What is going on?

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Maedhros, Jan 7, 2021.

  1. Smokezz The Bane Crew

    The time to finish events doesn't factor in a guilds loot system. So... that really doesn't help you in this "race" idea.
  2. Mazame Augur

    I disagree. If i am looking for a guild and it takes them 1 hour to do an event and loot. Vs another guild that can do the event and loot in 30 min. That could be a big factor in what guild I pick. I do not want to spend 50%+ of my night waiting on loot to be done. so it play into the effectiveness of the guild.

    After all a guild that does event with loot in 30 min can get 9 events done in 4.5 hours this being about the time most guild will spend raiding in one night.
    Kurage_of_Luclin likes this.
  3. Dhurgan Augur


    My top factor in looking for a guild is the personality of the people in it, not how fast they can burn through an event and do loot. I guess we all have our own criteria.
    yepmetoo, Yinla, Elyssanda and 3 others like this.
  4. Sancus Augur

    Hard events are hard for guilds on live. Unfettered Emerald Excellence, Drusella's Vault, and The Kar`Zok (to name a few) were all available to beta test, and nonetheless posed a significant challenge to guilds on live.

    Tier 1 raids are always going to be a speed contest, unless they're broken or significantly overtuned. It's fine if guilds opt not to participate in that contest, and I would argue it's not placement-defining (i.e., Guild X is not necessarily better than Guild Y based on their placement in T1). At the same time, there absolutely is skill involved in defeating raids quickly. I personally feel a pretty significant sense of accomplishment in defeating all three T1 raids in ~26 minutes (it was about 12:04 that the raids unlocked on Xegony), and I suspect most other guilds could not accomplish that under launch conditions.

    All that having been said, the reason there was no multi-day race in ToV is that the T3 raids were woefully undertuned. If CoV's T3 raids aren't adjusted from Beta, that will be the case this year as well. The devs could release pre-nerf Mearatas with updated HP/damage values, and very few guilds would beat it day one despite the raid having been out nearly two years. Mechanically complex raids will always challenge guilds, beta or not. The devs just have to make them.
  5. Tappin Augur

    Are they actually servers or just iPads?
  6. Benito EQ Player since 2001.

    Lowest tier of GoDaddy
    Fooba and Fenthen like this.
  7. Verily Tjark Augur

    The lag in raids last night was unfortunate but not a surprise. Having to wait for the script to catch up to finish raids is sad. We saw certain mobs never move and some mechanics never happen as well.

    However, it was still better than raiding ToV for alt gear, and I can't wait for Tier 2!
  8. Mazame Augur

    I would not say it my top factor either. But having been in a guild that was not progressing at all and taking hours do form up and attempt an event with little chance to be successful, it is something I look at.
  9. Waring_McMarrin Augur


    That only matters if there are raids that can't be mastered on beta and oneshot on live when they open. As long as the only major difference in completion times ends up being what time raids started and how long it takes between events there isn't much of a race.
  10. Astral64 Augur

    [IMG]
    Kurage_of_Luclin, Lannin and Sancus like this.
  11. Lisard Augur

    Racing comes down to more then just who can log in or who masters it in beta, which i dont think any guild does, they just find what works and then see where they can cut time within the event after numerous back and forths with absor and other outlets "is xyz intended to happen in xyz event".

    -Strategy
    -Roster understanding the strategy
    -Execution of Strategy
    -Adapting of strategy to curveballs or changing the speed to make up for lost time elsewhere in the strategy during the race and on the fly.
    -Player performance on beta VS player performance on live (not much to lose on beta)

    you can absolutely have winning strats during beta, but you cant always predict if there will be minor changes from beta to live, will boss lock with x add up, will script break bypassing x mechanic (which you will see happen to many guilds on aaryonar during t2, because even the group mission currently will break if you over dps), will there be a subtle/minor change in spelling / mechanic scripting. so planning your strategy around this can be stressful not only because you need to execute it but because you also need the failsafe for adapting to them if your intended strategy begins to falter and become clear that it wont work. you can clearly see this in play on the tier 1 unlock, RoI / RoTE / Valhallah / SoD? took a chance and skipped mechanics on 2 events, they took that chance and it worked for them (kited kromriff/dorfs in Klandicar, ignored Tantorlings and splashed the singular dot on Tantor), where SR played it safe and killed them (giant, dorfs, tantorlings in both to secure a win and not chance wiping if it did in fact change between beta / live. there was roughly a 2 minute delay for xegony on requesting DZ's compared to the other servers as well mad props as always to their execution.

    so yes, there's more to racing then just who can log in first or master it in beta.

    theres no website that grades performance on event time. we only have elitegamerslounge as our measuring stick. but event time is also a golf clap worthy effort even if its not publicly showcased
  12. Cicelee Augur

    If Realm of Insanity decided to not raid last night and instead wait until their "normal" Sunday raid, would you say that they are the 15th fastest (or best) guild in Everquest?

    There is no race because the parameters we place upon the race is flawed. There is no equality amongst all the participants. It is like playing 11 on 9 in a football game. Or playing 5 on 3 in basketball. Or starting a poker tournament with 20k in chips and the blinds 50/100 and some players are able to start with 90k in chips.

    Until there is a level start to the playing field, then there is no legit race. Just be in your guild and do you and let others do thwm.
  13. Triconix Augur

    So a thread about lag has now devolved into a debate on whether there is a race or not. Can we like stay on topic and possibly hear back from Dreamweaver? I highly doubt the lag is something induced by what the devs do so this an operations issue.

    My personal experiences:

    Tanking Tantor was kind of laughable. He wouldn't even attack for half the fight. When he was supposed to chase people, all the stupid mammoth would do is rubberband a bit, reset aggro, and continue not attacking.

    Flipping of Klandicar for directional AEs was futile. I would flip to where he should be facing and half a minute would go by before he even decided to move - long after I moved back to where I was.

    The aggro swap for Zlandicar just didn't happen. I would unleash my aggro after a successful taunt and the HoTT would remain unchanged. There was even a point where my aggro completely reset itself seemingly out of nowhere. Facing him away from the raid was useless because he simply refused to face the MT for a vast majority of the fight. No idea why. I'm not sure if he even attacked the MT as he was facing the rest of the raid for pretty much the whole event.
    Elyssanda likes this.
  14. Lisard Augur


    the rankings is a tangent in determining good guilds based on their accomplishments. the rankings also showcase the guilds overall strength. strategy, player performance, execution. even on = playing field that everyone wants, and i dont disagree that it would be interesting to see, i doubt the ranking would alter by that much. you would more then likely see closer gaps in completion time, which we are already witnessing with tov/cov.

    DPG just needs to get their together and release all 3 tiers on the same day (a saturday or sunday) at noon EST. have those DPG employees take a thursday and friday off work and come in to monitor the servers during that sat and or sun. make a day of it. stream it from various fronts on their facebook/youtube/twitch. its really not that hard and idk why they, DPG, dont capitalize on the opportunity for a measily 1-2 days out of the year.
  15. Waring_McMarrin Augur


    14 guilds beat all 3 raids on opening day and I am guessing most if not all beat them in a single attempt. Seems to me it was just a matter of what time each guild started raiding for what place the finished on the list.
  16. Lisard Augur

    14 guilds wanted to get a win on opening day
    4 guilds were on @ unlock
    so 4 guilds were interested in testing their mettle for tier 1.
    Kurage_of_Luclin likes this.
  17. Cicelee Augur

    While I agree that rankings should be about overall strength, player performance, execution, etx.... EGL rankings do not.

    I think anyone in a top 20 guild recognizes Realm of Insanity as the premier guild in EQ as far as efficiency, speed, talent, knowledge, strength, performance, execution, etc. Again, if they decided to not raid last night and instead raid on Sunday... would you say they are the 15th best guild because EGL says so?

    What did yesterday really prove? 14 guilds logged in and defeated all three raids. Some one shotted, some wiped. To me, how many attempts it took your guild to win is more important than deciding to get 54 on a Thursday. Furthermore, how long it took each guild to defeat the event is far more important than 54 who were able to work a half day/take the whole day off on Thursday and log in at noon EST or whenever the raid NPC gave the instance.

    All I am saying is that there is no.legit race. Having 54 available raiders at a certain time is one of the most important functions according to EGL, and I think speed and number of attempts is far more important.

    I guarantee that if ROI, for example, decided not to raid in March 2021 and resume raids April 1 2021 that I (along with many others) would still consider them the premier guild in EQ based off of performance, execution, etc regardless if they finished 18th according to EGL.[
  18. Lisard Augur

    so your telling me if what ever guild your in now, didnt happen to de-thrown RoI from the EGL rankings you wouldnt have a slight grin on your face?

    there are a lot of strong guilds out there with all those characteristics. for sure. RoI is the premier guild, for sure. but the EGL has been the standard for 11 years and longer. its where the "bragging rights" are even if its not a "True Race"
    Kurage_of_Luclin likes this.
  19. Robnie Augur

    I think going forwards t1 launches should be dictated on your ability to split day 1.
    Kragin011 likes this.
  20. Cicelee Augur

    If the day T3 was released and the Xegony server was locked for 48 hours and a guild on another server wiped 11 times during those 48 hours but managed to defeat all three T3 raids... and then ROI and MS finally logged on and one shotted all three T3 raids....

    You would tell me that the guild that wiped 11 times but managed to defeat all three T3 raids is a better guild than ROI or MS because EGL says they finished T3 before the other two?

    And just because something has been the standard for 11 years doesn't necessarily mean we all should just accept it as gold and fool proof.

    EDIT- to answer the question, if the guild I am in started at the exact same time as ROI or any other guild and we finished the tier of raids before everyone else, of course I would be proud and grin from ear to ear for my guild.
    Dracolindus likes this.

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