Time to end the failed "Truebox" idea?

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Geoff, Sep 9, 2019.

  1. Geoff Journeyman

    This game mode style was created to combat two problems that surfaced on Ragefire and Lockjaw.
    1) Mass Mages
    ---<Solved> Not by Truebox as was intended but MOTM - It was no longer viable for worthwhile content
    2) Full "The Bad Program" groups and raids
    ---<Not Solved>
    Reading the forums and actually playing the game, one will notice that the longer a server stays active, the amount of people playing only one account decreases. Unfortunately, Truebox keeps these servers from maintaining a healthy population due to the hassle of maintaining multiple computers. The average person will only put in this much work.

    While the "The Bad Program" agreement to stay off Truebox servers was upheld by the largest developer, the software is opensource. Anyone with the technical expertise of a nerdy high school Junior can watch a few YouTube videos and create the needed offsets.

    There are ways around Truebox and "The Bad Program" that many use. The forums are littered with proof of that and so it isn't necessary to point it out other than to say "The Truebox Concept has failed"

    TLDR: Consider removing Truebox restrictions and police the actual game
  2. That0neguy Augur

    Stop yelling at me with your large text....

    Also how do you know why truebox was created?
  3. sumnayin Augur

    I wouldn't play on a non-truebox server unless they came up with a new idea. I played Fippy when it came out...me and my brother were so excited(we both played from 1999-2004)...then we saw mage armies killing raid bosses...no thanks.
  4. Jaera Augur

    This was already solved, on Ragefire no less, by the introduction of Mitigation of the Mighty. It was further made irrelevant by the addition of Agents of Change.

    Truebox had nothing to do with solving this, as evidenced by the fact people are still botting with them as soon as a from-classic progression server goes live. All Truebox does is hurt legitimate players who want to play more than one character so they can do stuff without being hamstrung by the requirement to find others who may have no interest in what they're doing.
    Icaen likes this.
  5. TLP Addict Augur

    On what basis is Truebox "failed"?

    Phinny was a success and is still going.

    Agnarr was successful until it stagnated due to lack of new content and Coirnav releasing.

    Coirnav was successful until the 20th Anniversary servers launched.

    Truebox seems to be going just fine in spite of more and more people finding ways to circumvent or simply acquiring more equipment.
    Xanathol likes this.
  6. Aegir Augur

    Played Ragefire before and after MoTM. Didn't change much to the fact that after a couple of months, The majority of the server was running around with their own private 6box group including myself. Was fun for a while but then it just got meh. I know some love that style of play, but at least the first "classic" expansions should involve some interaction with other players before we go into the more Guild/Network era of progressing in EQ.

    But yeah... Let's call a spade a spade.

    Truebox had that magic with Phinigel Server. But has ever since with every new TLP launch with Truebox ruleset, become more and more a joke and a false product.

    There are no where enough ressources/priority allocated to enforce this kind of ruleset. Heck, I even doubt there are enough ressources allocated to enforce and protect any rules on any live server atm.
  7. oldkracow Augur

    There are so many exploits now that truebox is the least they should worry about. :rolleyes:
    Xanathol likes this.
  8. Ajjantis Elder

    Time to enforce the truebox rules. I will never ever touch a non true box server. Go away with that crap.
  9. Ceffener Augur

    You overestimate our public school system.
  10. code-zero Augur

    Truebox is enforced within the programming and no amount of live humans puttering around is going to help with any VM workarounds since that's something that would require the program to catch. Truebox was created allegedly to
    according to the Phinigel FAQ but apparently all it did was to encourage training and lots of false accusations to fly around in addition to clever people figuring out how to from groups with their alts.

    A while back one of the people who regularly posts hours long videos of accused botters complained that despite having sent in 100+ petitions on that group that nothing was done. I suspect that person had gone to the list of problem people and was being ignored. Perhaps if Daybreak started handing out suspensions for being a jerk to customer service more could be done
  11. Darchon_Xegony Augur

    Figure out some other way to manage it but Truebox isn’t working to stop bad actors from automating groups 24/7.

    It also makes no sense for any box limiting code to exist in the back half of the EQ expansions. Especially once SoD comes in with Mercenaries. Truebox or whatever replacement they can come up with should end in SoD. By that point on Live many people were regularly boxing.
  12. Crowley New Member

    I agree. Truebox does not do any good, and should be removed.

    If you cannot see the mass amounts of boxing that still takes place on these so called truebox servers, then you need your eyes checked. The problem on Lockjaw and Ragefire extended beyond the mage armies. The biggest issue was open world targets being locked down by 1 guild mostly on each server. People cried, DBG responded. When Phinny released the truebox code helped some at first, but the people who wanted to found ways around the truebox code. What made future TLPs successful was raid instancing. Why? Well not only did it allow guilds access to raiding who couldn't keep up with the big boys, it allowed guilds to get away from competing with the mass boxers for raid targets, and armor mobs ( think about fear, and hate ).

    As the OP mentioned truebox actually hurts after awhile. Sure the servers are booming in Classic and Kunark. As the first few expacs come out they start to slow down. When a new TLP releases they really take a hit. Even in Kunark I sat LFG several times for an hour or longer. What do I do? Log off and play something else. If I could box 2-3 toons on my one machine then I would do that until i found a group. And you know what else happens when i do that? DBG earns an extra $30 a month in revenue. I quit playing on phinny, and agnarr already because of lack of groups and the ability to box.

    Truebox is not needed with AoC in place. Get rid of it already. People already work around it, and it's silly to pretend otherwise. Not all of us want to buy multiple machines to box. I'm sure if I added 2-3 pcs to my office my wife would pack her bags. Let people who want to box enjoy the game as well.
    Icaen likes this.
  13. Chuuk Augur

    As has been said - anyone who can read and use the unimaginably difficult-to-comprehend search engine known as Google, can circumvent Truebox with the virtual machine software that shall not be named. Basically, if you put forth a regulation, you NEED to be able to manage it. Clearly, you (DBG) cannot manage Truebox because everyone and their sister is exploiting it.

    In this case, Truebox only hurts the 2-3 boxer who wants to play by the rules but now has to dingle around with 3 machines. The mass-boxer, whom I suspect this was intended to stop, is just using a ton of VMs on his single PC. Hell, I would be that even my crummy laptop from 2012 could run 3-4 VMs (limited by RAM) right now - and probably 6+ if I actually upgraded it. Imagine what a decent gaming desktop could do...

    Let the mass boxers dominate OW content - no one really cares now that we have DZs and let me easily operate a 3-box without having to (easily) break the EULA with VMs or wrangle together 3 PCs.

    It won't matter tho - in 2047 when Pantheon comes out, all of our problems will be solved!
    Icaen likes this.
  14. Accipiter Augur


    I mistakenly read that as, "Perhaps if Daybreak started handing out suspensions for being a jerk in customer service more could be done." ;)
    code-zero likes this.
  15. Pikollo Augur

    My main complaint is the fact that the people who are obviously circumventing the truebox code do not get into trouble. So they are "allowed" to run 10 toons by cheating and its ok. But those of us who do not want to cheat but would like to run multi accounts on seperate windows are not allowed to. If the server is Truebox then the rules should be enforced to everyone. If they are not then just remove the Truebox code.

    Personally I think removing the code is both good and bad. Good because I'm sure more of us would be paying/buying krono for more accounts. I personally have 3 accounts and 3 PCs but I don't like using a 3rd keyboard so I only play 2. So in the end they could get more money out of removing the code. It's bad because of the obvious. Not just the cheaters will be running 3+ toons any more so less groups (for those that don't box). Probably more trains, more camps farmed etc. The picks help this a lot though.

    And just to add. I'm not saying every 3+ boxer is a cheater or they are using VM's. But a lot of them are using VM's and other programs to run them and its pretty obvious. Also the Truebox thing will be moot when Selo gets mercs.
  16. Tymeless Augur

    i agree with raid instancing i think true box should be sunset. I personally prefer to group up with people and will continue to do so if it is but lets be real here the rules aren't being enforced on the big time boxers we already know that and the warping we are seeing for people to get open world stuff so lets even the playing field and give everyone options so they aren't breaking the terms of service to combat this since DBG isn't doing anything about it.
  17. Fluid Augur

    Verb[edit]

    pull a Homer
    1. (informal, humorous) To succeed despite idiocy.
    Truebox is a raging<sic> success.

    Convinced f2p they would get something better if they only coughed up money.
    Convinced people with more money then brains or class they could look like good players by throwing money at their shortcomings.
    Convinced RMT they could make a living by taking advantage of the weakness and fragile egos found in group #2.
    Convinced veterans they could again find a place where grouping and team play was important.
    Forced players to use Market Place to have any chance of keeping up with bug abusers and exploiters.
    Mo money, mo money, mo money. Remember bot armies need a plethora of Kronos.
  18. Pikollo Augur

    Just to add. Not all people who box keep to themselves. Most of the boxers I know (including myself) keep their boxes outside of group for buffs/heals whatever. Allowing people to box doesn't mean the end to grouping with real people.
  19. Trevalon Augur

    I still think Truebox is a good addition to the servers pre-DON.

    The problem isnt Truebox - tis Daybreaks complete and utter disregard of the game and lack of any sort of decency in policing the people who are Automating gameplay.

    Honestly I dont think they have GMs anymore - The reason they dont go after automated play anymore is because Gms are just bots themselves and Bots to rat other bots!
  20. Radical New Member

    The game is just fine. I never really cared for true box, but I don't hate it either. DBG is doing fine. I'm sort of looking forward to seeing what the November TLP is going to look like. Heroic players and House of Thule, but what are the other details?

    How do you know they are cheating? Just because you can't afford several laptops, doesn't mean others can't. I was running six a few weeks ago, and one trader in tunnel for a total of seven. But it becomes a grind. Sometimes you just want to lay on the sofa with a laptop on your belly and take it easy with one toon.

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