Wow May, didn't know you were into that kinda thing! Our chain of shared interests may have been broken! At least we still have the kittens!
I am ok not tanking effectively while using the 2hs. what I am saying is that i should not have to go back to old content to safely use a current level item. Ever see a Monk or Knight tank current content with a 2hander. They do just fine, especially when raid geared, of course it is not as efficient but they can at least do it. What i want are the negatives to be either reduced or eliminated on the two-handed stance we are the only class that has to give up almost all innate defensives to use. 4: Decrease Chance to Parry by 60% 5: Decrease Chance to Block by 60% 6: Decrease Chance to Dodge by 60% Oh yeah and since this one is blocked by Two-Handed also Myrmidon's Skill 6: Increase Chance to Dodge by 20% My point was that 2hs should have the downside of not being able to tank. I give up Shield AC, Shield Block and all that the other stuff Just like everyone else. So why all the debilitating Negatives?
As a Berserker I fully endorse this, but I would sacrifice non-vital body parts to gain something as powerful as Two-Handed Proficiency.
lol you can do it, just don't use a proficiency, then you don't get any negatives, you just don't get that nice 110% boost either though, that is what you are paying for.
I'm not even going to pretend I'd enjoy playing a group zerker these days, but I gotta think 2H prof + Offensive Disc would launch zerkers straight to Mars. The fact that Wars are still weak despite having these sledgehammers that should tell you something. I guess that's what happens when our best DPS mash button is level 83.
Just so that we know what a 110% boost looks like. and I realize these are very short parses Only self buffs, 162% haste. Scridio 324dmg 30dly. Only Auto attack DPS Without two-handed stance /GU Combat Dummy Ozah in 310s, 1772k @5717sdps --- Lianeb 1772k@5717sdps (5717dps in 310s) With two-handed stance /GU Combat Dummy Ozah in 312s, 3424k @10973sdps --- Lianeb 3424k@10973sdps (10973dps in 312s) And for comparison Defensive Stance /GU Combat Dummy Ozah in 314s, 1736k @5530sdps --- Lianeb 1736k@5530sdps (5530dps in 314s)
Im glad we found that it does indeed do the 110% more now put that into a dps group and see what the diff is.
See there in lies the problem. I think we are getting somewhere finally. In a DPS group you can't use it you die. Unless you are in a DPS group in year old or more content. 80% loss in Dodge is Huge in anything current
Zerkers don't fair much better unbuffed and unhasted: Only self buffs, 162% haste. Scindio 322dmg 30dly. Only Auto attack DPS /3 Combat Dummy Azia in 304s, 2183k @7181sdps -- Krixis 2183k@(7181dps in 304s) [100%] [Fri Aug 07 21:35:25 2015] Combat Dummy Azia has no bodytype. Combat Dummy Azia is currently level 109 and has 823 AC. /tell Krixis Krixis -vs- Combat Dummy Azia: -- DMG: 2183167 -- DPS: 7181 -- Scaled: 7181 -- Slash: 2119724 -- DirDmg: 63443 -- % dmg as normal: 32.3% -- % dmg as critical: 67.7% -- Non-crit rate: 57.3% -- crit rate: 42.7% -- Attempts: 561 -- Hits: 461 -- Missed: 100 -- Accuracy: 82.2% -- Avg Hit: 4735 -- Max hit: 11267 -- DMG to PC: 0
You know I am ok with where the DPS is on 2hs that is not what my stand is on this. My stand is that the drawbacks to gaining that DPS are not worth the Risk. You as a Zerker know where i am coming from. Look at what you give up to get your DPS. Now look at what I have to give up to get a drop in the bucket compared to yours. Warriors don't go from 10k auto attack DPS to 100-200K DPS, In fact I don't want them to. But to say that what we give up for the two-hand proficiency is fair to what we gain, heh
You are literally too stupid to insult... Rangers didn't get flurry until DoD (?) long after us. Crippling blow and our innate crit chance were higher than all classes before aa's even came out. CCM didn't come out until what, ROF? Why are you bringing this up? We're talking original game mechanics much older than RoF. Desperate times call for hail mary's I guess. You should probably, just maybe, stay within the realm of the argument. Clearly never was talking current era EQ. /facepam And then the non logical, not funny ramblings about kittens. Well, ironically I do hate cats! I guess I shouldnt expect much from a BB follower. Nonsensical ramblings. Apple doesn't fall far from the tree. What BB has been arguing for years is SB superiority of everything. You couldn't go a day without seeing his ridiculous tirades with the same fricken sentences copy/pasted about SB. He never defended the fact that our dps setups were badly ignored to the point where our tank set up surpassed them for dps. Actually, everytime a different setup was mentioned, he claimed we were all in favor of DW 24/7 blah blah blah. Yet, now he's here back in action calling for increased tank dps. No sir, no thanks. IF we see a dps increase to SB, I expect our dps setups to have an increase 1.5x that of the SB increase. Mic drop.
I want to survive, never did i say tank with it. Guess we have never seen a mob turn toward a Monk or Knight while in 2h and they survive a couple rounds fine?
LOL you can survive a round or 2 as well, you also have fort that you can hit. you have options to save yourself for a couple rounds while the other tank picks it back up.
Warriors are meant for tanking. Some tradeoffs are reasonable, but they look like: 2H grants more ripostes instead of shield AC rather than 2H makes you die faster than a Rogue while doing a tenth of their DPS.
Yeah cause that's a DPS disc I am done with this stupid arguement. You're right. I can use discs to survive and then switch over to my tanking set up if i was able to predict the future and knew when the mob was going to turn on me then I would have the foresight to turn off whatever DPS disc I was running with my two-handed proficiency because that is what we do. Oh wait why waste Fortitude since I know the mob is turning to me I can just hit Flash of Anger...oh wait that doesn't work with 2h proficiency either. So now i need to swap weapons...stop disc, Hit another disc, all in a combat round before getting hit. Got it Working as intended!!
I dunno man! You started this side discussion (here), choosing to include the phrase "and now", I'm just trying to keep up. I think others here got it, but for you: the cat thing just as non logical[sic] and not funny as saying that a lack of posts makes me part of an imaginary opposition, or that I'm a follower of anyone - that part's new. It's been pretty clear to me that Battleblade's point all along is that when warriors are doing the warrioring job (to wit: tanking), we should be geared fittingly (that is, with a shield), and that being geared that way shouldn't be a handicap. That he wasn't also separately making your points for you is, at its worst, irrelevant. Whether or not the math on this works out, it's something you can want. "Expect" is between you and developers, but what strikes me about the statement is how unnecessary it is to couch it in attacks on other commenters.
You expect us to use our strongest TANK disc while dpsing? And lets also remember that flash would strip our proficiency so we would need to put it back on. And if a tank dies before the 30 second cool down is up, we are left without our defensive proficiency for a period of time. So not only would we lack a proficiency, but we'd lack fort as well. That's just dandy! While we're at it, we'll pop LS mid burn too, just so we make sure we're left completely useless when we gotta jump in and tank. And as an fyi, I've gotten rounded each and every time I've used 2h prof in raids (and I rarely use it). Mobs hit me like Im a caster...maybe even harder with the amount of negatives attached to 2h prof!
