Why I did not buy The Darkened Sea expansion

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Saave, Nov 8, 2014.

  1. Garshok Augur

    Elidroth - speaking of responses, could you poke Phathom and Absor to update what the current thinking is on the way ahead for the HA lockouts and the experience nerfs in ROF and below? (The "Update to Heroic Adventure Lockouts" thread in the Sense Heading forum.)

    There's been nothing since TDS release. Which is a tad frustrating for those who a) thought that the first round of nerfs was not well thought out and would not achieve its goals (and see the number of folks who hit 105 within 24 hours of release as validating that), and b) think that the additional changes discussed in the thread will just further reduce options and decrease enjoyment of game play for those who will not have already hit 105 when the new set of 'changes'[nerfs] discussed in the thread is implemented.

    As you may guess, I really don't like the exp changes added in just before beta-lock - not so much just those, but seeing it as yet another in a long line of 'tweaks' over the last year that makes me just /boggle. I likely would have held my nose and bought TDS for at least some of my accounts, but seeing the developers deciding to apparently 'double down' on more experience nerfs even before the expansion went live has just really made me start wondering if I should keep plugging away at EQ, or just pull the plug. It's disappointing that the best argument I can come up with to buy TDS now is the thought that if I don't quit, it will be harder to level to 105 and work AA after the next upcoming round of nerfs. A lot of stuff that I have had on my EQ 'bucket list for awhile are already going to be a lot less rewarding to do now than they would have been a month ago; this next upcoming round, if not the 'last straw' for me, is getting appreciably close to it.

    An update from Phathom and Absor on where they currently stand - if they are reconsidering their approach or still think 'double down' is the way to go - would be much appreciated.

    OK, spill the beans - what was the worst-selling EQ expansion? Those with prurient interests want to know. :D

    Don't need numbers or anything - just curious as all get-out now. Maybe for raw numbers and then for % of active accounts that bought it?

    [TDS isn't even released yet for accounts that pay by krono or gamecard, so any look at TDS's numbers would be highly skewed.]
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  2. Sathayorn Augur

    Doesn't matter what they do, people will complain, and the people content with the expansion aren't going to post about it nearly as much as the sore individuals who think Everquest should still be pushing out huge expansions 15 years after its release.

    Only complaints I have about this expansion is foraging to get into new zones, and just how ridiculous mez is as a game feature when used against players... In progression required to access zones.

    Other than slogging through that horrible, horrible idea on brother island, the expansion is great.

    Even if the expansion were "perfect" there would be the same number, and probably same people, complaining and saying they're going to quit because they're just unhappy people... And the grass wouldn't be the right shade of green for them.
  3. Elskidor Augur

    That surprises me that it isn't the weakest selling expansion. Honestly, I figured every expansion beyond 2004/2005 sold a wee less than the year prior.
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  4. Garshok Augur

    Likely so if subscriptions have continued to drop (I have no idea if they may have stabilized over the last few years).

    Another way to look at it would be to see what percentage of active accounts bought it. If, say a significantly smaller percentage of accounts bought UF compared to SOD or HOT, that would likely be significant feedback for the devs on the approach they took in UF. (I personally liked UF, but I like dwarf-themed stuff anyway.)

    Any judgement of TDS's sales would be premature, though, as non-all access accounts can't even get it until tomorrow.
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  5. Baramos Augur

    i) You're right. The playerbase always complains on these forums about one thing or another. Some people think you can judge the health of a game by how many people are complaining and how LOUD they are complaining.

    ii) I've been a LOUD complainer, sometimes. Even tried to quit, but I always come back to the Hotel EQ`fornia. Bottom line is that I love Norrath.

    iii) I agree that foraging for zone access is @#%@#%@.

    iv) Being stunned (short) is OK. Mez (long) is not. Not for a molo'er anyway.

    v) EQ developers have devolved from a horde of OMG developers who got to frolic gaily through the forests to a few harried, ulcer-bound and frantic scramblers trying to keep up with their jobs and the pounding of their managers and the players. Pressure cooker. Bummer. It's obvious they still love the game, though.

    The devs and the players are the same. Loons who are crazy about this (reality) that has been created in Norrath.

    People that quit? They come back at night, hands shaking. Mostly. (Admit it ! )

  6. Garshok Augur

    To be fair, SOE gave over five months notice that Vanguard and Wizardry online were sunsetting:

    Granted, Clone Wars and Free Realms received just over two months, but they did provide notice.

    I am pretty apathetic about EQ right now, and haven't logged on over the last two weeks other than to see if we are raiding and and do inventory maintenance on the bazaar bots.But to be fair to SOE, they have given notice - pretty significant notice for Vanguard and Wizardry.

    I don't think there would be grounds for complaint if SOE gave that much notice for sunsetting EQ - as long as they didn't, say, do it a couple of months after releasing an expansion.
  7. Whosurdaddy Journeyman

    I highly doubt any of the worker bees have been told how many expacs have been sold. That info. is too sensitive to float it thru the organization.

    As far as TDS selling fewer expacs than previous ones, it should be obvious on it's face to anyone who has followed these forums over the years that it is. Between the declining population and the number of alt accounts being held waiting on the xp/ha nerf decision (7 in my case) it is pretty clear to me. And then factor in the accounts that got wind of the nerfs before they bought the expac and chose not to buy it.

    The sad part of all this is that missing the expac sales target only exacerbates the budget problem that is causing these minimum content releases. Lower sales = fewer revenues = fewer devs = smaller content = lower sales = ............ you get it; a very dangerous downward spiral.

    Much of this problem here is self inflicted by SOE. Hopefully wiser heads will prevail and the powers that be will realize they need to give their "customers" what they want and are willing to pay for.

    Econ 101
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  8. Garshok Augur

    I tend to agree with that thinking. I know that I haven't complained much before - nor been as close to hanging it up.

    :D Gotta agree with that. I've been through times when resources were cut, and it was not fun.

    The lack of resources must be twice as frustrating for the devs as it is for players - and I am sure our kvetching doesn't help.
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  9. Potionless Elder

    I'm in the same boat. I've stopped the subscriptions on my two accounts (one from 2001 and the other from not too long after that.) My main account has run out and I imagine has dropped to silver - I don't know because I haven't logged into it in a while. I'll still play some alts on my other account until it drops to silver in about 60 days.

    It's not that we don't want to have anything to do with EQ - it's that we don't want to have anything to do with your recent changes. My guild is gone. My friends are gone and soon I will be too. I can't say that they've all left because they are not happy with changes you made but you're not helping. Everyone has a limit on the amount of negative changes they will put up with and every time you make an unpopular change, you hit the limit for some amount of people. I'd love to play EQ even solo but you've hit my limit. I didn't buy the new expansion but I've been reading the board here and it looks like the new content is not solo friendly (and by that I mean solo or grouping with a merc.) I'll continue to read the board and hope to see you make some positive changes but I won't pay you to keep taking things away.

    Thanks for the fun.
  10. Zakor Elder

    Elidroth, is there a place that we can look up what the sales actually were for all of the expansions? I tried a few google searches, but to no avail. I am curious as to what the numbers look like. It would give me an idea of how many people still play, and I am asking out of curiosity, not out of argumentativeness.
  11. idej Augur

    From my understanding all the Sony Online Games are squished into one financial tab making it hard to see where individual games stand.
  12. Mysl Augur

    If you have more than one account, and do not want to do the TDS progression more than once, you will end up buying more than one copy of the expansion.
  13. Slasher Augur

    If they were good we all know there would be a comment :)
  14. Ngreth Thergn Developer

    No. We are actually forbidden to talk about it. Good or bad. Has nothing to do with the actual state of it.
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  15. Tatankawolfdancer Elder

    Actually, the post he replied to had two assertions, so was he denying both, or just one (and if, so, which one)?

    The assertions were less than 10K copies (lowball, so obviously false), and lowest selling ever. Hard to believe that one isn't true, since a) it's only been available less than two weeks, and b) no point to F2P accounts to buy it yet (until tomorrow). Add in c) people who are holding off on purpose, because they don't like the changes, and the assertion would seem to be true. Unless an awful lot of people on these forums are lying.


    Also consider that fewer people play, compared to the past. And don't say boxing makes up all of that difference. I've been buying three copies since 2001. Haven't bought TDS yet.
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  16. GhostToThePost Lorekeeper

    Yeah, this is what a lot of us already knew. If things were bad, you couldn't tell us. If things were good, you couldn't tell us either. Nothing good would come out of telling us. Its why a lot of theory-crafting and guesstimates are done, along with gut reactions and eyeballing things in game as a player.
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  17. Slasher Augur

    You're forbidden but your employer is not. if they were good or great there would be a press release saying it we all know how companies work.
  18. GhostToThePost Lorekeeper

    Ive always been real curious how SOE/Smed would handle the sunset of EverQuest. Its coming, its just a matter of time when. Will they announce it and give the player base a few months notice? Or will it just come out of the blue and all at once making sure the player base pays up until the end? I also bet that when it happens, it'll be around the start of summer and not around the time when an expansion is suppose to launch.
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  19. Ozni Elder

    My theory is that EQ's fate is like a rhetorical picture of Dorian Gray. As long as people keep saying the game is dying, it'll be fine. But the moment they all stop is like looking at the portrait - it's all gonna come crashing down. Therefore it's in the dev's best interest to provide sufficient grey-area within which the doomsayers can ply their trade.
  20. Nolrog Augur

    They haven't released numbers in a long long time. Gotta be 10 years now (maybe longer).
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