Test Update 8/08/2014 - Pet Changes Round 3

Ok I think this is getting out of hand. Let's stop comparing pets and other classes. I know with any nerf, you have to point and say hey look what they can do. BUT, I'm sure Aristo is pulling his hair out at this point. Nobody is gaining anything at this point.

I think people have posted plenty of parses and experiences with pets at each step of the proposed changes. I think we would do best just parsing or sharing how pets are performing currently on test. I think they have showed that they are going to keep pets very viable as tanks, they just needed to fix the DI problem and tweak them back up to where they should be. I raged quit myself, but let's just try to see if this ends up not being that big of a deal or not. After seeing pets on test now, they are listening and I'm sure they want everyone to be happy and enjoy the game.

That bolded line, thats very nice humour. You should ask the SKs you play with about their pets.

I didn't answer cause I am not sure, if I have time while not raiding it has been spent on Test. Side note, this is Test v3.0.

I was using them because if you're not comparing a pet to a fully defensed warrior, you're not being honest... and if you're not tanking a pet on the best of the best trash mobs, you're not being honest...

Or so this thread goes.

I was wondering earlier how the pet does on multiple mobs in all zones BUT Argin Hiz and Tower of Rot. I would guess they can easily handle 2, maybe even 3 with just a merc at any given time.

If that's not the kind of content mages think they should be able to solo 2-3 at a time on, well, you're just projecting your own ideals towards the devs too. I'll play around with it later.

Harder content obviously implies/demands more careful play.

Also,

Your pet tanks much better than a raid geared ranger. All of the pet classes are harping on those situational abilities PCs outperform pets. This is one of them.

On the subject of the mitigation buff, it has a 10k damage cap and is currently ripped off *very* quickly. Plus it isn't our fault that they made current content root-immune...

well SK pets are supposed to be beefed up with the patch - maybe they will use them more. If not, then the devs are wasting their time with SK pets?

Pet enrage is working, but NPC strikethrough is causing it to fail frequently. This is the case for RS and regular pets.

[Sun Aug 10 11:29:33 2014] Bonaiele`s pet has become ENRAGED.

[Sun Aug 10 11:29:35 2014] A broken treespirit tries to hit Bonaiele`s pet, but Bonaiele`s pet ripostes!

[Sun Aug 10 11:29:35 2014] A broken treespirit hits Bonaiele`s pet for 3650 points of damage.

[Sun Aug 10 11:29:37 2014] A broken treespirit tries to bash Bonaiele`s pet, but Bonaiele`s pet ripostes!

[Sun Aug 10 11:29:37 2014] A broken treespirit hits Bonaiele`s pet for 9411 points of damage.

[Sun Aug 10 11:29:37 2014] Bonaiele`s pet has been slain by a broken treespirit!

[Sun Aug 10 11:33:42 2014] Bonaiele`s pet has become ENRAGED.

[Sun Aug 10 11:33:44 2014] An avenging treesoul tries to hit Bonaiele`s pet, but Bonaiele`s pet ripostes!

[Sun Aug 10 11:33:44 2014] An avenging treesoul tries to hit Bonaiele`s pet, but Bonaiele`s pet ripostes!

[Sun Aug 10 11:33:44 2014] An avenging treesoul tries to hit Bonaiele`s pet, but Bonaiele`s pet ripostes!

[Sun Aug 10 11:33:44 2014] An avenging treesoul hits Bonaiele`s pet for 12017 points of damage.

[Sun Aug 10 11:33:44 2014] Bonaiele`s pet has been slain by an avenging treesoul!

The RS pet is tanking better than it was before, but still needs some improvement. It still dies vs a T1 CotF trash mob before it can be recast. I measured the RS pet (EM 20) with ~153k HP (comes with 66% = 100k summoned). It would help if the RS pet had more AC and HP - it costs a lot of mana, and doesn't last very long. I am not sure how much HP/AC is appropriate, but it needs to at least live for its full duration.

To address your two points.....

1) I asked for your definition of a solo class. You never answered the question. Delbaeth's answer is silly as solo classes have been soloing since 1999 and as of 07/15 (the day before the nerf) thousands of players were happily soloing all over Norrath. Please answer it..... Oh yeah and the sharks in EQ don't have lasers.

2) We simply went to the end zone of the game, with the intent to tank the toughest mobs we could find. I remembered a place where I routinely got adds and trashed a few times so we went there. When Burtial gets online we can finish the parses in that zone, and then go to another. Pick your mob.

Maybe that expectation is the problem. Maybe pet classes shouldn't intend to go to the end zone and tank the toughest mobs.....but they expect too and apparently .....still can.

Necro war pets on live have a higher base DI1 rate that doesn't collapse versus named mobs. Necro war pets are very close to 35% DI1 rate on live without pet gear while there at 28-29% on test without pet gear. That DI1 rate is basically cut in half versus a named mob on test while it stays at roughly the same on live. Player not being hit by mobs have a very small drop off versus named mobs not a 50% like happens to necro war pets on test.

The rapid drop off in DI1 hits versus named mobs and swarm pets dieing to fast are the main issues issue left.

As a necromancer I would rather have a pet that cant tank two yellows but maintains a at least 30% DI1 rate versus named rather then a pet that can tank two yellows but has its DI1 rate cut in half versus named.

Yes, and for multiples, since our pet avoids so poorly, the DI variances often add up to drain your hp so much that you're left in a healing/rune loop, or it kills your pet outright.

It is this TWO MOB SCENARIO (2 or more) that needs the most attention.

I've been running doubles today with my meager EM19 pet, and he has been getting slaughtered.

Slaughtered.

This isn't to say I can't ever do it, because I can, but it takes an enormous effort to merely keep my pet sustained while doing MAYBE 20 percent of a soft burn.

Current Situation:

1. Pet does fine on a single blue mob. Good job, Aristo.
2. Pet struggles mightily against 2 blue mobs. Please help us, Aristo.
3. A standard should be set to define "good" in such a way that it jibes with our historic ability (before mercs). Please help us, Aristo.
4. Our RS line needs to be reverted. Please help us, Aristo.
5. To accomplish (3) the developers could reinstate runes (to a degree) for one thing, and in other ways suggested by Nylrem et al. Nylrem has good ideas up there. Or do (whatever) that will aid us with this goal please, Aristo.

Baramos Brinstar

Tanks historically took longer than 10 seconds (complete heal) to kill, often times tanking 2 mobs, without any mitigation running.

History is just that.

History.

Game dynamics change, the way you play and what you can, and cannot accomplish changes.

Yeah your going to bring a Lot of Rangers in here now. If your a Solo class then you should be awful in groups and raids, If i am a Group class then i should out shine you everywhere in a group on everything. Stop this stupid i am a solo class that has to be Great DPS have Great Tank option, Be better then everyone else etc. Please Leave Rangers out of this i kind of felt sorry for the changes to mages until you posted this.

Take a chill man, I was responding like most of the posters above me to Hannil-luclin's parse of rangers killing several mobs at once.

Pretty sure Danille could molo 3 Argin Hiz mobs. He should run rings around Denial on test.

But would he want to show that. Maybe Ronthorn has an idea there that one class cant have it all. Maybe Pets scaling reversed how many is in group means they are useless in raids and poor in groups but awesome solo.

Bah. I'm still doubtful I could molo the two yellow cons in the NW area.
Not sure how Denial did it, but looking forward to parsing and trying it once Brutial and I are online at the same time.
Regardless it will get done.
I'm also looking forward to the game room at SOE Live, hopefully they will have some of the PC's setup on test server so we can mess around while the developers are watching.

I imagine it's going to look something like this when the people in this thread meet up irl:

I just had to use frenzied + blessing + groundswell + last second rejuvenate to dig my em20 pet out out from 5% HP with reactive cleric healing against 3 blue cons in a HA on live. The words from developers of "make an effort" and "not be afk" were certainly echoing in my ears there

Been trying out the different pets against mobs in Valley that I molo a lot. Really notice the HP swing, which is much bigger than before. With a merc I don't think I ever had my pet below 90% before the changes. Now I noticed large chunks of hps dropping during some bad rounds. I'm sure this is the new DI working properly. Overall it's still not where I hope they end up by any means, but at least I have hope that they aren't going to completely ruin pets. Hoping for another small bump up next patch and a fix for the swarm pets, which are kinda ridiculous right now.

I like the Mage, the Pet is really nice. Your going to nerf it thats fine. Unlike most of the other classes it is an absolutely huge AA sink. A mage's damage is laughable compared to all other classes without the pet I think. You sit here and say this needs to be It is what the mage is in your opinion a summoner. Yet, the necro can have out his 90, 95, and 100th level swarm pets all at the same time. Those 9 little guys tank really well in a pinch. Could you at least put the servants on different timers for mages? Yeah go ahead parse that the 9 necro skeletons damages v. 1 servant a mage has.