I box most of the time, and I frequently group with about 20 different people, most of whom don't box. I enjoy grouping with real people, even doing things I don't benefit from doing. I do use mercs to fill out my group when my guild mates are not available. For me its about using my time well. However, I avoid PUG's. The only times I really do them is when someone is in an area I need to be in for quests and its basically for kill counts only. As much as people claim that players are better than mercs, I find that PUG's with "unknown" players pretty much always sucks. If they are people I've seen online a few dozen times I may consider them, but if I don't know the name and have some kind of positive association with the name (and guild usually) I figure it will be a waste of time. About the only way you'd get me away from boxing/only grouping with people with known and good reputations would be to set up something akin to but better than WoW's dungeon finder. You get a reward for putting up with the unknowns, gain an heirloom currency I can send down to alts who actually can use the group gear I'm earning, a good experience modifier better than what I can get solo since I will probably be carrying the group anyway, and fun easy missions (because doing hard things with unknown players is infuriating). On topic, I think mercs need to be fairly balanced/smart. The trick is to get people a disproportionate reward for grouping since players have dozens of ways to offset it that bonus via stupidity.
The purpose of a non-box server is to facilitate grouping. Everybody would be LFG, so your reason for boxing is removed. Nobody would force you to play on it though, so no worries.
All this "no boxing no merc special server" sort of reminds me of how Firiona Vie was at one time. At first only one character per account on the server, trivial loot code to keep you from looting greys etc. No one complained once they removed those restrictions Next there'd be a perceived "problem" of kiters and classes that could solo. I suppose the way to fix that would be to have a mechanism where you didn't get any experience unless you were in a full six person group
Only Battleaxe and like 2 other people would play on it. Sorry but this is not going to be worth the effort. Maybe if they opened a new Progression server than people can bask in the glory of no mercs for a while but there will probably be much rejoicing once they are unlocked. Again, you can't force people to group. You can't dig up 1999 and pretend that that old mojo is back again. Even if there was a new progression server, that still won't stop boxing. Honestly I do not even see how they could ever block boxing unless there was scripting to regulate customers to only one account active per IP address. Then you get into an issue where people on the same household ISP can't play together. Plus, boxing makes SoE money from use of accounts that would otherwise be idle. The whole thought of limiting boxing or mercs just is not practical from any perspective. I would not go as far as to say its stupid, but its definitely naive.
If people actually wanted to group, there would be no need to encourage them to do so. People need to group to do a lot of things (at higher levels at least), so those that don't have friends or strong social skills and can't/won't box need a readily available pool of human assets to do what they want. So they try to think up ways to force others into that pool, couching their ideas in friendly terms like "encouraging socialization" or "building community". The real problem stems from the need to group. Add a chanter merc. Let every player have 5 mercs at a time. Problem solved. Those who want to group, will. The other 98% of us can still get our done, with neither the hassles of dealing with other people nor the frustrations of having too few others with whom to deal necessitating threads like these...
My goodness Voodoo, my suggestions once again where to encourage people who play a multiplayer game to socialize, not to change things so dramatically that people such as yourself would be forced into a group and ruin the fun for others. I fully support your right to be a loner. My suggestions don't harm anyone who solos or Molos or boxes, they where more like tossing a cookie to those who enjoy team play. Side note: I really like the suggestion of bonus marks awarded to those in full groups for heroic missions... Wish I thought of that.
Supporting their right to be a loner but willing to penalize them for it by suggesting bonuses for full groups. People that want to socialize is only one part of the way people play. Offering a bonus to groups favors exactly two kinds of play methods, full groups and boxers that box full groups. That's it. I'm not at all against getting more people involved in things but alienating people because of the way they play is not the answer. Some like to group, some don't. Some will group occasionally, others never will no matter what the circumstances. Some people like to play in groups where it's nonstop blabbing, some enjoy the peace and quiet of soloing or with a merc. Some people only group with friends, some only with guildies. And there are others that group with strangers consistently. Some like company, some like to be left alone. et al. These things will never change. It comes down to all of us paying for the same game knowing we can all log in and play the way that makes us happy but when you start rewarding specific playstyles people start complaining, with good reason. I don't like the suggestion. If a full group completes the mission and I also complete the mission with just myself and a merc we ultimately did the same thing so why should the group be entitled to a greater benefit for the exact same accomplishment? Who knows, I may have even done it faster. I appreciate what some people's end goal is, to get the game to be more sociable but it's not going to magically happen. Besides, full groups already get an experience bonus which didn't used to be the case back when.
Interesting points Mr. Nip but the game is about socialization and already gives massive bonuses for such team activities. It's called a raid. The rewards for such teamwork are people who can play in the same sandbox successfully get the best toys. Like it or not the game was designed around socialization, this is why raiding gives premium loot and characters are not all exactly identical. The bonuses suggested don't harm any play style, they just tip the scales a tiny bit toward picking a real person over a merc. (If it gives the guy who pays for 6 accounts a little cheese too it's not the end of the world)
Yeah, I think I know a thing or two about raids. They already added a bonus some time ago specifically for this reason, eg., the bonus for groups without mercs. Now it's just a, "That's great but now we want more" culture. Next time it will be even more yet again. People will group and people will not group and the only thing this would do in the grand scheme of things is give the people that are already grouping more of a bonus then they already have, even if it is minor. If something went in and the average person were asked if they noticed more groups lately the answer would probably be, "no, not really". One thing to add: I don't care if they address it or not, it makes no difference to me what they do, just bringing up counterpoints as adding more group bonuses isn't a fix-all.
I disagree - the game lacks the range of features that I would expect from an environment focused on socialization. You actually said the relevant word yourself there - "Team". The game is about providing a range of challenges which require greater or lesser levels of teamwork to accomplish. Teamwork is not socialization. Molo, group, mini-raid, raid. These are all types of team, not types of social community. Any recent mmo with a dungeon-finder can create a group for you when you need one, but I wouldn't call the resulting pug any kind of socialization. Don't believe me? Go play Neverwinter or FFXIV
Please give them their server where you can only have one character, or some way to keep out boxers. Then deny the chance of ever transferring off the server to one of the evil boxing servers so we don't have to hear this anymore. Do the same with a classic server.
To go out even further on a tangent. Team and socialization are for me two words that go together like a horse and carriage. Having played football, baseball, hockey, and soccer for many years at a non-professional level the mass majority of people I know who participate in team activities for 0 money are doing it precisely for social reasons. (Keeping a few pounds off also does not hurt). The loot is short lived, the glory of scoring a goal lasts hours, but friendships as a result of these activities can last forever. I must admit that my life experience with teamwork was not formed entirely with video games so your difference of opinion is noted.
Wrong. Recently I have grouped with several people who were not afraid to tell it like it is. To quote them directly, "boxing has ruined the game".
Fair enough, I wasn't clear - I was disagreeing that this game is about (I read this as "specifically designed around") socialization, not that team games and socialization are not natural companions.
So? I've grouped with people who say that the only reason that they can still play the game is because they can box A poll of "several" is pretty meaningless. I really fail to see how myself and a friend each 2 boxin with a couple of merc out can ruin the game for you but I'll have to take your word for it I suppose
Boxing didn't ruin the game. People who believe that don't remember what actually happened. People left in droves when other games came out decreasing the population and some changes in the game drove people away. If you wanted to do something that you couldn't find a cleric for, you just didn't do it. If the cleric in the group went AFK, the group ground to a halt, and if your cleric decided they were more interested in doing something else, it usually meant the end of the group entirely unless you could find a replacement quickly. Boxing is a symptom, not the cause. Mercs were a symptom, not a cause. The game being so group-centric, them having no interest in drawing new players, the disinterest people have now with games that are like second jobs compared to almost every other game in the industry, the disinterest the dev team and management seem to have with changing a lot of areas "just because", etc. Those are causes. When people get options they use them. When options were given that were more solo and group friendly than EQ ever was people chose to move go elsewhere. People started boxing more than any other reason because they felt the need to in order to get things done. Now it is much more necessary than ever. Yes, there are those who prefer to play by themselves, which is no one's business but theirs, but lack of players was the leading cause of boxing and mercs.
How about this compromise - Sony makes a cross-server LFG tool that creates pugs just like any modern mmo's dungeon-finder tool. Then you guys can all group up without worrying whether we evil boxers are saturating your server cap or killing your puppies or whatever. And we'll hopefully never ever have to hear from you again . Well, except when you failed to find groups you'd probably tell us that boxing affects the LFG tool's selection code or some other nonsense...
What if you can't find a group, do you sit and wait? People moloing/boxing is their right, everyone plays for different reasons. I have had pick up groups who say I pull to fast, so what am I supposed to do slow down for others who can't keep up? Easier to Box and do it myself. Nobody should be penalized for their play-style, as long as their not disrupting others game play. Forcing people to group will only decrease the population.
