying “language” .
I agree that it was an intelligent argument, and I have no reason to disagree with you wrt him being more intelligent than I. Well said.
However, your argument about my position (which I have presented for the sake of creating a dialogue, for the sake of getting multiple inputs on the matter) being wrong, because it goes against consensus, is an argument that I disagree with. I do often aim to challenge conventions, to explore opportunities to do things in a smarter way. That means a lot of misfires, it is a part of the process. I am fine with being wrong often, because of the findings that come out of such a process. Sticking to consensus always is the opposite.
I completely agree that it is a shallow and superfluous topic; whether monsters in a computer game should take a few seconds more to kill, is very, very inconsequential to the bigger questions in the universe.
I got that you believe that HP are fine as they are.
I still think that some purely optional camps in open zones with high hp mobs would be nice, and I think this specific position is getting stronger, while at the same time it is very clear that more hp on mobs in general would be a bad idea, even more so if it is part of “bottleneck content”.
The OP has every right to complain. The short fights make some classes appear OP while eliminating entire spell/ability lines from being used.
No. In the old days while the mobs had more hp, they didn't have the ridiculous power values matched against their hp values. Mobs today hit like trucks, so increasing hp or even increasing mob density like they were in the old days doesn't make sense, it will just deter people from doing the content.
Everyone had a right to complain. Further action on the part of others to act on those complaints is completely optional. If the dev's want to give you a few trash mobs that have the HP of a rare named.....well, it's your time to waste. Taking twice as long for the same result is the antithesis of winning the game of life.
Lots of people are attacking Iblis assuming he is coming at this with an elitist mentality but if you have followed him and actually read the logic behind his proposal you will see the intent is to provide a more inclusive gameplay for certain classes that have had their unique abilities become worthless in many situations. While I don't personally like the idea of increased HP's I do appreciate the discussion of ways to make the game more enjoyable and well rounded for all classes which is what I think a lot of people missed when they read his post. This is simply a discussion on creative ways to make all classes matter. If anyone has a better idea than simply raising mob HPs than by all means express your thoughts but simply attacking him for an idea without actually reading into the context of the idea is lazy imo.
Regardless of all the reasons given already that this is bad, not sure (I skimmed so could have missed) anyone mentioned another issue. There is already a max amount of exp gain per mob, and we already hit it now. So increasing HP just means less exp over time.
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