What do you prefer: Grinding or the new Meta of Completion?

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Xerzist, Jul 11, 2020.

  1. BadPallyGuildLeader Augur

    Daybreakerwhatever they are called clearly caved in to uberguilders who like to compensate for appendage size by enforcing their non-boxer playstyle on everyone else by removing the grinding option in TOV. For the first time in two decades you can only efficiently negotiate the 111 to 115 level range via the task system.
    Skuz, dreadlord and Velisaris_MS like this.
  2. BadPallyGuildLeader Augur

    I have presented detailed data from FV that shows the automation, if you will, did exactly what you state. But the ubers dont want to hear about it. They hate boxers. They hate casuals. The love enforcing their play style complete with l33t strats that only they know about to propel them and their play time rich cool bro's through content.

    And guess what? Their dirty little secret is that it is the ubers themselves that benefit from the krono train powered automation schemes. I can give character names, guilds, etc on FV but really what is the point at this point....you know?
    Skuz and dreadlord like this.
  3. BadPallyGuildLeader Augur

    Maybe that elite game designer would kindly revamp a tired, worn, and faulty(bug ridden) task system. FYI, I learned from the l33t bros on my server exactly how in so many cases huge chunks of time were wasted trying to overcome bugs in some of the progression\task system quests in TOV(not that TOV was the first bug ridden anything in EQ lol).
  4. Jhenna_BB Proudly Prestigious Pointed Purveyor of Pincusions

    I'm so ready and have been since around 2012 for Raid specific and Hero mission specific achievements to be eliminated. Compete and total waste of Developer resources - complete and total waste of player effort. Create real content instead. Give rewards through quests that are actually fun - and work correctly.

    Achievements are a blight unto the gaming industry as a whole and every gamer should riot against them when used as content the way EverQuest does. They are not in any way, shape or form actual content. Let's stop collectively kidding ourselves. Developers: stop phoning it on this one. You're better than this.
    Yinla and Pawtato like this.
  5. Zamiam Augur

    ^^ lol to funny
  6. dreadlord Augur

    From day1, one of my main gripes with EQ is that it seeks to enforce a style of play. This seems bonkers to me, so many more folk would play if they could play & progress their own way, such as soloing, small groups/duos, grinding etc
    I have no quibble at all with all the achievements etc there *should* be difficult stuff to challenge the endgame crowd. But it should also be possible to enjoy EQ without this. Although I raid (and have completed all the achievements), what i actually enjoy is a good simple grind. That's what I want to spend the bulk of my EQ time doing. The current expansion which gives ludicrously small exp for that, coupled with the nerfing of exp in past expansions really really sucks the joy out of the game for me. I'm not alone in that, a whole bunch of casual player acquaintances gave up a month or two into ToV

    Overall, I think, yet again, what's lacking is DBG actually talking to their players. Not just the top 3 guilds, not just the folk on the forums, but the 99% who don't fall into either of those categories - ask them what would restore the fun in the game for them
    Skuz likes this.
  7. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    I am going to disagree here when it comes to raid achievements, they can definitely be used constructively to create a means for increasing the difficulty of raids without blocking out lower powered guilds from seeing the content and provide a means for adding replay value.

    It all depends what kinds of rewards are locked behind them as to whether they are being used in a way that adds value or annoyance.
  8. Pelrond Elder


    Only once. Get chunk of XP fist time, after that just another mob.
    Skuz likes this.
  9. Moege Augur

    Quoting this so when it is implemented I can have a reference to who bought this idea.

    I can just see the next iteration of grinding e.g hunter.
    You get 0.0000001 for any task/mob killed. To level up you need to do full hunter as you go each unique named killed moves the xp bar. Sound like a proper grindfest to me.
  10. bortage spammin lifetaps

    Honestly I feel like it should be a hybrid model, big chunk of XP for killing a rare the first time plus a similarly big chunk for every subsequent kill

    Have the bonus buffed by XP pots and suddenly you have people actually buying the damn things resulting in more cash money to fund that Plane of Mischief remaster, plus playing in a traditional "kill the mobs, then the rares" groups while leveling your freshly-bought heroic char would feel like less of a waste of time compared to waiting for a tank to run your lowbies through DH HA
  11. svann Augur

    Or big xp first time, and every time someone in group gets first kill. Give people incentive to group with different people.
    Tucoh likes this.
  12. I_Love_My_Bandwidth Mercslayer

    So, really what most of you who think grinding is too slow are saying is you want XP reward parity across all methods of gaining XP - right?
  13. code-zero Augur

    Personally what I have against grinding it that it's boring and not at all engaging. The people who are lobbying for a grinding path fail to realize that their complaint about it being too slow relates directly to the fact that they don't really want to grind either. They want to do the grind and just get the level/AA increase over and done with.

    The issue that the grinding advocates seem to have is that by using the progression to achieve level that somehow those levels weren't really earned. I'd say that though they went by comparatively quickly they were in fact earned.

    So far no one has really made a good case for grinding to be put on par with doing progression outside of feeling that they've had some choice taken from them.

    Look at it from the flip side, when people did marathon grind sessions to make the new level and get the AA's and finished before other people who were leveling as they did progression most of the people following progression just rolled their eyes and continued. Trivializing the progression by leveling up on low risk mobs in old zones first is really very lame when you think about it...
  14. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    I haven't seen anyone say that they want grinding mobs to be on par with the progression system so far, just that they want it to have an equivalent XP rate vs XP needed to level to past expansions - so NO parity has not been asked for at all.

    What they want is for the ToV model to not gut the xp from mob grinding - which it did.

    Killing mobs for XP should be about as rewarding as it always has, while the progression system being far more rewarding is just fine.

    Asking for a viable path is not the same as asking for an equally rewarding one.
  15. Corwyhn Lionheart Guild Leader, Lions of the Heart

    Actually no you are wrong. I enjoy grinding and I enjoy a decent reward for my work. If raiding gave you nothing at all most folks wouldn't raid. If Overseer gave you almost nothing most people wouldnt play it either. See the connection?

    What a lot of us enjoy is the grind and seeing our exp meter move up. MMOs are all about getting something for work put in. The reward should be comparable to the work involved. I find grinding exp relaxing BUT I also have gotten used to a certain return for the work I put into it. Daybreak suddenly decided to say screw you peeps who enjoyed that you can still do it but we are going to reduce your reward to next to nothing.

    To be hones I find it amazing so many on this forum cannot get that through their head. I am honestly perplexed.

    And ummm Overseer and Collections are so engaging? That is what many spout as an alternative to grinding levels. Or be engaged by doing a bunch of missions once? What is so engaging about all of that?
    winspearean and Skuz like this.
  16. Corwyhn Lionheart Guild Leader, Lions of the Heart

    Nope no one is saying that. Just give us the same return on grinding that we have gotten for many years with each level increase expansion. Not one bit more.. just the same.

    I know we are radicals.... "what you want the same experience that kept you playing for 21 years?( ok probably not all 21 years exp came easier in the last 10 or 15 years)" I know I know.. its crazy talk!!!! Not. :)
    winspearean likes this.
  17. Corwyhn Lionheart Guild Leader, Lions of the Heart

    What do some folks think us casual group players do in EQ?

    Yes some do tradeskills.

    Some do collections

    Some work on old quests.

    Pretty much all of us spend a lot of time killing mobs.

    Yes we grind. And we enjoy the grinding. But we expect a reasonable reward for it.

    Trade skills wouldn't trade skill if they got nothing out of it.

    Raiders wouldn't raid if they got nothing out of it.

    Collectors wouldn't collect collections if they got nothing out of it.

    Just go back to when Overseers came out then got nerfed hard. A lot of people were upset because the rewards they started getting used to were heavily nerfed. And they had just been getting those rewars for a number of weeks before they got nerfed.

    We were used to decent exp via the grind FOR YEARS. So yeah we are a bit upset at the nerf.

    The funny thing is the grinders are the easiest to make content for. Maybe that is the problem. Maybe the devs feel no challenge so they have to make more interesting content then because we don't find it more interesting they have to push us to it by taking away what we do enjoy. Seems to be bass ackwards to me.

    And as for engaging content how long do the progression missions engage anyone? If you don't need the group drops I can't see why folks would do them more then once unless it helps with evolving items... that was a band wagon I have never jumped on.

    And yeah the sad thing is some won't be able to see things from our side. I have no problems seeing that some love the new ways to get exp...maybe I am wierd. I totally get how some would enjoy fast exp doing missions that they will have no problems whatsoever completing. Get that leveling out of the way so they can raid. Thing is I get that and I don't think its crazy I totally get that for some that is what the game is about and its totally valid for them to enjoy things that way. I just wish they could do the same with the rest of us.
    Skuz and winspearean like this.
  18. Schadenfreude Augur

    I can think of one guy I'm guilded with [on an alt] who came back a few months after ToV launched having been completely AWOL for TBL who aggressively scooped up every single task-add the second it was offered in guildchat which took him to 114. He then paid a very well known botter in raid currency to do almost all his AAs and earring evolution in Great Divide.

    So, yeah about that earning thing.
  19. code-zero Augur

    Ugh, like no one ever did that in the past? If there's a way to beat the system it'll be exploited as long as possible.

    Oh, and for the record I personally got my characters to 115 through grinding for the most part and still haven't finished ToV progression. XP pots and bonus weekends are great for that
  20. p2aa Augur

    I prefer the meta of completion. I'm glad I don't have to grind over and over to progress into levels.