When grouping with some high skilled raid gear DPS class in group content, I noticed that their aggro climbs much faster than before. I can still hold aggro over them, but I have to spam way more aggro tools, than at lvl 105. The fact one of our best aggro tool doesn't give full hate since a long time now doesn't help us (phantom aggressor pet that tank instead of us, so not giving the full aggro benefit when it fade because it dies before usually, despite taunting of him and using aggro lead on him). The fact that we hardly received any aggro AA boost can be another explanation too. Have some other noticed this ? Also i have put in bold the situation I noticed it, other situations are obviously not a problem.
Rotate your hate mods better. Wile true we lost some aggro compared to b4 . And that we have to think more about what and when. But ultimatly we are still in a good place imo. If we continue stagnate then maybe we have some valid conserns mainly for continues ae aggro. But for now i dont see any problems if you botton right Hate mods: Dico Warlords fury Rage of the forsaken Together they are about 65% uptime
I have not noticed this issue at all. Although this year we have slipped on the rankings big time (to be considered top tier), we have some quality players amongst our roster that I play with. Kamikaze zerkers and such haha I’ve also never had any issues with any of our pets, I’m always higher agro than them. The other day I even had bold attacks off (due to being on dps duty) and only then I facepalmed a bit later when I was tanking and hadn’t noticed. But even then it never became a real issue. Could you have disabled it by accident too? Really the only time you should have issues is when you forget to put attack on and you are slacking on clicking your buttons. (Or you forget bold attacks every now and then by human error like me haha) Gone are the days of pure turn on harmonious and afk while a cleric heals you. And that’s a good thing in my opinion, it’s more fun to have to be active than press a button and then /yawn with auto attack.
...in Arx. But just "in EoK" would be infinitely better than the current situation, since it's completely nonfunctional
As I said it, i'm not loosing aggro. I still can keep aggro over any DPS, but they are higher in the aggro meter than they used to be at lvl 105. Thanks for the hate mod reminders, I was using them, but forgot Dicho had one hate mod attached to it, so to keep other when Dicho not running.
Yea dicho is often forgotten as a hate mod in the grand scheme of things. I think we can chalk it up to priest dots getting yet another big increase with RoS - but yea they aren't even close to grabbing agro anywhere. Another thing to consider making things more "easy mode" and adjust how high others are is swapping in the warrior sword as the hate proc is pretty insane. Along with using "others hate is reduced by x%" abilities if you want to blow something like that for example. (Unflinching attention comes to mind.) But I find all tools we have a way more than enough. I would only be complaining if I'm remotely close to "struggling" which is far far away currently (at least for me).
Out of curiousity, which classes have been the ones you’ve noticed being problematic as far as climbing the hate ladder more than they used to? I’ve noticed it with a monk buddy a bit in RoS, but a large part of that is him both sucking at assisting and never hitting his fd key, so that’s really on him more than a game issue.
I have noticed it especially with zerker. I have seen it also with wizard, rogue, monk and ranger. But Zerker is the one I noticed it the most.
Shouldn't the ideal balance be dps classes can produce 95-99% of the agro a tank can? That way agro has meaning instead of being easy buttons? I suppose that also means the army of bot tanks will rise up cause they cant push attack and forget.
Aggro has more meaning for me in this expansion than before. I feel 95-99 % is too much, I know that if I would see constantly DPS in this aggro meter range I would freak out a lot And yeah if the tank would be sure to never be overaggroed, would be too easy mode for tanks too.
Just for fun I went back on 2 discussions threads about phantom aggressor broken It started 2 years ago. https://forums.daybreakgames.com/eq/index.php?threads/phantom-aggressor.226917/ https://forums.daybreakgames.com/eq...antom-aggressor-and-pet-aggro-changes.229278/ Still hold some truth today hehe.
Haven’t noticed any issues at all with zerk rog wiz or mag. I was grouped with the best zerk I’ve ever played with the other day and nothing either. But that was largely timing my burns with his.
aye, I was just throwing out numbers to illustrate the idea of agro management being something a tank could lose control of if he didn't stay on top of things.
I spent some time comparing increases for our direct aggro line (Slander), aggro over time line (Kluzen's Roar), AE aggro burst (Dragonstrike Blades), and aggro debuff (Burning Shout). They have received the exact same percentage increases across the board for the last few years: 118.52% from RoF to TDS, and 138.68% from TDS to RoS. I also compared those values to highest-tier raid weapons of the associated level-raise expansion for weapon-generated aggro growth and saw that pure aggro generation has been increasing at a much faster pace. Considering that we have also gained other new tools (Dichotomic, Wade in to Battle, Rage of the Forsaken, Harmonious), I don't think Warrior aggro has stagnated. I think what you're seeing is that DPS classes have gained more worthwhile buttons to push to generate more aggro, have gained more abilities that cause extra hits/reduce weapon delay, or have more consistent additional hits from the addition of autoskill and as multibinding becomes more commonplace. It also doesn't help that certain classes (Monk and Berserker) don't have constant passive Combat Subtlety AAs like their DPS brethren to reduce aggro generation as their hit-spam increases. Certain Warrior abilities definitely need updating or fixing. As already mentioned, Warlord's Grasp hasn't been updated for the new RoS level cap but is sorely needed, and Phantom Aggressor was broken by the swarm-pet patch (since it's not allowed to summon at a higher aggro level than its owner anymore, therefor failing to perform total aggro adjustment as it previously did). It's also worth pointing out that Blast of Anger actually has stagnated, having not been updated since TDS, which should have new ranks peaking at about 50K hate (approximately 3x the value of Slander). I think these three things would fix any problems you might be having, since two of these tools currently do effectively nothing and the last one is certainly weaker than it should be.
I agree but I'd even go further than that. In my opinion I think that under ideal conditions a good DPS should be capable of producing even more aggro than a good tank can. This gives two beneficial results: 1. Good tanks being superior to mediocre ones. 2. DPS having to consider aggro before unloading on a mob. However, I get that the current EQ modality is that tanks can easily lock aggro and that doesn't need to be disturbed by developers who don't have the time to re-design and test things properly. My group geared berserker that I box doesn't reach the peaks that a raid-geared, skillfully played berserker can, but he can still generate 1 million DPS over the entire life of a mob while burning and he always goes balls out upon engagement. However, as long as I hit a few key aggro-inducing abilities on my warrior he's never at risk from losing aggro.
Nice analysis. Tucoh brought up good points as well. Judging from the lack of resources EQ gets I’m opting for us to retain our current situation versus them returning so we are super close to dps agro. Just as we all know adjustments are way way too slow to happen (if at all). Sadly. I too would have otherwise enjoyed the game you are describing (and also not having broken abilities). If there is time and effort available to make it happen tho I’m all for it.
