Stop asking for a TLP merge, it's not necessary.

Of course they don't know. But know when really "knows". Yes we all can tell there is a real tangible interest in new progression servers. But I understand as a business, SOE has to weigh their options. They are trying to develop new content and bring in NEW customers and potential customers for all their products.

Special rule set servers for this particular game isn't really going to achieve that. As much as I love this game (the older content specifically), I'm willing to admit that.
Now thats not to say it can't make them loads of money and turn profit. But considering the kind of oldschool mmorpg it is and the competition of gaming out there...its simply not going to bring in LOADS of new players.

they should just reset vulak server prog and offer anyone there a server xfer if they dont like it.

the problem with vulak isn't the community...lots of folks (i.e. the ones still there) like the small community and the stable status quo the server has fallen into.

A year ago, I think a lot of folks that have quite vulak would have stayed if a merge happened...but, that time has long passed. The folks that are left don't mind the smaller community imo. Most people live in their guilds (there are only about 3 active guilds), each has their niche, and they don't step on its others toes nearly as much as they did during classic/kunark. It is a small but stable and happy community, for the most part.

Eventually, a merge will probably happen when SOE launches their next special rule set server.

don't like what? having their character deleted?

what % do you think that will be?

I disagree, again. How many prospective new players do you think will actually enjoy breaking into the game now? There are 100 levels of content, there are hundreds of totally empty zones, and the population is so top-heavy you're lucky to find a single group during the first 75 levels.

The beauty of EverQuest wasn't just the social nature; it was truly a world to explore, with an incredibly diverse set of areas to level with friends and strangers alike. A lot of that beauty has been mitigated on the traditional servers, and thus the allure of the game for newer players is significantly diminished - unless you have a setting that starts everyone on an even playing field.

If SOE marketed EverQuest and the progression servers properly, I have no doubt that would be the best way to not only entice old players into returning, but to finally get some of the players who have heard of EQ through their years of other MMO's to try it for the first time. Releasing new expansions that expand content for players leveled 100 to 105 does nothing to further expand the fan base.

Sony is frankly not going to put all their mmorpg eggs in one basket. This has been made painfully clear to me. They are not only trying to keep the rabid fans of current content happy, but also they have to work on new projects that have nothing to do with this game.
Trust me, I wish the progression craze was top priority. As I've said many many times in this forum, they would have my money for the rest of my days. But they have obviously decided to throw the minimal investment into the progression idea and let it be. I mean, the tlp servers aren't even on the server list if you aren't a gold sub. They don't even advertise within their own game.

We've been through this a zillion times on these boards, but I'll sum up the opposing viewpoint:

1. The stuff that you are talking about is 10+ year old content. There just aren't that many new players who want to experience content that hit the market during the Clinton Administration. There are a few, for sure, but progression servers are for old school players. With all due respect, the idea that a progression server or a classic server would bring new players to EQ1 is wishful thinking by people who want a progression or classic server for their own reasons. It's a rationalization that persuades no one but those who are already persuaded.

2. The number of old school players who would return for a progression server has diminished and will continue to diminish over time. There are two reasons for this. First, there are only so many times that most people want to go back, start from scratch, and do the same old content. Second, and more fundamentally, people get older, and their lives change. The paradigmatic old school EQ player was 23ish, single, and just getting started with life. Now that person is 33ish, married, with kids and a career. That person may still play online games, but it's never going to be the same.

3. Fippy/Vulak showed convincingly that a considerable amount of development work would be necessary to make the progression model work on a time-locked basis. The old world seemed huge in 1999, but in 2013 it is anything but huge. For a lot of people, Fippy/Vulak was a horror show during the old world era. In order to make it workable, there would need to be development -- instanced zones for the dragons, Hate, Fear, etc. and probably instanced zones for some of the major XP areas. If you think that SOE is going to devote those sorts of resources, see Malachi's post.

It wouldn't surprise me to see another special rules server at the anniversary this year, but I'd be surprised to see another progression server while Fippy and Vulak are still going. Without a major development effort, the progression server concept is probably good for one or two more tries before it ceases to be viable.

Reload Ing Pleasewaiit, when it was active, proved this statement false. A good number of players in RIP were players that were entirely new to EverQuest who joined the game and our guild because our GL posted about us a popular Chinese forum.

Some people like that, but the majority of players do not. Not all of us wished for it, so no thanks.

1) I know there are a number of people who came on to EQ solely because they had an opportunity to start over with everyone else. And I know there are a number of people who are willing to come on, if only SOE gave them that same opportunity. And that's from word-of-mouth player advertisement! You don't need to embrace the concept of advertising to understand that SOE isn't helping its own case with this. If they did, they would have more new players. The fact is, all the players who currently subscribe know full well about the Rain of Fear expansion, and those who never played EQ look at it and, in all likelihood, say to themselves: 'Great, players in that game get to go from 95 to 100. How does that help me, a player that would start off at level 1 and alone, essentially playing a single-player MMO for the first 100+ logged hours of game time?' The fact is, SOE advertises their progression content poorly, as Malachi alluded to, and that is the chief culprit when it comes to expanding the game to a different subsect of people, not the age of the content. New players still log into World of Warcraft for the first time every day, and that's over eight years old. People are craving a sandboxy experience these days now more than ever, and I know this sounds ludicrous to those who understand the history of the MMO industry, but EQ is the closest thing to that experience now that EA has all but abandoned UO.

2) I do not believe that at all. I interacted with hundreds of people during the Fippy/Vulak server restart that were full-blown 'adults' and it didn't stop them from logging in to experience their dose of nostalgia. In fact, over time, I'd bet the desire for that nostalgia only increases for the old player base. Lots of them have jobs, and families, and other such responsibilities (myself included), but that wouldn't stop people from coming back to enjoy this game, if only even casually. Nowadays, their time resources may be more limited, but their bank accounts are most assuredly larger - they have the flexibility to log only 8ish hours/week while still being able to legitimize the $15/month cost. A lot of those players that I enjoyed the game with back in March-May 2011 stopped once the servers shut down for weeks on end (thanks to Anonymous). Frankly, it was a public relations gaffe at the time to continue on with the progression timeline as if nothing had happened. The population in Vulak cut by half once the servers returned - I'd bet if SOE has their anti-hacking stuff in order the next time around, they'll keep the interest of the casual players far longer than they did the last time.

3) If SOE likes the idea of maintaining the lifespan of their oldest, most well-known intellectual property, then I think it only makes sense to make progression servers a consistent part of that process. Even if you'd want me to submit to the notion that a newer player base is essentially inaccessible in this present day, you'll have to concede that continuously releasing expansions meant for only the people who have been playing the game since the beginning of time does nothing for the [mostly] currently untapped resource that is the old, nostalgia-induced player base. As I stated in a previous post - I played this game from the first day the servers were opened until about June 2004. Even with that amount of time spent playing EverQuest, the current game is so inaccessible to me that even if I tried to play again (I have), I wouldn't have the first idea of how to get myself to a level that I'd actually start being able to interact with freakin' people. It's a frustrating cycle of irritation, because I so want to enjoy the world again, I so want to experience the world again - it's the only MMO I have any desire to play right now, and that's been the case for a solid couple years (since, you guessed it, the start of the Fippy/Vulak servers) - but in its current state, it'd simply be too much time invested in a single-player experience so alien to the actual heart and soul of EQ that I have no desire to currently return.

TL;DR version: I'm begging you, Sony - from Piestro all the way up to Smedley - to help me, to help thousands of others, relive that fantastic, wonderful world of Norrath again. From the beginning, as it was meant to be experienced.

Indeed, the only current online gaming world worth reliving.

Speaking of UO. I've been playing on a shard that is dedicated to reliving the second age of that game. Very fun. Perfect home for me till the next special rule set server launches.

Anyway, EQ was never really good at trying to expand the player base by any other means than letting their game speak for itself. I've seen one commercial (11 years ago) for EQ. I think there was some sort of artical in gamepro or something that actually led me to try it out some 13ish years ago. They aren't the kind of outfit to enlist Chuck Norris and Mr. T to entice new players.

Which is perfectly fine, but there are other ways to advertise; like, for example, a simple banner advert on, say, mmorpg.com saying 'Relive the original online experience that made EverQuest Gamespot's 1999 Game of the Year! New Progression servers releasing xx/xx/xx' with some random shots of Firiona Vie/Nagafen/big fat ogres.

I'm not a fan of the whole Mr. T/Chuck Norris advert avenue either. Letting the game do most of the talking with a little bit of help along the way is one thing; leaving the game like it's an island in a picturesque locale and expecting it to attract visitors based on its existence alone is entirely another.

Lol - I think you have the wrong person, bro. I never led a guild - or even had a character named Xanadas on fippy. My main is Xanadas on druzzil ro.

I love the people who tell stories about playing on fippy or vulak, then complain about how the game became un-fun or the population became too low so they quit, but now want another new progression server. What are they going to do 6-9-12 months into thew new server? Quit again then call for a 4th new progression server? These people need to stop and read what they're typing before wasting more cyberspace lol.

Launching another progression server will only scrape a handful of people off live and probably even fewer actual new subs or eq-returnees. As was said earlier in a post here, the people wanting to re-live the early days of EQ are already playing on Fippy or Vulak and are unlikely to leave the progression server they are already working hard on.

If Sony was smart, they would have put even MORE time between enabling each expansion . The fact that the TLP servers are almost on DODH right now is just about enough to turn-off anyone thinking about coming back to EQ and reliving the glory days on a TLP. "Glory days" is very subjective but I think we can all agree its basically vanilla through PoP, with some also including GoD and maybe even OoW.

If Sony had forced maybe a 4 to 6 month wait (or even longer, IMO) between each expansion, the people who are just now hearing about TLP servers and getting excited about it would be much more likely to actually re-sub and jump in knowing they are only 2 or 3 expansions behind. Ask yourself: Would you be excited to re-sub and start fresh on a TLP that is already at DoDH? Probably not.

IMO, the sad conclusion is that the TLPs were allowed to unlock too fast - and its too little too late. If unlocked slower, I submit that Fippy and Vulak could have had twice the population they currently do.

How many is a good number? 10? 20? And given that you say that the guild is no longer active, what does that tell us?

Okay, so what's the number? I never denied that would be some. However, it's far fetched that the number is large. That's just wishful thinking by people who want a progression/classic server for their own reasons.

I don't deny that. But they got their dose of nostalgia. Your assumption is that they will endlessly keep coming back for another dose.

Sure, and they've launched two different sets of progression servers. It is a consistent part of the process. There will doubtlessly be a third set at some point in time.

Sure. The expansions are designed for people who play the current game.

It's really not that hard, but you have to accept the fact that you're playing the modern game and not the game that existed in 2002. If you want to camp the aviaks in South Karana, it's going to be a lonely existence that lasts for a long, long time. The current game has a nice neat progression (the Hero's Journey) that will take you to level 80 or so. It's fairly easy at the lower levels, especially with a merc. It gets increasingly challenging as you move along. Armor upgrades are built into the HJ, so you'll come out at the end of process with a full set of gear that is appropriate for level 80.

Admittedly, groups are sparse at lower levels. You have to get caught up with the playerbase. But it's not as hard as you seem to think. I rejoined the game last summer. I've puttered around a bit with different characters. I am hardly a powergamer. Still, my highest level characters are level 78 with about 1500 AAs. If I was focusing more on those two characters, they'd probably be around level 90 now. You can do it, if you want to. If you don't want to, that's cool.

Possibly, but you have to account for the impact of a 4 to 6 month wait on the people who are already playing on the server. Until GoD, every expansion opened on the first vote. I dread to imagine what would have happened if the server population on Fippy had been forced to wait 6 months before Kunark opened.

I tried playing on Vox a month or so after I had quit playing on Vulak but couldn't do it any more. It's not that it's difficult with a merc but it is boring as hell. I got to level 30 and then stopped playing, its not for me. I couldn't handle playing EQ solo for another 50-60 levels + the time it takes to raise AA points. I can't see why anyone would want to play most of the game this way, especially players new to the game. EQ is just so much better when played with other players.

As for the first part - that's patently untrue. The hack-job by [Anonymous] and the subsequent server shutdown caused many people to be turned off from the Sony experience for a couple months after the fact - and frankly, for good reason. The people I know that quit did not quit because they weren't enjoying the game - they quit because the aforementioned extraneous issues made them feel uncomfortable with giving their credit card information to Sony. I know that I personally stopped playing because the three-ish weeks the servers were down essentially made me reset my schedule. When the servers finally returned, I didn't feel comfortable fitting the game back into my schedule, because I had no confidence in how much longer the server would stay active until another unplanned shutdown. Lots of people felt this way.

And the second part - I think the people who want to relive the early days are no longer playing on Fippy/Vulak, because who in the world considers DoDH 'early days'? They're simply committed to their characters by this point, which is awesome for them; I wish I had that same level of commitment. I don't. A large part of the reason why I (and many others) don't is because of the system shutdown almost two years ago. I've stated this already, but I'd be more than willing to play EQ on live servers if it wasn't such a lonely, hopelessly single-player gaming experience for the grand majority of the time. That's not EQ to me. People can enjoy and appreciate their mercenaries all they like; I hope to never, ever use them, and instead actually enjoy the company of others while I slowly trudge through the levels. Even if I started today, right now, on the Fippy/Vulak servers (progression's current so-called 'haven'), care to guess how many groups below level 30 I should hope to find?

TL;DR version: If you build it, I will come. And so will enough people to sustain a new progression server. I mean, we talk about Fippy/Vulak intertwined because the first reboot had so many interested parties, SOE actually had to put up a second progression server to accommodate the first! That's not exactly what I'd call a 'lack of demand'.