Very Ticked off

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by quakedragon, Sep 18, 2021.

  1. Velisaris_MS Augur

    They've screwed with the scaling mechanics so much over the last few years, I'm amazed that heroic adventures still work at this point. When you do one, just assume that the scaling isn't going to work properly, especially in TBM.

    If you're doing the TBM HAs primarily for currency to buy gear, remember that it's tradeable so you can just buy what you need from other players.
  2. Tucoh Augur

    You won't get this kind of info because anyone who would be able to provide that kind of info has forgotten it when they went through when that level range was live and it's changed anyway.

    Here's my advice: don't think of EQ as a typical RPG that you can take rational actions in and get rational results. There are a ton of games like that and personally i find them boring. Think of EQ as an accidental puzzle game where once you figure out the puzzle it gets kind if easy. The hard part is figuring out the puzzle.
  3. Flatchy Court Jester

    I doubt anyone is going to give you your magical number. Simply put if you keep wiping there go somewhere that you can handle. The oldest expansions with the highest cons may get you the levels you need.

    So many variables too. What is your tanks augs like? AA count. You may be expecting too much too soon. If you cant do it quit beating your head against the wall and go do what you can. In the end HA are all boring rinse and repeat tasks anyway like anything else.

    Sometimes "Git Gud" is the answer.
  4. Accipiter Old Timer


    My opinion is that you won't get the numbers you want.
    Coagagin likes this.
  5. Accipiter Old Timer


    Man, ain't that the truth. Mobs packed in tight that can't be lulled, snared, or mezzed. I'd like to talk to the dev that came up with that one. Some of it isn't bad but when you get to the death knight area, forget it.
  6. Rainlover Augur

    I don't think anyone can really give him the numbers.
    my advice for him is if you can't handle the content step back an xpac and work on that for gear or AA's and do this until you find what you can handle, then move forward.

    EQ is not a game where levels rule all, Gear and AA and skill all play key factors in that, and each can help make up for the other. many people at the high end end up doing most of their camping an Xpac or more back, building up to being able to do more. its part of what EQ is.
  7. Alnitak Augur

    TBM was a same-max-level expansion as TDS, so it was designed to be difficult enough to lvl 105 characters fully AA'd and group-geared in TDS. And even after "scaling" TBM HA's are on the scale of "the most difficult mobs of the era". I.e. lvl 94 trash in TBM should be and is much tougher mob than any lvl 94 VoA, RoF, CoTF or TDS mob. More HP, hits harder, more resistant. And still is just a level 94.

    Essentially, doing TBM HA at lvl 94 you go into the most difficult lvl 94 zone. Expect the beatdown.

    And considering that lvl 93 nameds in HoT can quad-7K to quad-10K, seeing a mob quad-14K 5 expansions later is not unexpected.

    Do you know what TBM HA's are good for ? To easily PL new basic or Heroic toons. At lvl 85 they can get a half of a level per HA from mob kills. So a bloodthirsty lvl 115 toon can slaughter juicy lvl 105-108 trash and a tag-along 85+ can soak up alot of experience. The good and fun way for max players to come back to the older expansion. And at the end of HA the max player donates the outsized Remnants reward to the newb to upgrade the gear too.

    At 94 - do the VoA or RoF with some CoTF HA's. Those are expansions for up-and-comin lvl 94's. TBM is for well-geared and well-developed characters. Was it from day 1, and "Scaling down" is not a salvation.
  8. Chaffe Apprentice

    The TBM missions, especially into the temple b, really are not that bad if approached in the right manner. Every single time I've heard of someone having trouble, and I've gone to help, I found the problem was pulling. It's a lost art for the most part nowadays. Pull smart. If you are getting more than one of the Biggins, you are not pulling smart.

    I recently levelled a group from lvl 85. I did gribbles and into the temple b exclusively and had my group mostly geared, tank with tbm gear and augs. Flailing about and looking where to place blame for failing this task will not help you on the next one. Make sure your tank has ac augs. Do even the heroic ac 30 ones, that's all my tank had and did not have an issue. Watch pathing. Take your time and pull intelligently. Just head north from the zone in spot, clear to the ground spawn and you should have the dropped 2 at that point. Don't charge back after clicking the items, pull the end wave mobs back to group.

    Keep at it, and heed the advice of those who have done it. You can too.
    Yinla and NameAlreadyInUse like this.
  9. The real Sandaormo Augur

    Can't just say "when i was level 94 I could handle Eleventy Threeve damage points". My gear may have been better ( from raiding ) or worse. You might not be able to take the hits in TBM but hey guess what there were 20 expansions before that to try.
  10. Skrab East Cabilis #1 Realtor

    Nah, you missed my example. Tell me, what value a Level 90 Enchanter has grouped with someone that is Level 91? It’s why it’s a terrible scaling system. Your have to structure your group in a way that considers levels. A level 87 cleric grouped with a 91 isn’t at much of a disadvantage, but a Level 87 SK/WAR/PAL grouped with a Level 91 of any other class will struggle heavily. There’s just no flexibility for a game structured around grouping to progress.

    So, while it’s technically possible and I moved my box team up through TBM HA’s, (Life, Health, Crypt of Decay, and Decay HAs) they are not structured properly for a solid leveling path. Scaling the missions up makes anyone attempting to try add random strangers nearly impossible due to needing to be a strict level range. Additionally, leveling up while the mission is active causes the mobs to scale up. It’s a very horribly thought out idea that works against creating a steady and focused leveling and gearing path for new and returning players.
  11. Dragnath Elder

    Yeah I can see that, we kept the group the same level at all times to avoid that issue.

    It is an incredibly challenging expansion but it also does wonders in gaining an understanding of how to maximize your group potential.

    I don't think I've ever gotten as much of an adrenaline rush gaming as the first time my group beat Damsel of Decay for the first time after weeks of failures.
    Coagagin likes this.
  12. Rainlover Augur

    Thrills like that is one of the things I game for. Success can’t be sweet without first the taste of failure and then working to overcome.
    Dragnath and Nennius like this.
  13. I_Love_My_Bandwidth Mercslayer

    Or scrap HA scaling altogether? There's no point in having it, no point in keeping it, and it violates Risk v Reward. You know, that pesky balance thing the Devs moved mountains to preserve just a decade ago?
  14. Dragnath Elder

    In what way does it violate risk vs reward? In CotF you either get Marks of Valor which can buy level appropriate gear, or get dropped items from the named mobs which will be level 100 and unusable if you are a lower level. TBM you get level 75 gear with garbage stats and Remnants of Tranquility which buy level appropriate augs to boost said gear.

    I personally thought the HA's in CotF and TBM were an amazing addition in the game. My previous experiences in EQ were 2000-2002 and 2011 (HoT). Coming back and starting fresh about a year ago the game came to a grinding halt when I hit around 75. The Apprentice Mercs become useless and xp rates slow massively compared to the first 75 levels. Discovering CotF HA's was a gamechanger, if not for that I would have likely quit.
    Gyurika Godofwar likes this.
  15. quakedragon Augur


    I get what your saying, but this is like a cookie cutter excuse to why this HA is hard.
    Get AA, get gear. This mission is supposed to be for returners

    I am 80% geared for current expansion at level. Also, this TBM HA, it's supposed to help get me geared.
    Autogrant AA is on.

    Yes, it's this. (btw autogrant AA is on)
    I said in another post,
    I looked up RoF NAMEDS, 101, Vilefeaster. https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/npc.html?id=41152
    When asking for my max hit questions, one thing good allah info collects is, max hit coincidently (usually nameds only). This

    101 RoF NAMED hits for max 12,200.
    While 98 trash golem at 98 hits for max 13456
    again, this TBM mission is meant for returners/newplayers catching up.

    You have to judge whether an NPC is not scaled properly, you have to look at certain numbers, you can't just say "get AC so he hits lower", everyone knows that, everyone knows get gear, that's not the point here, point is these guys are NOT SCALED properly.

    This is a mission that's for returning players too. This is current EQ way of getting returners caught up.
  16. Sissruukk Rogue One

    Blame Gribble...darn gnomes are always causing problems.
  17. CatsPaws Devil's Advocate

    No it was not made for returning players or made just to get returning players caught up. That entire expansion was made for all players. It was just that: an expansion.

    Most players who went into this expansion when it was released have done 80% of the previous expansions and have those additional stats from Mercanary and Partisian quests that also boost their stats, like heroic dexterity or whatever. Its not just armor and aa. It is also researching the quests and strategy for your group make up.

    Some of the features put in the game FOR returning players are:

    Mercs so they don't have to waste time lfg
    Tutorials - how basics work in the game and some free merc and armor to get you started
    Find key
    In game free guild
    Same starting city if F2P
    Hero's journey (which if you follow it will lead you to these missions which again are based on what you have accomplished up to this expansion.
    Daily hot zones up to level 95. Then you progress to the HA offered if you choose that path.

    It is becoming pedantic with the constant complaints of something not being tuned for "returning players" Its like this for many of us who have been in the game all along. And at some point you have returned.

    Let it go and just have fun in the game. In the long run it makes no difference what the bottom line is on the mobs stats.

    “Do or do not. There is no try.” – Yoda
  18. demi Augur

    :):):p;)
  19. Kinetic New Member

    Well, I'm a returning player that hasn't logged into the game in years. Allow me to give some veteran advice tho.

    You could add 2-3 level 75 toons to the group with your level 90 or whatever. This would scale the HA mobs down quite a bit, making it easier for you to complete the HA.

    Also, you need to understand that they dramatically decreased the exp gain from individual monsters in HA's. What they did was increase the exp for completing the HA, not killing the monsters inside the HA.

    So, Gribbles is still a thing. You just have to put low level characters in your group so it scales in your favor. Kinda like we did on LDoN dungeons during early progression server days (fippy).

    Hope it helps, good luck
  20. quakedragon Augur

    Some cookie cutter things here.
    Hero's Journey ends at 85. Hotzone gives tiny amount of xp, I hardly see anyone do these too 85-95. Terrible choices to just stay in and kill, the xp is still slow. If your a lvl 115 zoneclearing for PLing sure these are probably great. 85 xp hotzone is just too slow I can clear that zone(MMM).

    A better than cookie cutter response is Shards Landing. This is something I will try.

    My response to other returning/newplayers. Yrelia #3 https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/quest.html?quest=7268
    10% xp in about an hour with 6 hour lockout.
    Yrelia #1 https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/quest.html?quest=7266
    not too bad too, another 10% in about an hour with 6 hour lockout.
    Chances of dying are very slim. Easy to follow and do.
    Every HA I come across in Bixie Warfront is good/decent difficulty except for the one with the siege.

    This OP TBM mission, I didn't even complete, but I will try again later. (If people say they had troubles at 100 or 105 when it came out, its probably getting tougher since I'm in mid 90s, its probably a decent at 75 since 70s mobs haven't been given steroids yet)

    The thing with HA's, never know which ones are going to be overscaled, and so its not fun trying all of them anymore. After having so much anymore after having a few bad tasting ones. Doing current level'd content is one thing, but doing an HA scaled down to you, and its overscaled is another thing. Especially when thats recommended to returners/newplayers.